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June 23, 2021 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 23 June 2021

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Yvette

Māori Development Minister Willie Jackson isn’t fazed about National leader Judith Collins promising to skip Waitangi in 2021 if she’s not allowed to speak.
“That’d be great if she didn’t go. I think it’s fine if she doesn’t go,” Jackson told reporters on Tuesday on his way into Labour’s caucus meeting at Parliament.
“My personal view is tikanga should evolve. I don’t have a problem with that at all and I don’t have a problem with women speaking on the pae. But we shouldn’t change our tikanga because Judith Collins and Shane Reti are making a complaint about it because Judith knows very little about tikanga.” – Newshub

But – Is it tikanga – or sexism? Every year at Waitangi, the same debate.
Are our female politicians being denied the same speaking rights as men? Or are they being afforded the honour and protection of being child-bearers, as custom dictates?
As this Newsroom question indicates: denying speaking rights to women is supposedly for their own protection.

Pity this protection is not afforded to Willie Jackson, to save him from his own nasty words, as obviously he violates tikanga values – waiora (wellbeing), manaakitanga (care and respect), kaitiakitanga (stewardship/guardianship), and whanaungatanga (relationships and connectedness) – in his comments reported by Newshub, doing more damage to demean and ostracise Judith Collins, than she may likely experience speaking at Waitangi – if she is ever allowed.
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June 23, 2021 8:02am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Time for the taxpayer to stop funding the Waitangi
  National Trust if it can’t guarantee equal rights for all citizens.
  
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  June 23, 2021 8:30am
  - Nigel Kearney
    
    Exactly. A private organisation can be as sexist as they like, whether for cultural reasons or just because they want to. But not if they take taxpayer funding.
    
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    June 23, 2021 8:49am
    - Flossie
      
      I would seriously doubt that. Any organisation or business could be taken to court for sexism.
      
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      June 23, 2021 8:53am
      - Jack5
        
        Will the Woke wimmin at Red Radio and State TV stand up for the right of their sisters, daughters, mothers, to speak in their own country?
        
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        June 23, 2021 10:09am
      - The Real Tony
        
        That’s not Nigel’s point.
        
        He is correct in stating that a private organisation can be as sexist or non-sexist as is their want.
        
        If that cultural norm (for them) runs afoul of any given law, that’s a separate issue to their organisational culture.
        
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        June 23, 2021 10:17am
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        @Jack5
        
        There’s been much silence over this matter by the Women of the Left for all of my lifetime.
        
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        June 23, 2021 10:17am
  - jon
    
    Quite right Maggy. Many of us dont care a rats backside about Waitangi Day!!!
    
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    June 23, 2021 6:28pm
- Surely Knott
  
  Is it tikanga – or sexism? It’s neither. It’s Political. They allowed Jacinda Speaking rights but not Collins. This is political. Nothing to do with Tikanga.
  
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  June 23, 2021 8:31am
  - Thought Criminal
    
    And if its political, then it’s about money. Saint Jacinda and her magic chequebook will be welcomed with open arms.
    
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    June 23, 2021 10:13am
    - david
      
      Thought Criminal,
      You may be correct but I prefer to argue that it is the gas fired barbequed sausages and onions that give her the free pass among the deprived unfortunates who inhabit the Bay of Islands
      
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      June 23, 2021 11:11am
      - Fidel Cashflow
        
        I’m reliably told by sources close to the Prime Minister that, not only do “the gas fired barbequed sausages and onions” give her a “free pass,” but that they also tend to give her a mean case of severe flatulence.
        
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        June 23, 2021 5:27pm
- I remember when
  
  It’s sexism.
  It is possibly aimed more at male Maori maintaining their position than white women.
  Name seven male Maori members of the Labour Government.
  Name one of them who hasn’t reached their ceiling.
  
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  June 23, 2021 12:17pm
- Keith White
  
  @Maggy: I am yet to see any specimen of what I would classify as ‘a woman’ on the left.
  
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  June 23, 2021 12:53pm
- lastmanstanding
  
  Another example where things Maori are out of touch with 21st century life.
  
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  June 23, 2021 1:11pm
JibberJabber

What Did Winston Peters Know About He Puapua?

https://asianinvasion2019.blogspot.com/2021/06/what-did-winston-peters-know-about-he.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+AsianInvasion2019+%28Asian+Invasion+2019%29

There is one argument, a strong one, that had Winston Peters been aware of the content of the report I am sure he would have made hay while the sun shone and picked up a few more votes in only the way Winston Peters can. Therefore Labour have screwed him over harder than is imaginable and he should never trust the brothers again.

But………… the other argument is that it is completely unbelievable that Winston Peters, fishing buddy with the father of the author of the report and Chair of the whole Working Group, did not know what was happening all along.

Either Winston Peters is the dimmest man in New Zealand.

Or this is yet another piss-take, nudge-nudge, conspiracy played along with his behind the scene mates in the Labour Maori caucus. Maori Theatrics at its finest.

Winston Peters I can safely report is not the dimmest man in New Zealand. Far, far from it.

But the silly white voters who are thinking again he’s the second coming of Jesus three times over, sure are if they fall for this one.
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June 23, 2021 8:04am
- KevO'Brien
  
  Winston at least is a Statesman; the PM cannot be said to be much more than a SLG with a propensity to prance, talk and make her Captains Calls.
  
  Winston has aged and other health issues have knocked him out but he still has that driving sense of justice he showed with his opposition to the Wine Box.
  That is more important than his variability. The lack of respect for law is ruining NZ. The PM has assumed regal power. Winston may express opinions we disagree with but he has a fundamental respect for law. Like any other lawyer he may fully seek to take advantage.
  
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  June 23, 2021 8:52am
  - Steve Todd
    
    The PM has assumed regal power.
    
    Muldoon assumed dictatorial power; twice on a minority of votes!
    
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    June 23, 2021 9:13am
    - The Real Tony
      
      As did every PM prior to him.
      
      FPP gave us elected dictatorships at every election – that’s how shit got done. Since MMP, we have had a series of mangerial governments, who trot out the usual “aspiration” bs, but then do pretty much nothing because its all about compromising and not scaring the middle ground voters.
      
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      June 23, 2021 10:22am
      - Sponge
        
        Exactly The Real Tony. MMP has done a great disservice to New Zealand.
        
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        December 23, 2020 10:26am
    - KevO'Brien
      
      Muldoon had to stop a Labour created wage/price spiral and deal with a shortage of foreign exchange. The NZD was fixed at that time and international speculators placed bets against us to profit from the formal devaluation of our currency. The Arabs also tripled the cost of our oil imports overnight. We came very close to not being able to import food.
      
      It wasn’t a pleasant time but the inflation was eventually tamed and our sources of foreign exchanged enlarged setting NZ up for later prosperity and enabling the NZD to be floated.
      
      Without the clamps at the time our future would not have been ours to control. I know of no other country which managed to bring a wage/price under control. I am concerned our inept Min Fin has let one loose again. I won’t blame Ardern as its his duty and reponsibilty to not let such thing happen.
      
      Checked your supermarket prices lately or the cost of building materials? Giving into union demands and overspending continuously may make some people feel happy temporarily but they want more pay when the prices are hiked again. Repeat that for a while then put interest rates up to try to cut back demand to experience the anger from those who can’t pay their rents and mortgages. Basic economics applied without political bias can be helpful to any Government.
      
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      June 23, 2021 10:39am
      - Steve Todd
        
        But as I pointed out to you last Wednesday, here: https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2021/06/32_house_price_inflation.html/comment-page-1#comment-2959036, Muldoon made the wage/price spiral worse. Read the extracts from the two economic historians, Kev.
        
        Muldoon was a bully, acted dictatorially*, and was a disaster as Minister of Finance. That is my memory of him. I have noted over the years a number of Kiwibloggers who at least broadly share my opinion of him.
        
        * The Real Tony @ 10:22AM: As both prime minister and Minister of Finance, Muldoon was in a class of his own. His behaviour while he was in power has resulted, rightly, in no prime minister ever being the Minister of Finance again. Quite simply, he had far too much power, which he misused.
        
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        June 23, 2021 11:11am
      - david
        
        Cold comfort to those who’s sole income is Super and a tiny bit of interest
        (responding to Kevin
        
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        June 23, 2021 11:50am
      - alwyn
        
        I’m afraid your memories of the Muldoon years differ from my own, and from reality.
        Muldoon never tamed inflation. In 1982, after 7 years the inflation rate was still over 15%, or about the same level as it had been since he entered Office.
        The reported rate did then decline but that was only a fiction of the almost total wage and price freeze which he imposed. That was the action of a man who had become totally separated from reality.
        You also suggest that he floated the dollar. He did not. There was a fixed exchange rate throughout his 9 years in power, albeit at various levels.
        The floating of the dollar took place in 1985, under a Lange/Douglas regime.
        Inflation only was brought under control in about 1988 and fully under control in about 1990. That had nothing to do with Muldoon’s actions, or antics as they would be better labelled.
        
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        June 23, 2021 12:16pm
      - KevO'Brien
        
        The timing was a long process. Muldoon set controls in place. Roger Douglas floated the NZD . The country slowly recovered and the “Think Big” projects yielded the much needed foreign exchange assisting NZ for the future.
        Muldoon is remembered for quick decision making. When NZ had no foreign exchange free and the fuel imports rose x 3 times overnight something had to be done in a hurry. That was nearly 50 years ago. Interest rates remained very high and moved around a bit. I got 18% paid quarterly in 1982.
        If Muldoiond didn’t actually stop the wage/price spiral, he set in place the changes to eventually produce that.
        
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        June 23, 2021 12:51pm
      - alwyn
        
        “I got 18% paid quarterly in 1982.”.
        Just out of curiosity I have the following question.
        Did you realise at the time that even with your 18% interest you were actually worth less at the end of the year than you were at the beginning?
        
        If you loaned out $1,000 for a year you would have got $180 in interest. Your marginal tax rate, if you were on an average income was about 50%. You would only be left with $90 so you would have, at the end of the year $1090. Inflation that year was a bit over 15% so this would have a real value of about $975.
        In other words you had less purchasing power at the end of the year than you did at the beginning.
        No wonder Minister’s of Finance like Muldoon didn’t mind inflation being high.
        
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        June 23, 2021 2:06pm
  - Sponge
    
    “Winston may express opinions we disagree with but he has a fundamental respect for law.”
    
    You forgot the /sarc tag there Kev.
    
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    June 23, 2021 9:25am
    - KevO'Brien
      
      Where you there when he was on about the Wine Box?
      
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      June 23, 2021 10:40am
      - Mike
        
        About which he was proved largely correct.
        
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        June 23, 2021 10:50am
      - Tall Man
        
        “The Winebox Inquiry was an inquiry undertaken in New Zealand to investigate claims of corruption and incompetence in the Serious Fraud Office (SFO) and Inland Revenue Department (IRD).”
        
        I was and despite all the paper waving and bullshit emanating from “what’s in it for wynston” the Royal Commission’s report stated …
        
        “The Commissioner was Sir Ronald Davison. The Commission concluded that there were no grounds supporting the allegations of fraud and corruption” so wrong again mikey.
        
        There were also issues regarding tax evasion/avoidance by utilising existing tax laws and these were addressed over the ensuing years but again they found there was more “good” being generated from those tax credits than harm but subsequent legislation tightened the way those credits could be generated and applied.
        
        So effectively, again “what’s in it for wynston” was found to be a liar and that is why he and ardern were well suited to each other.
        
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        June 23, 2021 3:10pm
  - zulumonster
    
    “Winston at least is a Statesman” – sorry, but any words you write after that laughable statement are rendered impossible to believe.
    If you had said something along the lines of “At least Winston is a lying cheating self serving and long term trougher”, people may have taken notice of the rest of your post.
    
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    June 23, 2021 9:30am
- doggone7
  
  Yesterday when Winston was used as the bearer of truth about He Puapua and that was made Ardern a liar, he wasn’t the second coming of Jesus, he was Jesus.
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:04am
  - JibberJabber
    
    Or maybe he’s just a very naughty boy?
    
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    June 23, 2021 9:08am
- Yvette
  
  PLAN UNDERWAY TO IMPLEMENT UNDRIP – Democracy Action July 2019 Newsletter
  … New Zealand First’s leader Winston Peters expressed concerns in 2011 about the signing of the Declaration: “It was a deliberate act by the National Party and the Maori Party. This declaration says that in a dispute over New Zealand laws, some New Zealanders’ rights over-ride the rights of others. And in time, this is going to be written into our laws.”
  
  The Maori did not have democracy. They had a tribal feudal system and now the concept of that feudal system was sneaking into the foundations of a new constitution, Mr Peters said.
  
  “This is the final step on the road to separatism. This is the road to Zimbabwe.”
  
  Despite Mr Peter’s views on the issue, on 5th March this year Government Ministers agreed that the Minister of Maori Development would develop a national plan of action for the implementation of the Declaration. A technical working group has been established and “an engagement process with iwi, hapū and whānau that embodies New Zealand’s best practice under Te Tiriti o Waitangi and the Declaration” will be developed. The group is due to report back in August.
  
  Given the serious implications of the implementation of UNDRIP, and the adoption of an engagement process with iwi, hapū and whānau, but not the wider community, the government needs to hear from us. Please contact the Prime Minister to voice opposition to this initiative. Her email address is: [email protected]. And to Deputy PM Winston Peters [email protected]
  It is also important to send messages to National, NZ First and your own MPs.
  https://www.democracyaction.org.nz/plan_underway_to_implement_undrip
  ________
  Winston’s fishing buddy is Richard Charters, the father of Dr Claire Charters, Chair of He Puapua Working Group, and said to possibly be Winston’s “god-daughter” – Magic Talk
  
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  June 23, 2021 10:07am
Exhumed

I have a niece who is a nurse up in Chch. She was showing me a chart which shows the pay scales for nurses, which is at odds with the chart which seems to be doing the media rounds.

She has been in her particular field for a number of years and gets a large salary. I asked if that was unusual. She said that it wasn’t. She thinks that nurses are paid well. If you aspire to more pay as a nurse you do extra study and extra training, and you move into roles as they become available.

So having seen that chart and listened to a person who is on the frontline, as it were, what are these other facts being portrayed by the media?
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June 23, 2021 8:10am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  From the nurses I’ve spoken to, it’s understaffing that is the real problem.
  
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  June 23, 2021 8:31am
  - Exhumed
    
    That’s what she said.
    
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    June 23, 2021 8:55am
  - MCos
    
    When I was vaccinated for covid-19 a couple of weeks ago I would guess there were twenty nurses administering the vaccine.
    I read somewhere that the MoH was offering top $ to fill vacancies in the vaccine programme, which was causing shortages elsewhere.
    
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    June 23, 2021 9:20am
    - alwyn
      
      “When I was vaccinated for covid-19 a couple of weeks ago”
      What group were you in and where did you get it? I am in my late 70s and have a couple of qualifying problems but I have, in Wellington City been quite unable to get any indication at all about whether I am going to be able to get vaccinated.
      What got you in the fast lane?
      
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      June 23, 2021 9:56am
      - Exhumed
        
        I’m over 80 and I still haven’t had a call up. My Dr. said ‘wrong island, wrong ethnicity, wrong, wrong, wrong.’
        
        I feel comfortable because I’m remote, but I have family who insist on visiting and eating and drinking their inheritance. Some of them live in Wellington, so I’ve emailed them and banned them for a bit.
        
        If you live in a city, I’m thinking of you.
        
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        June 23, 2021 10:05am
      - rangitoto
        
        I received an invitation to book last week via SMS text. I wonder if it is because of my name. I thought it was a scam at first as the web site wasn’t a .govt.nz one but it appears to be a legit site set up by a private company organising the bookings for Waitemata DHB
        
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        June 23, 2021 10:33am
      - rangitoto
        
        PS. The booking web site domain was …nmf.nz
        
        Whois info:
        
        Registrant contact
        Registrant Name HEALTHALLIANCE N.Z. LIMITED
        Registrant Contact Address 585 Great South Road
        Registrant Contact City Auckland
        Registrant Contact Postal Code 1061
        Registrant Contact Country NZ (NEW ZEALAND)
        
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        June 23, 2021 10:40am
      - MCos
        
        I’m in Sth Auckland plus I’m 72. I rang an 0800 # and made an appointment. As it was a lot of people just wandering in off the street.
        Yesterday I walked passed a small centre in Onehunga. (Not Sth Auckland by a few inches) Bloke with a clip board outside said they didn’t turn away anyone if they could fit them in.
        
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        June 23, 2021 10:50am
      - Jack5
        
        While we’re talking vaccination …
        
        Are Covid-19 vaccines from China failing, particularly against new variants of the disease?
        
        The New York Times reports that problems are occurring in at least some of the 90 countries that have been using Chinese vaccines against the pandemic.
        
        It cites Mongolia, Bahrain, and the Seychelles as having surges in Covid-19 despite using Chinese vaccine.
        
        On one hand, Israel, which uses Pfizer and has the second-highest vaccination rate in the world, has about 4.95 new daily confirmed Covid-19 cases per million in Israel of population.
        
        On the other hand, the Seychelles, with the world’s highest Covid-19 vaccination rate, has used mostly Sinopharm vaccine from China. It has more than 716 new daily confirmed cases per million.
        
        The New York Times article says Mongolia has vaccinated 52% of its population with Chinese vaccine. On Sunday, it recorded 2,400 new infections, four times as many as a month before.
        
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        June 23, 2021 11:13am
      - cha
        
        Group 3 in the WDHB. Rang the 0800 on 4/6, had the first on 8/6 and go back on 28/6 for the last.
        
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        June 23, 2021 2:23pm
      - pjams
        
        I know a 16 year old in the Hutt Valley who got a text yesterday from their medical centre inviting them to ring for a vaccine appointment. They have no underlying health problems or any of the other conditions to put them in anything but group 4. Ring your local medical centre and ask why you haven’t been contacted yet.
        
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        June 23, 2021 4:19pm
      - madamezucchininz
        
        “a medical centre somewhere in Christchurch
        
        COVID VACCINATION:
        AT THIS TIME WE HAVE NO ACCESS TO THE COVID VACCINE WITHIN THIS PRACTICE.
        WE UNDERSTAND THAT THERE IS INCREASING MEDIA COVERAGE ABOUT THE COVID VACCINATION ROLLOUT, BUT WE HAVE NO INFORMATION ABOUT WHEN OR HOW THIS WILL BE ORGANISED IN CANTERBURY. WE WILL KEEP THIS WEBSITE UPDATED AS SOON AS WE HAVE MORE INFORMATION
        …no word, text or anything else about when it is our turn……we are over 65 and mother is 86….
        
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        June 23, 2021 5:42pm
  - James Stephenson
    
    Which leads to the inevitable question: If nurses are actually well paid for the job that they do, why is there a shortage of them?
    
    Not enough being trained?
    Too many older nurses retiring and not being replaced by younger ones?
    Pay is actually not ok, especially at the starting levels, so the youngsters are heading overseas to Australia or the UK or wherever?
    
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    June 23, 2021 9:30am
    - Exhumed
      
      Not what the chart show for the nurses at Chch. The figure is roughly 10% higher than that shown in media. The thing that surprised me is that the top end (specialists – surgeons etc) aren’t paid as well as I thought.
      
      Private practice is another story, but District Health Boards, not so much.
      
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      June 23, 2021 10:00am
      - DeepBlue
        
        Specialists work in both private and public practice because they are complementary. Public hospitals create the demand via waiting lists and they provide all the backup for when private surgery becomes complicated and an emergency.
        
        Their public work is like charity work which keeps the private work lucrative.
        
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        June 23, 2021 10:26am
      - Tall Man
        
        “Some” are paid a little more than others but generally that is due to shift requirements and patient load.
        
        My son was recently in a private hospital in Queensland and was treated by 2 ex NZ nurses, one male and the other female .. at least that’s what they identified as. Both had arrived post covid lockdown.
        
        Both claimed that their base rate was at least 20% higher than NZ but with allowance and penal rates averaged approx 40% higher pre tax. Both also said that their daily patient load was under 50% of what they faced in NZ and yes, one was ex Christchurch, and they also faced a minimum of patient abuse compared with a daily dose in Public hospitals in NZ.
        
        “Race” was not a primary consideration in their daily duties although most nurses were aware of other cultures and showed normal human consideration.
        
        They did work in a private hospital but had interacted with others in the publis system in Queensland where conditions were way better than NZ with a much higher earning level and a clearer career path.
        
        Most specialists in NZ public hospitals also have a private arm to their income, unless they are residents in training.
        
        “The average doctor salary in New Zealand varies with the seniority, for example a resident can expect to earn up to $100,000 a year (in a public hospital, approximate salary package). A registrar, though, could earn at least $145,000 a year. If you’re a general practitioner, that rises to $180,000 and a consultant (specialist), $300,000. On top of these generous GP salaries, you can expect up to 10 sick days per year and between four and five weeks’ holidays a year.”
        
        Now I have a couple of GP mates and both earn well over $300K and the specialists I know that do private and public are way over the $300K shown above.
        
        Perhaps if the wages were better then the wait list would be manageable and we would have specialists available in the public health service rather than relying on private referrals.
        
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        June 23, 2021 10:30am
      - Jack5
        
        Could the “academicisation” [for want of the right word] contribute to the problem of nursing numbers?
        
        A few light-years back, nurses were trained in more of an apprenticeship type way. Now they go to a tertiary institution for a few years and run up debt that once might have provided most of the deposit on a modest home.
        
        Is there room for two types of nurses: practical nurses and academic nurses, with a path from the first to the second if wanted?
        
        Similar things have happened in number of occupations. Accounting, and, I think, civil engineering are examples.
        
        Beyond that, supply-demand matching in nursing is complicated because of our falling birthrate. The ratio of young to old is declining, and demand for nursing services comes disproportionately from the old.
        
        Things will level out as population growth flattens.
        
        If the Government wanted to solve that problem they would make housing cheaper with land reforms, tilt the tax system to favour families and children, and even subsidise Mums.
        
        But even if we do nothing, the post-war Baby Boom bulge is about to move into its 80s, ageing of the population will peak, then decline.
        
        Also, birth rates can rise as well as fall. If couples feel they can afford more children, many will have them. However, for New Zealand, this would probably require a political and economic miracle.
        
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        June 23, 2021 12:20pm
      - HeatherW
        
        This is in reply to Jack5 (only see report as option).
        
        “But even if we do nothing, the post-war Baby Boom bulge is about to move into its 80s, ageing of the population will peak, then decline”
        
        Will be a while yet as total births were higher in the early 1960’s. Highest recorded number of births in a calendar year in NZ was 65476 in 1961 (so those turning 60 this year) . Comparison for 2020 live births were under 58000.
        
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        June 23, 2021 1:09pm
      - Jack5
        
        Good point, thank you Heather.
        
        So if we wanted to try to slow over-all ageing of population it might take longer.
        
        Policies to lift the birth-rate might still include land reform to cut housing costs; subsidising child raising; giving economic or other incentives to home mums or home dads.
        
        The Italian fascists’ campaign from 1925 to 1938 to increase the country’s birth rate gave such strategies bad connotations. Ceausescu’s Rumania dirtied the strategy further.
        
        The totalitarians’ idea of population growth as the key to economic growth doesn’t completely differ from the New Zealand policy which led to us having the highest, or second highest, immigration rate in OECD countries. The goal has been to boost economic growth by immigration-driven population growth. Sadly, citizen wealth, measured by GDP per capita, has lagged.
        
        On the other side of the political spectrum, economic star Singapore switched from encouraging low population growth to incentivising higher growth, but so far without spectacular success.
        
        Capitalist Singapore is less democratic than New Zealand, so our Government might have to rely more on incentives.
        
        Singapore’s drive to lift birth-rate:
        
        https://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/fandd/2020/03/lessons-from-singapore-on-raising-fertility-rates-tan.htm
        
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        June 23, 2021 9:11pm
- Fletch
  
  My cousin is friends with a nurse and says many get paid over $30 an hour. The one he knows mostly sits at a desk and writes stuff most of the day. He doesn’t subscribe to campaign supporting more pay for them.
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:47am
  - Tall Man
    
    Do you want your life entrusted to someone earning less than a clerical wage?
    
    What is the average basic grade clerk earning in the Health Department today?
    
    Would you care for 12 patients per day for $240.00 and would your care keep them alive in an emergency?
    
    Would you feel confident correcting a doctor who had just prescribed a lethal dose in error?
    
    Is $30.00 per hour that good a wage today? Do you want the best or just the barely adequate?
    
    Would you undergo “cultural training” courses regularly so you could save lives?
    
    Would you accept regular verbal and physical abuse for $30.00 per hour?
    
    12 2
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    June 23, 2021 11:29am
    - Fletch
      
      TBH. yes. $30 sounds like a good wage.
      
      1 1
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      June 23, 2021 6:23pm
      - Tall Man
        
        Not in my world and the average public servant is paid well more than that.
        
        2 1
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        June 23, 2021 8:46pm
- doggone7
  
  Do we need the charts doing the media rounds?
  
  The New Zealand Nurses Organisation collective agreements. Seem to cover DHBs.
  
  https://www.nzno.org.nz/support/collective_agreements
  
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  June 23, 2021 10:08am
- rockape
  
  Yes but too many want to sit and cruise after their degree. Mrs Roc did 7 years of part time study and is now on $130k plus about another $20k for penal rates working weekends, anti social hours and public holidays.
  
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  June 23, 2021 2:59pm
Maggie Pie

Heard Ash telling Mike this morning that the Sydney Covid traveler to Wellington had been identified.

The real scary thing was, he said….” they’re working on the assumption the parson is infected with the highly transmissible ‘Delta variant’ 🙁 ”

That’s the one first identified in India wasn’t it?
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June 23, 2021 8:10am
- mikenmildagain
  
  The parson might be infected with religious mania…
  
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  June 23, 2021 8:20am
  - alwyn
    
    I think you are being hard done by with all those downticks Mike. That comment is actually pretty funny and deserves better. You get an uptick from me.
    
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    June 23, 2021 9:58am
    - alwyn
      
      I see that I have received 5 downticks just for making a rather mild, but approving, comment about Mike.
      Amazing.
      
      6 6
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      June 23, 2021 2:35pm
- Exhumed
  
  That’s the one, although you are no longer allowed to say the ‘I’ word.
  
  20 2
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  June 23, 2021 8:23am
  - MCos
    
    Say what you like.
    
    5 3
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    June 23, 2021 9:36am
    - Exhumed
      
      My reply was dripping with sarcasm @MCos.
      
      4 3
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      June 23, 2021 11:46am
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    The I word?
    
    Time to cancel John Wayne then.
    
    Shame. Such a good shot, six Indians off their horses from a single shot from behind a covered wagon. Imagine if he had handed his firearm in and the Indians hadn’t . . .
    
    ‘that there were no horses in the Americas prior to Columbus’ arrival in 1492. The Western World concluded that all horses of Native American peoples were, therefore, descendants of horses brought from’
    
    Does that make the Indians guilty of early forms of cultural appropiration and therefore now must also be cancelled?
    
    Answers on a postcard, I am off out for a coffee with a fellow fossil-head climate realist to discuss the latest AMG V8 purchase . . .
    
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    June 23, 2021 9:51am
    - rangitoto
      
      The interesting thing is that horses originally evolved in the Americas and spread to Eurasia. They went extinct in the Americas shortly after the arrival of the “Indians”. ie they were hunted to extinction. A similar event almost occurred to the Eurasian populations but the Botai and Yamnaya although hunting horses, also appear to have domesticated them. Hence all modern horses, both domesticated and feral are descended from those original domesticated populations. The Botai horses though leave no trace in modern domesticated populations, so all domesticated horses are descended from the Yamnaya horses. The Yamnaya also appear to be the first people to use wheeled transport in the form of wagons pulled by horses.
      
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      June 23, 2021 11:01am
    - Tall Man
      
      “to discuss the latest AMG V8 purchase . . .”
      
      I’m now sitting in the corner sulking …… A whiter shade of green!
      
      6 1
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      June 23, 2021 2:57pm
      - Paulus Gnome
        
        No room in the corner TM,
        
        5 0
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        June 23, 2021 6:03pm
- Tauhei Notts
  
  It is sad to see a man of “the cloth” infected.
  
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  June 23, 2021 8:29am
- Yabster
  
  yep its the “Indian” variant….
  
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  June 23, 2021 8:30am
  - Batman
    
    No it’s just the fourth variant of concern. And science works in logic not random country of origin names
    
    The Delta variant was the fourth to be declared a “variant of concern” by the WHO; the others are B.1.1.7, which was first seen in the UK and is now known as the Alpha variant; B.1.351, or Beta, first detected in South Africa; and P.1, first found in Brazil and now called Gamma.
    
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    June 23, 2021 12:02pm
    - lifesgood
      
      Where does the Kappa variant come from? WHO can bleat nonsense all they like, it is the INDIA variant. People have a right to know where these variants come from.
      
      12 1
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      June 23, 2021 12:42pm
    - Keith White
      
      “Science works with logic”. That’s risible in the context of this tricky virus. So tricky it causes all manner of scientists from WHO and CDC to flip and flop and fund and flop sweat all over the place with magnificent oscillating inconsistency; while at the same time, the (PCR) test can get whatever (increase or decrease) case number result you want just by changing its cycle.
      
      Also what evidence is there to credit Ferguson and Hendy with the use of logic? /sarc.
      
      9 1
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      June 23, 2021 12:58pm
- Dougal10
  
  Will the PM and other MPs who have had vaccination shots now test positive when tested , or will they escape back to auckland and self isolate to avoid confusing the sheeple.
  
  27 1
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  June 23, 2021 8:38am
  - Keith White
    
    That will depend on whether the labs told to crank up or crank down the # of testing cycles to get the positive or negative result required.
    
    If the Princess of the Pestilence is in hot political waters, or needs a break, or both, she can be found to be positive with massive upwelling of empathy and stuff (and in Stuff). If a pol needs to be sidelined for mouthing off excessively ditto.Then when they want to travel they can call for a negative test.
    
    “The people who cast the votes don’t decide an election, the people who count the votes do.”
    – Joseph Stalin
    “The people who get tested don’t decide a lockdown, the people who do the tests do.” –
    – Ardern & Bloomfield
    
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    June 23, 2021 1:04pm
- JibberJabber
  
  Actually,
  The correct scientific terminology is super duper extra scary transmissible infectious Delta variant, and it is rilly, rilly bad. ?
  
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  June 23, 2021 8:38am
  - alwyn
    
    So that is what “supercalifragilisticexpialidocious” means.
    I have always wondered.
    
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    June 23, 2021 2:38pm
  - Tall Man
    
    “Four close contacts, who met up with the confirmed case during his trip to Wellington, are currently isolating – but have tested negative for COVID-19.”
    
    Yep, rilly rilly bad ………. but only in India and the media 😉
    
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    June 23, 2021 2:52pm
- Benedict Yu
  
  Yes. The Delta variant is now dominant. It is more contagious (which is why it is dominant) and somewhat more lethal. Eventuality the other variants will die out. And then another variant will come along to out perform the delta variant.
  
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  June 23, 2021 8:39am
  - Cinematic
    
    Interestingly each new variant appears to be more contagious and more lethal. In the msm at least. Last I saw India was more focussed on a cricket match than covid. Go figure.
    
    35 1
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    June 23, 2021 8:49am
    - hookerphil
      
      Two Africans from a very remote region are
      traveling the outside world for the first time, and were visiting England. While there, they are approaching a small village and see two men in white coats walking out to the middle of a large empty field.
      Curious about what these men are doing, they stop to watch. One of the men stops, hammers three sticks into the ground, and puts two small pieces of wood on top. The two men in white coats walk 22 yards down the field, and repeat the process.
      One of them then takes a red ball out of his pocket, tosses it to the other… and it proceeds to rain for five days.
      
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      June 23, 2021 9:04am
      - Captain Mainwaring
        
        Brilliant.
        
        3 0
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        June 23, 2021 3:43pm
      - alwyn
        
        I always liked George Bernard Shaw’s description of the game.
        “The English are not very spiritual people, so they invented cricket to give them some idea of eternity”.
        Have you heard of the last timeless test ever played? It was the fifth test between England and South Africa and was played in 1939 in Durban.
        They ended up playing for 9 days spread over a total of 12 days. At the end of that time they agreed to a draw because otherwise the English team would have missed the boat home.
        The longest test in history and still it was a draw.
        Ah. The glorious trivia of Cricket. Second only to the endless statistics of MLB I should think.
        
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        June 23, 2021 5:41pm
    - kowtow
      
      Eventually our natural immunities will overcome this thing and the kung flu will become like normal flu and we’ll be wondering what the hell the fuss and expense was all about ……
      
      21 7
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      June 23, 2021 9:13am
      - tf78
        
        kowtow – how do we know it’s not the normal flu, we will never know as tests were never done for it. You have to wonder why there isn’t any normal flu all of a sudden.
        
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        June 23, 2021 9:30am
      - Weetbix3ways
        
        Except our natural immunities are being artificially prevented from exposure here in NZ, so are unlikely to develop any such resistance.
        Vaccine immunity is not quite the same thing.
        
        7 2
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        June 23, 2021 11:39am
      - Batman
        
        Kowtow and TF78 – there is plenty of regular flu/bad colds around this year. Multiple people I know have a shocker of a cold at the moment.
        
        4 3
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        June 23, 2021 12:11pm
      - Benedict Yu
        
        The only way “our natural immunities will overcome this thing” will be to become infected. Once about 80 percent of people have become infected, the virus will lose its ability to readily infect people. Or you could be vaccinated. I know what I prefer.
        
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        June 23, 2021 1:05pm
      - Benedict Yu
        
        “Vaccine immunity is not quite the same thing.”
        
        Yes it is the same thing.
        
        4 3
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        June 23, 2021 1:07pm
      - Benedict Yu
        
        “… plenty of regular flu/bad colds around this year.”
        
        Yes as usual people have colds.
        
        What is unusual is that there have been literally zero reported cases of influenza.
        
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        June 23, 2021 1:08pm
      - Benedict Yu
        
        “how do we know it’s not the normal flu[?]”
        
        Because it is a coronavirus. Not an influenza virus.
        
        6 2
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        June 23, 2021 1:10pm
    - Benedict Yu
      
      By necessity all successful new variants will be more contagious. The ones that are less contagious die out.
      
      18 1
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      June 23, 2021 9:46am
  - Nickc2
    
    Yes, the Chinese Govt will release regular updates in the Covid-19 series. The last update being the D1.0 variant.
    
    14 1
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    June 23, 2021 9:16am
- freemark
  
  Yeah the Delta variant…https://thefatemperor.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/06/Delta-or-Indian-Variant-Scariant-Nonsense-Real-World-Proof-Comp.mp4
  
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  June 23, 2021 8:39am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Where was the delta variant, if such exists, manufactured?
    
    16 3
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    June 23, 2021 8:54am
    - Tall Man
      
      In the minds of the media.
      
      2 2
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      June 23, 2021 2:49pm
- Inandout
  
  Maggie, a case of a ‘Delta Dawn’.
  
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  June 23, 2021 8:45am
- Maggie Pie
  
  And if Twitter bestie Siouxsie is worried….we ALL should be!!
  
  https://twitter.com/SiouxsieW/status/1407416137659273220
  
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  June 23, 2021 8:48am
  - Simon
    
    SARS-CoV-2 variants of concern and
    variants under investigation in England
    Technical briefing 16
    18 June 2021
    
    This briefing provides an update on previous briefings up to 11 June 2021
    
    https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/994839/Variants_of_Concern_VOC_Technical_Briefing_16.pdf
    
    Look at Table 4. Ro unvaxxed Delta cases 35,521 deaths 34. (below seasonal flu IFR) Delta cases after the Ro vax 4,087 deaths 26. IFR of .64!
    
    Delta is less harmful than seasonal flu unless you have had the Ro vaxx. With Ro vax its 5 more deadly than the normal Ro IFR of .15.
    
    18 2
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    June 23, 2021 8:58am
  - Surely Knott
    
    Our own gain of function scientist, Siouxsie Wiles give us an insiders assessment of the risks from a virus that appears to have leaked from a gain of function lab experiment.
    
    18 2
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    June 23, 2021 9:06am
- Clyde
  
  According to the list just published, all the contacts this person (parson) might have had were on the 19th June. He flew home on the 21st. What was he doing on the 20th? Or did this day not exist?
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:06am
  - Steve Todd
    
    What was he doing on the 20th?
    
    We should know that by the start of Question Time this afternoon.
    
    12 2
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    June 23, 2021 9:23am
    - sooty
      
      That’s if parliament is sitting today!
      They may have all run away home to isolate!
      
      12 1
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      June 23, 2021 10:24am
      - Nickc2
        
        I believe the Beehive is included in the lockdown zone and if so, what better way to diffuse the opposition when they are on a roll with the He Puapua and electric Utes debacles? Who pulled this stunt?
        
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        June 23, 2021 2:00pm
  - The Real Tony
    
    He had dinner at a local restuarant on the 20th.
    
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    June 23, 2021 12:03pm
- Observer of Life
  
  Some interesting info on the Indian/Delta variant.
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TtOu7jx3snQ
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:23am
  - Fletch
    
    Thanks! Everyone should watch this…
    He basically shows real world data (not modelling, hypothesis etc) showing the level of hospitalization vs the level of infection with the new Delta or Indian variant over a succession of months to current day. It shows that the variant has had no impact.
    
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    June 23, 2021 10:28am
  - rangitoto
    
    Looking at https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/india/
    
    The new cases in India have plummeted over the last two weeks. As far as I know they don’t have a high vaccination rate.
    
    11 2
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    June 23, 2021 11:18am
    - Don Beckett
      
      They rolled out Ivermectin – that what has dramatically slowed the “epi/pan demic”
      
      18 2
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      June 23, 2021 11:33am
      - Tall Man
        
        Others agree.
        
        https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33278625/
        
        4 1
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        June 23, 2021 2:44pm
NoCash

Is our covid luck finally running out?
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June 23, 2021 8:15am
- Brian McDonald
  
  Hopefully not, but at least we know the drill. Welllington shut down first if necessary, probably travel restrictions across the country if necessary. Sounds like the news will break soon.
  
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  June 23, 2021 8:31am
  - nathie
    
    Professor Michael Baker suggests that there is no need to go to those levels (not yet anyway), instead he suggests a “1.5” level i.e. pretty much business as usual without lockdowns but Wellingtonians to take up mask wearing etc.
    
    Without coming across as flippant (and I admit I am no expert) in Australia they are not having exponential cases (24 in NSW yesterday IIRC), we don’t have the over crowding unlike other countries, nor do we have the poor air quality as seen in India affecting people’s breathing … no doubt our MoH is evaluating the situation with their Australian counterparts so I guess let’s just see.
    
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    June 23, 2021 8:48am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Is that a warming from the Fraser House basement crew?
    The Great Reset requires such a lockdown and a govt without mandate and an out of control Captain, calls as she will. (Hopefully for not much longer.)
    
    29 4
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    June 23, 2021 8:57am
    - Steve Todd
      
      […] and a govt without mandate […].
      
      Let’s see now: 50.01% of the Party Vote (65 seats out of 120); and, for the record, 48.07% of the Electorate Vote (46 Electorate seats out of 72).
      
      Sounds like a mandate to me.
      
      9 17
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      June 23, 2021 9:43am
      - Fuzzysnuggleduck
        
        Steve, are you stalking Kevin?
        Seems a pattern to your posting over several GD days.
        
        17 2
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        June 23, 2021 10:12am
      - Steve Todd
        
        Not at all, Fuzzy. Just keeping our resident Muldoon apologist honest — but he just won’t be told.
        
        3 22
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        June 23, 2021 10:27am
      - KevO'Brien
        
        A mandate is where the people agree to govt policies to be put into action.
        This govt has no sense of public responsibility. Cinders cancels Taranaki at will. (Regal?)
        
        An election majority has not previously been a “mandate”. Previously electors expected concrete policies to be put forward and the elected govt to carry them out. This gulliblement of bluster and ideology has no practical concept of the actual nature and responsibility of Govt. It’s all hui, no doi.
        
        The Minister of Finance was a former bookkeeping assistant in a uni cafe. What level of competency does that confer? He has an awful responsibility in the economic management of NZ but I suspect he has failed.
        
        Muldoon at least was professionally qualified and from the lectures I heard from him he was very smart and understanding of the nature of economics, its history and how it affected NZ in its interrelationship with the rest of the world. He understood where NZ was placed and its vulnerabilities. He was also a “softy” and greatly concerned about both NZ as a whole and the pain he had to inflict to fix an out-running economy.
        
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        June 23, 2021 11:07am
      - Steve Todd
        
        Previously electors expected concrete policies to be put forward and the elected govt to carry them out.
        
        That hasn’t been done since the 1987 election (Fourth Labour Government, which acted against its mandate after the 1984 election), which means, according to you, that all governments since then have acted without a mandate, not just the current one.
        
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        June 23, 2021 11:30am
- Inandout
  
  NC, and Jacinda will be on the radio at 1pm. This is such a wonderfuly timed diversion you would think it was planned.
  
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  June 23, 2021 8:47am
  - Brian McDonald
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    Diversion from paranoia would be about it.
    
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    June 23, 2021 9:17am
    - crikey
      
      No, not “diversion from paranoia”, diversion to paranoia.
      
      3 0
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      June 23, 2021 12:56pm
      - Tall Man
        
        Diversion with paranoia methinks.
        
        2 2
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        June 23, 2021 2:41pm
  - Ruawai
    
    Yes just when this Govt is turning into a cluster JA will save us again from Covid.
    
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    June 23, 2021 9:26am
- Simon
  
  Zero Covid NPCs
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:02am
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  Mid winter is the danger time – lack of virus killing UV, higher humidity, and low vitamin D levels (owing to govt incompetence – not pushing people to take supplements in winter even though it is clear it has dramatic benefits both generally and specifically for covid https://c19vitamind.com/) makes spread far faster (as we have seen in northern hemisphere waves). This is the time for maximum vigilance.
  
  And problem is exacerbated by the more highly transmissible Delta variant (though I guess they know whether wellington case is that variant)
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:09am
  - Tall Man
    
    From Newshub
    
    “Four close contacts, who met up with the confirmed case during his trip to Wellington, are currently isolating – but have tested negative for COVID-19.”
    
    Yep, “highly transmissible”………….
    
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    June 23, 2021 2:38pm
- NoCash
  
  Time to stock up on bog paper?
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:38am
  - MCos
    
    We still have some in the spare room from the first lockdown.
    In fact we have all manner of stuff. If I can clear some space and find the pc I’ll work up a searchable inventory.
    
    4 1
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    June 23, 2021 11:04am
  - Tall Man
    
    I’ve been doing that since 2017 … ardern really gives me the shits!
    
    8 1
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    June 23, 2021 2:38pm
mikenmildagain

Happy United Nations Public Service Day!
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June 23, 2021 8:20am
- Tall Man
  
  It would be nice to see a tad of “public service” within the public service, especially the incompetent health department and the Dick tators within MBIE.
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:01am
- Simon
  
  Sexual abuse by UN peacekeepers is shocking and shameful. Why does it persist?
  
  Every year or so, allegations of sexual misconduct by peacekeepers deployed under the United Nations flag ricochet around global media, shocking international audiences.
  
  A few months ago, a report revealed that Burundian peacekeepers deployed in Central African Republic (CAR) have been extensively involved in the sexual exploitation and abuse of women and children.
  
  https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-06-15/united-nations-un-peacekeeping-sexual-exploitation-abuse/12286664
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:03am
  - Mike
    
    We celebrated UN peacekeepers day a while ago. Do try to keep up.
    
    3 13
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    June 23, 2021 10:55am
BAM

How dumb is Chris Penk?

If I was Collins, I’d call it a day and retire, she hasn’t got a hope when there are so many stupid MPs in the National stable.

Do these arsehats ever think before they tweet, post, open their mouths?
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June 23, 2021 8:25am
- Inandout
  
  BAM, if I was a Party leader I would ban all Twitter useage by my MPs. This social media is used by a select few and doesn’t reflect the true feelings of the voters, in fact a person or company can be cancelled by a few hundred Twitterati.
  
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  June 23, 2021 8:51am
  - BAM
    
    Yep, Twitter is leftwing central, utterly pointless to waste your time on it.
    
    My advice would be to have someone that screens everything before it goes out on social media.
    
    MPs randomly chucking stuff up on the internet is always going to cause problems.
    
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    June 23, 2021 10:48am
- nathie
  
  Actually it was a pretty good sledge by Penk and put WinstonFirst in his place bwahahaha (fancy Winnie saying that when one could easily direct such accusations against Labour as they were much worse in terms of victims) … but I get where you are coming from, again National need to tighten up and stop unauthorised SM postings attacking others by their MP’s eg have them cleared by their leader (Collins) first.
  
  If anything it suggests National needs to strengthen their comms unit (or whatever it’s called), just like Labour have.
  
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  June 23, 2021 8:52am
  - Tony Stuart
    
    Spot on Nathie. Penk is a smart cookie, and a rare beast in that he is an MP with a sense of humour. That should be encouraged, not shut down.
    
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    June 23, 2021 9:23am
    - BAM
      
      It’s dumb, it just gave the media another opportunity to regurgitate the same stories again to reinforce to the public that National is a complete basket case.
      
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      June 23, 2021 10:51am
      - Tall Man
        
        Wrong.
        
        While the media may have tried to portray it as that I think it resonated with many both humour wise and accuracy.
        
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        June 23, 2021 2:34pm
- doggone7
  
  She could get a nice sofa for her office and have a little lie down. Unless it gets sent back as one likely was.
  https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/national-mp-parliamentary-service-silent-on-allegations-of-misuse-of-taxpayers-money/XUGZTP6FCZ5MYCBC6PBLJZ6U34/
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:06am
  - Tall Man
    
    You “pay” to read the herald ……. Says more about you than you think.
    
    4 1
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    June 23, 2021 2:40pm
- Simon
  
  “How dumb is Chris Penk?”
  
  National should have bigger fish to fry but at their core they are fucking useless and they know it. This is how they work out their frustrations
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:07am
  - calendar girl
    
    Didn’t realise that such gutter language is now OK in contributions to Kiwiblog (see comment above at 9:07 am). Personally I’m disappointed to see such a deterioration in Kiwiblog’s standards.
    
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    June 23, 2021 12:21pm
    - Tall Man
      
      There are times that the “Queen’s English” just doesn’t cut it and conversation needs a “punch” in the guts.
      
      The frustration that many are feeling about the way our pollies are acting does tend to push one into “punch” territory 😉
      
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      June 23, 2021 2:32pm
- kowtow
  
  I’m beginning to like Penk , and how he ignored the lowlife Media pardy hyenas .
  
  He’s got a sense of humour and hopefully if he’s not a CO2 / Treaty revisionist nutter , he could lead the Gnats out of the wildnerness.
  
  Politics needs disrupters .
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:10am
  - Paulus
    
    Why are the media party worried about Penk ?
    Because the Labour Apparatchiks tell them to muddy anything.
    
    7 0
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    June 23, 2021 2:17pm
- Brian McDonald
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Dumb to reinforce the idea by believing he is countering it. Someone reckons it was WP’s best line ever, not sure about that but it is likely to hang around for the next 2 and a half years.
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:21am
  - Surely Knott
    
    Winston Peters best one liner. That National are sex maniacs? Lol. Who cares. National – Bringing sexy back. Not just a bunch of hotel porn watchers. 😉
    
    40 1
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    June 23, 2021 9:34am
  - David George
    
    “WP’s best line ever”
    Perhaps he should STFU with his 2IC’s propensity for skinning the lizard on the tax payer dime.
    
    24 0
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    June 23, 2021 10:11am
    - Swifty
      
      *and then trying his best to lie his way out of it.
      
      13 0
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      June 23, 2021 10:29am
Tauhei Notts

For all of my life I have been proud to be a New Zealander. Okay, I know; patriotism is the refuge of the scoundrel, but, the first item on Russian Tv news last night was about a country putting a big bloke in their women’s weightlifting team.
That set me thinking. Our Olympic Committee is bringing our country into disrepute.
This from a man who has been proud of his Kiwi heritage in places such as Cork, Perpignan, Wrocslaw, Kiel, Thessaloniki, Nairobi, Bulawayo, Santiago, Los Angeles and Easter Island.
The Olympic Committee have done serious harm to N.Z. sport, but more importantly, to the image of my country.
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June 23, 2021 8:37am
- Benedict Yu
  
  IIRC this ‘woman’ competed as a weight lifter as a man. But was totally average.
  
  I think few people realise the gap between male and female athletes. A typical 16 year old school boy champion athlete would beat women Olympians in any given track and field event. The first time I heard this I was sceptical. Checked the records and it is indeed correct.
  
  If this person wins a gold medal there will be little celebrating in New Zealand. Just stunned embarrassment.
  
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  June 23, 2021 8:47am
  - slernz
    
    I am against Miss Hubbard going to the Olympics to compete against women. But I doubt that she will win gold, or any medal. I think that athletes from Russian, China and East Europe will be better coached, fitter, younger, better techniques and diets than Hubbard. I believe Hubbard will struggle to win a medal.
    
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    June 23, 2021 8:56am
    - kowtow
      
      I hope Hubbard wins gold .
      
      The more spot light on the lunacy of saying that men can be wimmin the better .
      
      37 2
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      June 23, 2021 9:24am
    - BeaB
      
      And better drugs.
      
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      June 23, 2021 11:44am
  - JibberJabber
    
    Would a 43year old woman have a chance of selection where the average of the (female)competitors is 23?
    
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    June 23, 2021 9:05am
  - David Garrett
    
    Benedict: You are more polite than me…and good on …referring to Hubbard as “this person”…for me s/he is nothing more than a freak…a self created freak
    
    38 8
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    June 23, 2021 9:14am
    - Batman
      
      Garrett why be such a nasty prick about someone you don’t know and has never done anything to you?
      
      You should remember that you’re talking about a human being with feelings and emotions.
      
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      June 23, 2021 12:18pm
      - wreck1080
        
        Yep, I don’t get the nastiness. Surprised to hear that from dg.
        
        Surely people are entitled to dress however they like, so long as they don’t harm others in doing so.
        
        Regardless, entering biological males into women’s weightlifting is an outrage against women who deserve to be there.
        
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        June 23, 2021 1:06pm
      - Nickc2
        
        The same sentiments don’t stop you from taking the piss out of people you don’t know do they Batman?
        
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        June 23, 2021 1:47pm
      - Tall Man
        
        Like many he is outraged.
        
        hubbard is gaming the system and the name suppression game was also a rort which was thankfully overturned by the high court.
        
        hubbard also escaped conviction for causing a serious accident that caused painfully and lingering injuries because a conviction would interefer with “training”.
        
        How much training is required for a bloke to beat a woman in weightlifting.
        
        Talking about nasty, yes it was a tad, something many on here are guilty of but it’s also nasty to rob a legitimate competitor of a chance at Olympic glory in my opinion.
        
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        June 23, 2021 2:27pm
    - cmm
      
      I have no problems with Hubbard identifying as anything, but it is ridiculous to then allow a person to compete according to how they feel about themselves.
      
      Where do you draw the line? Can I identify as a 12 year old female and score a bunch on medals intended for 12 year old females?
      
      In the strength sports boys wup women. 15 year old male shotputters would beat Val Adams – so much so that the men use a far larger shot than the youth/women shot and still throw much further.
      
      The men’s shot is 7.26 kg – women/youth is 4kg., so almost 2:1 Olympic men throw further (yes even further than those East German “lasses” of the 1980s).
      
      So if we are going to have categories for women to give them a chance to compete for medals then leave it for the women.
      
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      June 23, 2021 3:02pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    I know some folks are serious about their sport, but honestly, by 43 years of age, shouldn’t you have started exploring a few other ventures like having a life.
    
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    June 23, 2021 9:28am
    - David Garrett
      
      [don’t abuse your posting privileges. We ruled this as grossly offensive – Mods]
      
      16 3
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      December 23, 2020 10:10am
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        “exploring other avenues”
        
        That’s the trouble with us working class folks…
        we consider that sort of stuff as extra-curricular,
        
        still doesn’t tell us anything about whether the person can do anything useful.
        
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        June 23, 2021 10:25am
      - sooty
        
        Hey, if daddy’s got the money he can do whatever he wants. As long as the poor bloody taxpayer is not fronting up for it!
        Personally I think it’s the begining of the end of the Olympics as sports pullout to run their own world championships, under their own rules!
        
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        June 23, 2021 10:35am
      - oldfella
        
        DG, I’d be interested in seeing any footage that may be around of the biologically-male Hubbard during his men’s weightlifting career.
        Be interesting to compare what he was like back then, with what she(?) is today.
        
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        June 23, 2021 11:01am
- kowtow
  
  Agreed , but for the Ivans , of all people , to be outraged about cheating in sports ………
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:06am
- Clyde
  
  But St Jacinda of the Teeth has deemed that she supports this person competing. So there we go. All is OK.
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:07am
- Simon
  
  “The Olympic Committee have done serious harm to N.Z. sport, but more importantly, to the image of my country.”
  
  What has Judith Collins said about this? Cant find anything?
  
  There is a good chance Collins thinks you are a clown.
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:10am
  - Sponge
    
    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2021/06/national-leader-judith-collins-calls-for-honest-conversation-about-transwomen-in-sports-amid-backlash-over-kiwi-weightlifter-laurel-hubbard.html
    
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    June 23, 2021 9:20am
  - Tall Man
    
    Keep up man.
    
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    June 23, 2021 11:18am
- doggone7
  
  It’s really good the Russian paragons want fairness in sport. They are banned from the Olympics but of course being Russia and with all the political and commercial imperatives, the ban is a Mickey Mouse gutless effort.
  
  I guess rules are rules and that’s how Hubbard gets to take part. And Russians.
  
  Maybe all those upset about the situation will wipe the Olympics off their agendas and involve themselves in worlds of less hypocrisy.
  
  The
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:17am
- Yvette
  
  Among those who may have competed against Laurel Hubbard, but will not, is Russia’s Tatiana Kashirina who has been temporarily suspended for a second anti-doping rule violation, evidently taking drugs that enable her body to do something it doesn’t do naturally
  What then of any medication or medical intervention Hubbard has had?
  
  And how many women who have transitioned to men compete at the Olympics? Any?
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:21am
  - JibberJabber
    
    Apparently, Stikadictomies don’t have any inherent advantages with transmale athletes…
    
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    June 23, 2021 9:51am
  - MCos
    
    Tamara Press who was a Russian woman shot putter in the sixties retired when drug testing came along that would have shown just that.
    Interestingly she then went on to a life in academia and died only in the last year or so.
    Her and her sister came out to NZ c1966 and competed in some meets around the country. I took their photo at Lancaster Park.
    They both won Olympic medals I believe.
    
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    June 23, 2021 11:17am
    - alwyn
      
      The Press sisters didn’t retire because they brought in drug testing They retired when gender tests were introduced.
      They were pretty good athletes. Tamara won gold in the shot put in 1960 and 1964 and silver and then gold in the discus in the same years.
      Irina won gold in the 80 m hurdles in 1960 and in the Pentathlon in 1964. They were both widely regarded as being men.
      
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      June 23, 2021 12:48pm
- alex Masterley
  
  The selection of Laurel Hubbard is a complete embarrasment to this country.
  It is being picked up accross the ditch and in the UK. Many are not impressed.
  
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  June 23, 2021 10:04am
  - Batman
    
    Yes, conservative Murdoch media in Aus, UK and USA are picking it up and using it as today’s episode of fear porn.
    
    I think Hubbard will probably achieve the traditional result for NZ athletes, a lucky bronze after an average performance in the middle of the competition.
    
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    June 23, 2021 12:38pm
    - Frank the tank
      
      So Wuflu hysteria isn’t fear porn but legitimate questions about a transgender athlete is?
      
      I hope she wins gold to highlight the sham that this is.
      
      9 1
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      June 23, 2021 1:33pm
      - Batman
        
        One is science based and the other is silly culture war bait to get a shrinking segment of voters mad and in favour of taking away democracy from wrong thinkers.
        
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        June 23, 2021 1:52pm
    - Cobolt24
      
      ‘fear porn’
      Nobody is scared of these athletes, it’s just that there is a (legitimate) concern they may have an unfair advantage.
      
      6 1
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      June 23, 2021 6:25pm
      - Batman
        
        Perhaps I was too brief.
        
        It is fear porn as part of the wider culture war being stoked by US conservatism. It’s another brick in the wall of “the radical liberals are coming to take your guns, your religion, sports, change the way things are, and make everyone androgynous.”
        
        Also, I would bet money that Laurel Hubbard is stronger than 99% of KB commenters, including myself. So maybe in the right circumstances we should be scared?
        
        I am on the fence about trans people in sport for reasons of fairness but the pathetic politicisation of it, along with the disgusting insults and name calling, really leaves a bad taste.
        
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        June 23, 2021 6:34pm
  - curry4me
    
    alex Masterly: It’s been picked up in the USA too.
    
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    June 23, 2021 5:13pm
- Than
  
  My question is, why is she even bothering?
  
  Imagine she wins. OK, she’s got a shiny gold medal. But the question mark over whether she earned it legitimately will be huge. A large chunk of the population will not consider it a genuine win. Instead of the widespread respect and admiration normally granted Olympians, she’ll have equal numbers of people who admire her and those who think she’s a despicable cheat.
  
  Given that reality, what is the point?
  
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  June 23, 2021 10:04am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    I keep wondering if she is an example of a poor little rich girl.
    
    Her behaviour requesting name suppression seems less than impressive.
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/114218682/victims-of-laurel-hubbard-crash-appalled-at-sentence-and-suppression
    
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    June 23, 2021 10:15am
    - Observer of Life
      
      Did not know this “Laurel Hubbard, who is the daughter of cereal magnate Dick Hubbard…”
      
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      June 23, 2021 11:30am
  - Scooter
    
    https://images.app.goo.gl/Aef4SsUiBg9B3tH96
    
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    June 23, 2021 10:51pm
- Gravelroad
  
  The thing is Tauhei Notts, according to the woman who is head of the NZ Olympics Committee (on TV news last night), Hubbard meets the current criteria and qualification standards needed to compete at the Olympics and therefore has been selected.
  I imagine that whatever results at the Olympics Hubbard achieves, those criteria and standards will be quickly reviewed and altered after the event.
  
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  June 23, 2021 10:36am
Maggie Pie

TRENDING….

This young woman’s Olympic dreams have been shattered!

Nini Maru, the 21 year old FEMALE weightlifter says her medal hopes were dashed after she was displaced by the 45yo TRANSGENDER Laurel Hubbard 🙁

https://twitter.com/FondOfBeetles/status/1406992665644830725
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June 23, 2021 8:43am
JibberJabber

Has Arden ~~scarpered from~~left Wellington yet?
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June 23, 2021 8:45am
- Frank the tank
  
  All animals are equal but some are more equal than others – watch the entitled pricks scarper if there is a lockdown
  
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  June 23, 2021 8:55am
- alex Masterley
  
  As one of my colleagues in the office says “Run away, run away”.
  You can almost hear the thundering herd heading towards Rongotai. Hopefully the Koru lounge catering will be on alert.
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:02am
Flossie

I agree with you TN. Sure Hubbard has rights, but the rest of us also have the right not to be internationally ridiculed.
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June 23, 2021 8:47am
Homas

Fascinating article in Stuff today about the potential impact of the Sexual Violence (read, “the death of natural justice”) Bill on Maori men.

It would be interesting to see if anyone would get away with their limbs intact if they made the same eminently reasonable argument about the risk to men in general.
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June 23, 2021 8:47am
- kowtow
  
  The risk in this is how it seems to want to upset such a long standing judicial principle of the right to silence .
  
  All in the name of the gender culture wars .
  
  This is a very big deal .
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:40am
Tony Stuart

So, Ashley Bloomfield is considering putting Wellington into lockdown later today.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/125529986/live-wellington-could-face-lockdown-after-covid19-exposure

Does the fact that Bloomfield is even considering recommending this to the PM and Hipkins, when there hasn’t been a single positive Covid test reported in the community, suggest that he knows more than he’s currently letting on?
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June 23, 2021 8:47am
- 70andstilllearning
  
  Tony – been scanning that link for the last 1/2 hr. Stuff changed the header in the last 10 min to make it more “scary”.
  Complete muppets!
  
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  June 23, 2021 8:53am
- Cinematic
  
  No it doesn’t. It simply reinforces the fact that Doomfield is completely obsessed with Covid at the expense of all else.
  
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  June 23, 2021 8:53am
- KevO'Brien
  
  What evidence that the testing is not a false positive?
  It can produce results to order. Even the WHO says all the previous tests needed to be repeated. The science and propaganda/politics are out of sync.
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:02am
- MCos
  
  There was a single case over the weekend. The fact it was detected elsewhere is beside the point.
  As most people comprehend by now the best way to contain an outbreak is nip it in the bud rather than wait to see what happens.
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:06am
  - 70andstilllearning
    
    Seen the initial list of places of interest MCos?
    Unichem Saturday morning, followed by high density indoor contact places ’till midnight. Put it together. That bud has well and truly bloomed.
    
    17 2
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    June 23, 2021 9:19am
Suze Wainwright

I had no idea that Political Science was such a versatile, all encompassing discipline to equip one for the modern world. Many practitioners seem to be expert in the field of climate science too.

(Thinking about people like Peter Christoff & Robyn Eckersley in Aus and even our very own Rod Donald (although I think he’s an Aussie too))
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June 23, 2021 8:49am
Frank the tank

If you really want an example of how journalism in (little) Aotearoa is rooted exhibit a). of the feckless was on show last night.

The real story was less than $1m of the $2B for mental health has been spent. THIS IS A SCANDAL OF THE HIGHEST ORDER!!!!!!

Yet a twatter post from a backbench MP was bigger news.

This was on FakeNewsHub. Heavens only knows what political garbage OneWokeNews was peddling…….

And some on here moan I use derogatory nicknames for MPs when this is the standard of governance that is set by these Muppets.

Only in (little) Aotearoa…….
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June 23, 2021 8:53am
- Ruawai
  
  It is gold that Little is investigating why his own team hasn’t dished out the money, he may need to look a bit closer and ask himself why he hasn’t dished out the money, he is the one in charge!
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:31am
  - Yabster
    
    Yep and not one of the gutless media asked that very question- “As the Minister are you not responsible to oversee the budget”?- so (as labour loves) we will get an ‘independant” review which shld be pointing the finger back at the the incompetent minstry and the incompetent minster Mr Angry.
    
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    June 23, 2021 9:46am
    - lifesgood
      
      Mike Hosking did.
      
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      June 23, 2021 12:55pm
  - Bobba Fret
    
    He will probably say much of this was under David Clark’s watch.
    
    17 0
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    June 23, 2021 10:13am
    - Paulus
      
      Like Pike River was under his Union watch !
      
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      June 23, 2021 2:23pm
Fisiani2

We are only at risk of a lockdown because so few people have been vaccinated. (Just 10%) I posted earlier about having a mass vaccination programme as carried out in other countries. We were supposed to be at the front of the queue for vaccines and not for the virus. We are at risk – I blame the government
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June 23, 2021 8:57am
- Maggie Pie
  
  I see where Phillipine’s President Duterte is threatening all the anti-vaxers who refuse to be vaccinated….. that he will inject them with Pigs blood.
  
  LOL!!
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:04am
- Cinematic
  
  Yes, the lockdown approaches overall success was heavily dependent on rapid mass vaccination at the earliest opportunity. To that end the current government has failed abysmally.
  
  But here’s my guess. There will be little/no spread. Covid and NZ don’t seem to get along.
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:10am
  - kowtow
    
    ‘There will be little/no spread.’
    
    Ah so .
    
    But we’ve been told that the ahem delta variant is so spready that you need only walk past someone to get it .
    
    That means both planeloads and half of Wellington should be coming down with it .
    
    Or not .
    
    ( I’m with you on this , and reckon it won’t be too bad and all the scaremongering over this variant is just that)
    
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    June 23, 2021 9:37am
    - Tall Man
      
      An infected person flew from Dubai, a minimum of 17 hours stuck on a plane. One stewardess has now tested positive …….. in Brisbane.
      
      Yep, really scary variant, nearly as contagious as a cold.
      
      19 1
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      June 23, 2021 10:48am
  - Brian McDonald
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    Or dependent on not opening the borders, easy to see which was easier – also where the pressure was.
    
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    June 23, 2021 9:37am
    - Suze Wainwright
      
      Yep, Jacinda is just so terribly bullied by those nasty National/ACT meanies, aye?
      
      24 1
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      June 23, 2021 9:54am
      - KevO'Brien
        
        Jacinda put herself in that position seeking to be Queen of NZ. Feelings and ideology are not sufficient for Government. That role requires executive ability not all hui, no doi.
        We hear of 1.9 billion being spent on producing 5 new mental health beds. That is the equivalent of over 2,000 state houses. This is ineptitude and a fraud on the taxpayers.
        Jacinda and her Govt should resign as they are hopelessly out of their depth in matters of executive management.
        
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        June 23, 2021 11:20am
    - Brian McDonald
      
      Do you wake up and think about all the things you’ve f’d up Garrett and so need to remain hiding out west?
      
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      June 23, 2021 10:27am
    - David Garrett
      
      So, in your psychopathic mind, TWO killings are just “things I fucked up”…that’s very revealing..
      
      And I’m not “hiding” on my little slice of heaven in Kaukapakapa Brian…you know exactly where I live…I’ve told you often enough
      
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      June 23, 2021 10:46am
    - Tall Man
      
      Better to be “fucked up” than dead dontcha think?
      
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      June 23, 2021 10:46am
- Inandout
  
  Fisi, I believe Jacinda has been ‘future proofed’ in some marae so we can all rest in peace. On a more serious note, two people I know have terminal cancer and will not see the next summer.
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:10am
- Fuzzysnuggleduck
  
  Yep, vaccination is the only end game (and not an end game at that) and yet the slow pace is spun as “making sure we don’t run out of vaccines in stock: (like they are more useful in storage, than in people’s arms) …..and the real dozy was claiming NZers would not accept us getting vaccinated sooner than other countries with worse outbreaks : (Be Kind, think globally!).
  At the same time, despite our low OECD ranking, we are >100% of ‘target’ too.
  
  NZ is always at risk of a community outbreak, like any other country.
  The last 2 genuine community outbreaks, in Papatoetoe, have never has an adequate explanation as to how it crossed the border (!) – other than the odd assertion by Cindy that it was not of a genome type seen in MIQ (which raises questions about how much genome sequencing is done, or whether there is a virus repository or entry method we dont know about).
  
  Clutch your teddy bear tight. Use the tracer app, and offer up a fatted calf to the podium of truth.
  
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  June 23, 2021 10:31am
  - krazykiwi
    
    “vaccination is the only end game”
    
    If you believe this then I’m afraid you’ve taken the the bait — hook, line and sinker.
    
    6 1
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    June 23, 2021 1:20pm
lastmanstanding

I find it interesting that as the CCP under Xi has moved to a more authoritarian regime Western so called democracies have moved away from the hallmarks of democracy freedom of speech and thought freedom of association freedom from the Government and its agencies poking their noses into law abiding indiviuals lives.
I say the Western democracies expecially ours are on their way to a future that most of their citizens dont know understand or want.
A combination of the Kardashian Kult in the case of Cindy citizens being too busy getting on with their everyday lives Governments knowing this and taking advantage have led us to a place that my grandfather and father who fought for 9 years collectively for freedom would be appalled at.

What the regimes they fought and defeated tried to impose is now being imposed by freely elected Governments using cunning to achieve.

I say in a decade the Sheeple will wake up all too late and find themselves ruled by an authoritarian Government and there will be nothing short of bloody revolution they can do to stop it.

I say in 10 years a post like this will see me at best confined for the rest of my life or worse.
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June 23, 2021 9:16am
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  We have failed to provide our kids the education they need to prevent the slide into darkness – for a generation education has been overrun by far left pushing their malignant viewpoints and airbrushing out all evidence of its dangers and failings.
  
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  June 23, 2021 10:27am
Maggie Pie

Laurel breaks silence and tells waiting media….

Her boyhood dream was to make the cover of ‘Sports Illustrated’

https://twitter.com/SI_Swimsuit/header_photo
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June 23, 2021 9:17am
- Suze Wainwright
  
  Is that why they sometimes say, if a man really wants something, he’ll give his left testicle for it?
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:48am
  - David Garrett
    
    Suze:…Yes…I have always wondered why it is the LEFT ball that is so valued…I personally am equally fond of both of mine…
    
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    June 23, 2021 10:04am
    - Fletch
      
      “Always two there are.” – Yoda
      
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      June 23, 2021 10:47am
  - JibberJabber
    
    Maybe a Mr. Hitler and a Mr. Goebbels could shed some light on this conundrum?
    
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    June 23, 2021 12:34pm
- Sacha
  
  Is that Megan Markle on the right?
  Oh Harry!
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:53am
- Tall Man
  
  Hmmm
  
  https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2019/05/from-burkini-to-obesity-sports-illustrated-swimsuit-features-morbidly-obese-bikini-model/
  
  https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/CFMAAOSwYrZePL13/s-l300.jpg
  
  And finally, laurel’s big moment …..
  
  https://i.imgflip.com/zsf4t.jpg
  
  sans boobies of course!
  
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  June 23, 2021 10:43am
- Observer of Life
  
  MP: ???
  
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  June 23, 2021 11:37am
kowtow

Bit of a worry .

I always thought it was guilt or innocence that decided whether you “done it” .

Yet here’s an item by someone in the Auckland Law Society that spells it out very baldly.

“Generally, the more money you spend on high-priced lawyers, investigators and experts, the more likely you are to get off. ”

https://www.stuff.co.nz/opinion/125519738/sexual-violence-bill-could-see-more-innocent-mori-face-jail
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June 23, 2021 9:20am
- David Garrett
  
  Kowtow: Really? You are generally one of the more “on to it” commenters here…which makes it all the more surprising that you didn’t know that legal services are a “market” like any other: and the best quality providers of legal services are able to charge the most…and of course “best quality” when it comes to the criminal law is how many guilty men get acquitted because their guy is better than the other guy
  
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  June 23, 2021 10:01am
  - kowtow
    
    I should have put in the sarc thingeys .
    
    But in all honesty for someone from the Bar association to be openly pointing out that yes it is a market is a bit of a shocker .
    
    Afterall we’re all meant to pretend that Lady Justice wears that blindfold for a reason.
    
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    June 23, 2021 11:22am
    - chukar
      
      Justice is only for those who can afford it. The making and enforcing of regulation and law costs hugely.
      Law was meant also to protect the individual against a rampant state.
      Runnymede Magna Carta and all that.
      But now, it does not!
      
      Cost has made redress impossible for most and the very few who can afford legal challenges are secure in the knowledge the state can and will change any law that they wish.
      There is no effective NZ bill of rights or other constitution for relief.
      
      Parliament is supreme
      
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      June 23, 2021 1:01pm
      - Paulus
        
        And 52% of the voters says so !
        She can still do whatsoever she wants, as we see regularly.
        
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        June 23, 2021 2:27pm
- Brian McDonald
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  You didn’t comment on the article’s point that research in the states, applicable here, points to 11% of prisoners being innocent on DNA evidence. The estimate years ago (in the Roper report from memory) was far lower than that.
  Major problems in the Lundy and Watson cases with DNA as it was in Pora, Bain and the man (forget his name) that Donna Chisholm helped free.
  
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  June 23, 2021 10:08am
  - Brian McDonald
    
    More front than you wee Davie and not kicked out of Parliament, Tonga, the Law Society, or 2 marriages. But keep trying to score a trougher’s position.
    
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    June 23, 2021 10:40am
    - David Garrett
      
      Quite apart from most of the above being quite wrong (I resigned from parliament; I still have a practicing cert both here and in Tonga, and until Covid went up there often to do trials) I would sure as hell prefer having my record on my conscience than yours…but then as a psychopath the concept of having a conscience is unknown to you …as you have just unwittingly demonstrated, describing killing people as “fuck ups”
      ,
      
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      June 23, 2021 10:52am
  - Tall Man
    
    “that research in the states, applicable here, points to 11% of prisoners being innocent on DNA evidence.”
    
    Utter rubbish. Entirely different legal system and population makeup plus DNA alone doesn’t “convict” that many here.
    
    Stop punting the “poor crim” crap.
    
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    June 23, 2021 2:21pm
Ruawai

Ute fee not at tax. Interesting definition by Jacinda Ardern yesterday in parliament question time from Judith Collins question when asked why the Petrol/diesel fee is not a tax. Ardern said it is not a tax as it is optional as you can choose not to buy an illegitimate ute. Strange how other such taxes are called taxes not fees for example, cigarette and alcohol taxes, you can choose not to smoke or drink but if you do you will pay a tax, same as illegitimate utes, you can choose not to buy one but if you do you will pay a tax. Also if you want a bit of humour watch question 2 by David Seymour from yesterdays question time. He asks Jacinda if she has driven an electric Toyota ute and if not why not? and also if he will be able to drive a legitimate ute on the new bike bridge.
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June 23, 2021 9:40am
- Matt Long
  
  Therefore GST is not a tax as we can choose to go overseas to buy stuff?
  
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  June 23, 2021 12:36pm
  - DeepBlue
    
    Or not buy, say a more expensive car
    
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    June 23, 2021 1:41pm
  - Ruawai
    
    True that Matt.
    
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    June 23, 2021 1:45pm
- Surely Knott
  
  Is Income Tax a tax? You can chose not to work?
  
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  June 23, 2021 3:03pm
Fisiani2

Jack Hackett’s bar will be closed today says Stuff yet at 7am this morning the basement was shoulder to shoulder packed with football fans Of England and Scotland . Horse, Bolt, Stable. You get it.
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June 23, 2021 9:42am
Maggie Pie

TWITTER TRENDING…..

Californian man wearing silly scarf arrested for shooting of Police Officer

WATCH:

https://twitter.com/pine_tree_riots/status/1407447337690185728
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June 23, 2021 9:47am
I remember when

Have spent some time in the South Island and visited the Pahau river which in November, 2017, was called NZ’s most improved river.
It flows through one of the most irrigated catchments in the country. An area considered the most productive dairy land in New Zealand.
The Pahau Enhancement Group achieved E coli reductions of 15.6% per annum over 10 years, by using more precise irrigation and better management practices.
I walked along the side of the river and the water is crystal clear with no excessive algal growth.
Although I only observed a small distance of the riparian strip, which extended for about fifteen metres, in the area I looked at it was heavily infested with noxious weeds such as blackberry, broom, and some hemlock.
It is heavily overgrown and treated as low care and natural regression.
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June 23, 2021 9:48am
- hookerphil
  
  Interestingly when the Amuri Plains Irrigation Scheme opened in 1980 with mainly border dykes at that stage the Culverden Township Water Supply which drew its water from a deep bore became seriously polluted within about 3 years.
  
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  June 23, 2021 10:23am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  We don’t have noxious weeds anymore…
  The Noxious Weed Act was superseded by the Biosecurity Act and each Regional Council has to prepare its ‘Pest” weed list.
  
  Environment Canterbury has broom (3 species) on its sustained control programme.
  https://www.ecan.govt.nz/your-region/your-environment/our-natural-environment/pest-management/plant-pests/
  
  Blackberry and hemlock don’t figure on their plant pest lists at all.
  (apart from being poisonous hemlock isn’t really an environmental problem – blackberry is a problem at open sites where native shrub species could establish),
  
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  June 23, 2021 10:36am
- I remember when
  
  Oops I forgot about the old man’s beard.
  Don’t know if the spot I visited was representative but it was rife.
  Right to the top of some of the willow trees and right through the riparian strip. Prolific!
  Because of the overgrown nature of the undergrowth it will not be easy to remove.
  
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  June 23, 2021 12:04pm
- Matt Long
  
  Weed infestation is just one of the downsides of Fish and Games successful anti dairy campaign.
  Is it negatively effecting access to fishing I wonder?
  
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  June 23, 2021 12:43pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Is it negatively effecting access to fishing I wonder
    
    Not much fun pushing through tens of metres of blackberry.
    
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    June 23, 2021 1:22pm
  - Paulus
    
    Fish and Game are really only a Branch of Greenpeace anyway.
    
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    June 23, 2021 2:30pm
- Tauhei Notts
  
  Allan Hubbard of South Canterbury Finance fame was one of the first investors to realise the value of Pahau River land for dairying. He bought big there.
  
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  June 23, 2021 6:08pm
surfing

People who call themselves “Fat but fit” are wrong….

https://www.studyfinds.org/fat-but-fit-metabolically-healthy-myth/

Fatties better go lo-carb and hit that treadmill.
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June 23, 2021 10:21am
Sponge

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300339973/former-national-leader-todd-muller-retiring-at-next-election-cites-health-concerns

He should have bloody well retired at the LAST election.

What a prick.
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June 23, 2021 10:24am
- Bobba Fret
  
  He may as well go now and let the new person in there to work the electorate.
  
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  June 23, 2021 10:47am
  - BAM
    
    Todd is only interested in what’s best for Todd.
    The man has no shame at all.
    
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    June 23, 2021 10:55am
    - Tall Man
      
      Unlike all the other pollies …….
      
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      June 23, 2021 11:22am
    - Paulus
      
      Best for his family too, as he is on leave as his wife has just had a serious medical operation, and with young children has the need to keep the family more focused for a while.
      
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      June 23, 2021 2:32pm
  - oldfella
    
    If he went now it would mean a bye-election. Not sure the Nats would want that with their current state of (apparent) disarray.
    
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    June 23, 2021 11:35am
    - Bobba Fret
      
      Good point. Thanks for that.
      
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      June 23, 2021 12:35pm
    - Tony Stuart
      
      Correct. Also, by signalling his intention to retire now, rather than a year out from the 2023 election, the party members and executive in the BoP electorate can start their search for a replacement, and ensure that a quality candidate is selected. Bay of Plenty is a safe National seat, and the successful candidate can look forward to a long tenure.
      
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      June 23, 2021 2:13pm
      - Tall Man
        
        “and ensure that a quality candidate is selected.”
        
        Like jamie-lee ross you mean?
        
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        June 23, 2021 6:58pm
      - cha
        
        and ensure that a quality candidate is selected
        
        You lot knew full well Harete was a pompous, self-serving flake yet you still selected her.
        
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        June 23, 2021 7:55pm
- Sponge
  
  I should add that I have great sympathy for his metal health issues.
  
  Once he knew he was not up to the job he should have immediately resigned and freed up a spot for some new blood though.
  
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  June 23, 2021 11:12am
  - BAM
    
    His ego got ahead of his ability and he was found wanting, he couldn’t cope with that and he fell to bits.
    
    Sure, he’s probably not coping with the fact he’s not as magnificent as he thought he was, but I really do struggle with the whole mentally unwell thing he says he’s suffering from.
    
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    June 23, 2021 11:44am
    - Batman
      
      What the hell is your problem? You just sound like a dickhead.
      
      There’s nothing wrong with him serving the full term as local MP and giving early notice that he won’t stand again.
      
      Well done Todd.
      
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      June 23, 2021 1:02pm
      - Maggie Pie
        
        You might well ask…..”why the moderators on Kiwiblog let this poster continuously post such hateful drivel”?
        
        Just saying.
        
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        June 23, 2021 1:35pm
      - Batman
        
        Well they allow your drivel Maggie ??
        
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        June 23, 2021 1:54pm
      - Maggie Pie
        
        https://i.imgflip.com/45mg4i.jpg
        
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        June 23, 2021 2:11pm
- artemisia
  
  Looking at that leadership spill from the outside, seemed like Mr Muller was buoyed up by a battering of positive reinforcement by fellow MPs and probably party members unhappy about polling. All behind closed doors, no wet blankets permitted.
  
  Add in ambition and it becomes quite hard to apply critical thinking in such a situation.
  
  Still, we do expect more of a potential leader of a country.
  
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  June 23, 2021 1:01pm
  - tf78
    
    How much did Mathew Hooton have to do with his selection? Simon was doing really well until then. Polly’s forget they are there to represent US not their egos.
    
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    June 23, 2021 8:55pm
- rockape
  
  He won’t be the last by a long way. My bet is a few seniors will go. Mark Mitchell should be the top of the list for loose talk. I think Judith will go and be replaced by Bridges, that move will start an exodus by all those who undermined Bridges. The next 15 months will be interesting I feel a huge clear out coming. It’s needed but it won’t help for 2023.
  
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  June 23, 2021 3:07pm
  - Tall Man
    
    I think you may be right about the resignations but you are wrong about 2023, if ardern lasts that long. A year is a very long time in politics especially with an economy tanking and covid fading and 2 years is a massive ask I think.
    
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    June 23, 2021 6:56pm
- curry4me
  
  Sponge: Good riddance. Better late than never, I guess.
  
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  June 23, 2021 5:33pm
Waipuk

My wife has just come to the realisation she no longer lives in a democracy.
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June 23, 2021 10:29am
Waipuk

Todd Muller to leave parliament at the next election. Hopefully Chris Luxon will join him.
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June 23, 2021 10:33am
- Wired-one
  
  What’s your issue with Luxon? Seems to be a lot on the right having the odd dig at him, why? The left eat their own, we shouldn’t.
  
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  June 23, 2021 11:30am
  - H. Upmann
    
    Luxon = woke & wet.
    
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    June 23, 2021 11:59am
    - Batman
      
      Meanwhile the left call him an extreme fundy Christian who will come for abortion rights and send us back to the 1800s.
      
      Funny how the extremes of each side work.
      
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      June 23, 2021 1:58pm
    - curry4me
      
      H. Upmann: Yes, he’s in the wrong party.
      
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      June 23, 2021 5:34pm
  - Frank the tank
    
    Because he represents the corporate elite and unlike Key comes across smelling of it with the associated smugness.
    
    He Puapua is in Luxon’s wheelhouse. Trust me.
    
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    June 23, 2021 1:38pm
    - Batman
      
      Go vote green or Mana then Frank, you’ll enjoy the anti-capitalism.
      
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      June 23, 2021 1:50pm
      - Frank the tank
        
        Wrong again – when Judith gets rolled by a ‘wet’ there won’t be even in tinge of regret when I vote Act.
        
        The ‘wet’ right are on the wane as they find themselves progressively on the other side of the fence from their base. Your kind are a dying breed my friend (shit I sound like Admiral Tarkin talking to Darth Vader!!!).
        
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        June 23, 2021 2:50pm
- Waipuk
  
  He should be in the Greens Party.
  
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  June 23, 2021 12:32pm
Maggie Pie

DUDGE WATCH…. (courtesy of ODT)

‘In an attack described by the judge as “simply terrifying”, Dunedin man Raniera Tamugene Luigi Makoare, plead guilty to burglary, possessing a knife, willful damage, jumping on the roof of a womans car, smashing the front & rear windows, using a butchers knife to slash her tyres,…..then went through the vehicle stealing her handbags, cellphone and cannabis, while other members of the group dragged the woman out of the window by her hair and stomped on her.

Makoare, (who was already serving a sentence of supervision at the time), was given 8 months Home Detention and 100 hours community service by Judge Emma Smith.

SHEESH!!
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June 23, 2021 10:33am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Sounds like he got a special person’s discount.
  
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  June 23, 2021 10:44am
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Silly third name syndrome?
    
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    June 23, 2021 10:50am
    - Tauhei Notts
      
      Interesting that. There was a Maori at Auckland law school in the late sixties who had that nickname.
      
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      June 23, 2021 6:12pm
- lilman
  
  Racist Justice system,its his country,he shouldnt be forced to spend it in home, probably emergency housing anyway.
  
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  June 23, 2021 11:29am
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dkMlLkCRmRQ

What would happen if Russia collapsed?

Russia has sustained itself through all manner of political stress, but what would happen if it collapsed in the 21st century? [16:34]
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June 23, 2021 10:34am
- cha
  
  What would happen if Russia collapsed?
  
  An almost broke gangster petro state with four times the population and an economy half that of California whose only claim to fame is a nuclear arsenal. Nothing.
  
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  June 23, 2021 7:14pm
curry4me

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9710875/Peter-Daszak-removed-COVID-commission-following-bombshell-conflict-report.html

Wuhan Linked Commissioner Removed.

British scientist Peter Daszak has been removed from the COVID commission looking at the origins of the pandemic after helping secretly denounce the lab leak theory while failing to mention his close ties to the same facility.
The scandal-hit scientist’s departure from the UN-backed Lancet commission into the virus’s origins was revealed on its website.
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June 23, 2021 10:34am
- RiP NZ
  
  Who funded Daszak – to then also be complicit in censoring the Wuhan leak theories?
  
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  June 23, 2021 1:53pm
  - curry4me
    
    RiP NZ: Fauci, and the UN.
    
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    June 23, 2021 5:38pm
- Batman
  
  So you’re saying that the UN-backed Commission has credibility and won’t tolerate that being undermined?
  
  I look forward to you embracing its report.
  
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  June 23, 2021 2:01pm
- tf78
  
  I thought Daszak was part of the “gain of function” brigade.
  
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  June 23, 2021 8:59pm
- ABS4EVA
  
  What Scientist is not linked to Wuhan
  
  Check out Bat Lady and Geelong
  Australia
  
  They are all BAT CRAZY
  
  and they have all being doing dodgy stuff with the
  CCP
  
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  June 24, 2021 1:21am
Maggy Wassilieff

Yet another Green scambo

https://www.stuff.co.nz/environment/climate-news/125508000/carbon-farmers-bought-swathes-of-nz-promising-to-create-native-forests–but-researchers-doubt-it-will-work
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June 23, 2021 10:42am
- Albert_Ross
  
  I’ve read the article carefully and I do not see where the “scam” is supposed to be.
  
  Carpers happy to nitpick at enterprising new approaches from the sidelines, but with no actual constructive suggestions as to what they’d do instead, are ten a penny; but even the ones quoted here don’t seem to be alleging any actual dishonesty.
  
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  June 23, 2021 11:05am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    The scam, Albert, is that native forest may never regenerate under some of these Pine Forests being planted initially to gain C-credit $$$$ for these business chaps.
    
    Now the clues to this are:
    1. The title of the piece…
    2. The key researchers who have promoted the use of Pine as a nurse crop are doubtful that the sites/methods the C-farmers are employing will enhance native regeneration
    3. The C-
    farmers don’t have the funds to guarantee long-term management of their forests (pest/weed control)
    4. The sites they are planting up will now be delayed in regenerating to native forest (by up to 200 years)
    5. Even the Climate Change Commission is against the planting of Pines on regenerating land
    
    and finally, I’ve seen it all before…. Tales of planting pine “protection” forestry to hold back eroding land or create employment .. and then rip-off merchants cut the crop down and make no attempt to replant or manage the mess they’ve created.
    
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    June 23, 2021 11:28am
    - Albert_Ross
      
      What would you rather have them do? Plant pine and not intend to use the funds generated to eventually replace with native forest? Or go straight to the native forest stage with no funds?
      
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      June 23, 2021 11:58am
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        I’d rather there was no Carbon credit scheme.
        
        1. It is just a means of trading off one person’s/business’ emissions without actually decreasing the emissions at source.
        
        2. The problem with the C-farming business being referenced is that there is no guarantee that the C-farmers will manage their forest to stage where it becomes sustainable native forest.
        
        It is clear that the Christchurch scientists reckon these C-Foresters haven’t got a business case for managing their C-Forests long-term.
        They’ll receive funds up-front and for the first 30 or so years as the Pines sequester C… then What?
        Is their business really going to hang around for the next 100-150 years waiting for a biodiverse native forest to arise from the understorey of the maturing Pines?
        
        Because if this developing native forest in 50-60 years time isn’t stock-proofed, weed and pest-free, it’s Carbon capital will degrade.
        (Note how much C is released each day from our native forests when goats, possums, deer are on the munch….
        https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/climate-change-pests-costing-nz-millions-of-tonnes-of-carbon-storage/2YQCQPOOIYB6SVNJLGPGX4YBIU/)
        
        But basically, Albert, I’m basing my scepticism on this project from having been around the forestry and regeneration scene for the last 50 years.
        
        But don’t despair.. if you’re up Gizzy way, you can help me planting up native trees in 40 acres of rank paddocks at the end of my road.
        
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        June 23, 2021 2:48pm
    - Ruawai
      
      Nothing grows under pine forests.
      
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      June 23, 2021 1:43pm
      - jv
        
        Not so.
        
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        June 23, 2021 4:25pm
      - Graeme Hall
        
        There has been quite a bit of work done on the biodiversity of pinus radiata forests in NZ. Native species do establish & eventually will succeed the Pine if left alone.
        
        https://www.scionresearch.com/__data/assets/pdf_file/0008/59588/NZJFS2531995ALLEN301-317.pdf
        
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        June 23, 2021 4:39pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        @Graeme Hall
        
        True..
        
        That paper by Rob Allen refers to one of the first studies undertaken on native regen under pine plantations – by Ross McQueen.
        
        https://newzealandecology.org/nzje/2454.pdf
        
        Ross was my PhD supervisor and supervised at least one Honours student who investigated native regen under pine stands in the Wellington region.
        
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        June 23, 2021 5:21pm
    - jv
      
      All too true Maggy and as with your 2nd post below (which I inadvertently “reported” in absence of a “reply” option.)
      
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      June 23, 2021 4:24pm
  - Dougal10
    
    The scam is some of the forrest’s are in 22 inch rainfall country which means the are economical with the facts and can’t be trusted to tell the truth about anything
    
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    June 23, 2021 1:16pm
Jack5

A well-illustrated Australian take on the South Island’s Alpine Fault, and the big bust that’s coming:

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-06-22/nz-racing-to-be-ready-for-magnitude-8-on-alpine-fault/100134024
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June 23, 2021 10:58am
- kowtow
  
  Only no one is “racing” to be ready .
  
  Lots of money for cycling bridges , “feebates” and all things carbon , sfa for The Big One.
  
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  June 23, 2021 11:15am
- Inandout
  
  Jack, God help us if there is another earthquake while Labour is in power.
  
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  June 23, 2021 12:33pm
103PapPap

Anyone noticed the additional support the Government is givng TV and newspapers by taking out full page ads under the guise of Covid19?
The only words missing are ‘Vote Labour’
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June 23, 2021 10:59am
- Benedict Yu
  
  No I have not noticed. Do they say that vaccinations are on track?
  
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  June 23, 2021 11:24am
Benedict Yu

“At a national level I am very proud of the work I did with James Shaw in creating bi-partisan support for climate action and achieving cross-party support for the Zero Carbon Act.”

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300339973/former-national-leader-todd-muller-retiring-at-next-election-cites-health-concerns

How bloody predictable. The Zero Carbon Act is stupid. It has led to an appalling set of recommdations that are deeply flawed and which would make New Zealand poorer, particularly affecting low and middle income earners.

The key to reducing global emissions is to do it at least cost. This shambles is the exact opposite of ‘least cost’.

Honestly this guy has a lot to answer for.
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June 23, 2021 11:23am
- Inandout
  
  BY, what I can’t understand is why he is hanging on until the next election? Surely he is entitled to some kind of pension for being a leader, albeit for a fleeting moment. This guy can do untold damage in the meantime, especially in the area of party leadership.
  
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  June 23, 2021 12:30pm
wreck1080

First we had disabled parking, then came parents with prams parking, and some places offer elderly parking.

Anyone guess what is being rolled out now? As seen today!!! Probably obvious when you think about recent times.
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June 23, 2021 11:26am
- alloytoo
  
  Online shopping 🙂
  
  3 0
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  June 23, 2021 12:25pm
- wreck1080
  
  Ok, times up.
  
  Maori only parking.
  
  So, if you are not Maori and park in a spot reserved for a Maori, could get an infringement or towed.
  
  As seen at Tauranga hospital, but these ideas catch on to other places.
  
  Not sure about the logistics of proving one to be Maori… is there some king of ID card that maoris can apply for? Like a disabled permit?
  
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  June 23, 2021 12:26pm
  - Fuzzysnuggleduck
    
    Hi, have you got a photo or can you explain the written signage for that?
    Sounds really odd on more than one level.
    
    If this is the way of the future, maybe we need Maori only drinking fountains, or special front-of-bus seating positions.
    
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    June 23, 2021 12:47pm
    - wreck1080
      
      https://imgur.com/gallery/LfkTSpf
      
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      June 23, 2021 3:08pm
      - JerJer
        
        That just says it’s parking for patients or visitors of the Maori health authority. Anyone can park there as long as you are a patient or a visitor.
        
        3 2
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        June 23, 2021 4:42pm
      - Jack5
        
        Look again JerJer. The sign says plainly:
        
        Patient/Visitor
        Parking Only For
        Maori Health
        
        The parking is only for those visiting Maori Health, and they must also be a patient or visitor. That is, presumably, not a staff member.
        
        If you are a non-Maori patient you won’t be going to Maori Health. It’s Wokie for: ” parking for Maori patients and visitors only”.
        
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        June 23, 2021 11:58pm
  - Yabster
    
    wow- if thats correct how racist is that?- reserved parking for a 14% minority- surely this is not correct?
    
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    June 23, 2021 12:58pm
  - rockape
    
    [racial stereotyping is not permitted – Mod]
    
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    June 23, 2021 3:18pm
softail 1450

So which thieving Poli has been busted spending money on furniture and tvs for his home, anybody know ?
12 1
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June 23, 2021 11:41am
- Maggie Pie
  
  Well I don’t think it’s Ricardo.
  People who’ve been to his place say they sit cross-legged on the floor
  
  😀
  
  7 1
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  June 23, 2021 1:42pm
- rockape
  
  It’s a Maori!
  
  5 0
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  June 23, 2021 3:19pm
- kowtow
  
  Herald says it’s a Nat.
  
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  June 23, 2021 4:15pm
  - tf78
    
    Still a Moray.
    
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    June 23, 2021 9:08pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Looks like another busy question time today for Trevor.

https://www.parliament.nz/en/pb/order-paper-questions/list-of-oral-questions/oral-questions-23-june-2021/
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June 23, 2021 11:45am
- Bobba Fret
  
  Yes but Trevor will just shut them all down if they get too difficult.
  
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  June 23, 2021 12:28pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Why did Labour close off the proposal to place Mental Health nurses at Police stations?

Collins said the the government had put on hold district health boards initiatives like having mental health nurses at police stations to assess people going into custody after a previous overall health review.

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/445352/collins-dismisses-review-idea-says-little-responsible-for-slow-mental-health-spend
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June 23, 2021 11:55am
Libertysparks

What is happening with the quarantine hotels. Rooms are fully booked five months ahead. My wife trying to return to NZ after flying back to Malaysia to care for her dying mother, but can’t get a room, despite being vaccinated.
It appears the NZ vaccination roll out is struggling (Malaysia just hit 4.5 million people vaccinated), as are facilities to accommodate non-Green party returning Kiwis.
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June 23, 2021 11:57am
- SJ Actual
  
  Yes – spaces has been reasonably plentiful, but seem to have all evaporated over the weekend.
  
  [hit report rather than reply by mistake]
  
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  June 23, 2021 2:06pm
alloytoo

https://notrickszone.com/2021/06/22/new-study-southern-ocean-sea-surface-salinity-level-unexpected-climate-models-very-much-a-construction-site/

It’s very probable that the Southern ocean absorbs all our emissions.
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June 23, 2021 12:04pm
- wreck1080
  
  Why is atmospheric co2 rising?
  
  1 2
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  June 23, 2021 1:08pm
  - alloytoo
    
    CO2 rises typically trail behind temperature increases.
    
    Why?
    
    May be the sodastream effect?
    
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    June 23, 2021 2:36pm
oldfella

You can see why Garrick Tremain is much too good a political cartoonist for either the horrid or stuffed.
In fact, is there anyone in Ayoteearower who does it better?
https://www.bassettbrashandhide.com/post/cartoon-of-the-day-28
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June 23, 2021 12:07pm
- Ruawai
  
  Spot on!
  
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  June 23, 2021 1:40pm
Maggie Pie

You will recall that I posted on yesterday’s GD about the …’not guilty by reason of insanity’ sentences, handed down to the killers of both Jo Pert and Tania Handley. Then poster ‘Jack5’ reminded us about the vicious murder of Christie Marceau.

Now I don’t know if anyone else has picked up on the obvious ‘common denominator’ in these tragic events….all 3 victims were White Women!

Just saying.
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June 23, 2021 12:21pm
- Tall Man
  
  Blessie Gotingco.
  
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  June 23, 2021 2:05pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Not forgotten either TM.
    At least that filthy piece of murdering scum Tony Robertson got sent back to jail.
    
    13 1
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    June 23, 2021 2:17pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    That was sad. She was such a happy smiling person enjoying a good life. I did not know her personally, but did know enough to return a smile.
    Karma will get Robertson one day
    
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    June 23, 2021 3:12pm
MrTips

You heard it here first:

COVIDs in CHC and elsewhere.

Lockdown is coming people.
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June 23, 2021 12:29pm
- JibberJabber
  
  LoL, all very predictable after Arderns horror week last week, the peasants need reminding who is boss.
  
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  June 23, 2021 12:39pm
- Yabster
  
  and your source?- can understand Wellington- and from there possible elsewhere due to the visit to very public places- hope your wrong.
  
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  June 23, 2021 1:11pm
- thetiedarch
  
  I’m in CHCH and that’s news to me. Why you reckon it’s here?
  
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  June 23, 2021 1:20pm
  - sooty
    
    People travel.
    
    3 0
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    June 23, 2021 2:57pm
- Happy1
  
  There is enough false news without you
  
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  June 23, 2021 1:42pm
- MrTips
  
  OK, an update.
  
  I am not going to reveal workplace or names.
  
  Individual X and their workplace was told by MoH this morning to go home as Individual X has returned a +ve PCR. All complied.
  
  1.5 hours later Individual X updated to colleagues that their test was actually a false negative, a repeat had confirmed it as negative and that they had initially been given either a wrong result, or the test was not done properly.
  
  Whilst this was going on AB slipped Wgtn into Level 2 and announced it.
  
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  June 23, 2021 1:48pm
  - crikey
    
    Don’t you mean ‘actually a false positive’?
    
    In terms of being able to manage transmission, a small false positive percentage is better than vice versa.
    
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    June 23, 2021 3:01pm
  - MCos
    
    Level 2 is not a lockdown.
    
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    June 23, 2021 4:05pm
Maggie Pie

WORLD NEWS TRENDING…..

Pakistan Prime Minister Imran Khan……. “blames the way women dress for them getting raped”

WATCH:

https://twitter.com/Marriyum_A/status/1406898088250208260

What IS IT with Muslim men??
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June 23, 2021 1:15pm
- Ehlana
  
  “If they see women in skimpy clothes, [men] will get ‘tempted’ and some will resort to rape”.
  
  The mental strength of non-muslim men must terrify Pakistan’s Prime Minister. In the West, and in other places without Islamic mores of women’s dress, men are able to be out and about in public all day, interacting with (unrelated) women without raping a single one.
  
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  June 23, 2021 1:30pm
  - Tall Man
    
    “The mental strength of non-muslim men must terrify Pakistan’s Prime Minister.”
    
    Maybe that’s why we win the wars nowadays …… 😉
    
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    June 23, 2021 1:54pm
- Ruawai
  
  And now the WHO want women capable of getting pregnant not drinking alcohol, so women aged 15 to 50, wonder if this is also a Muslim agenda.
  
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  June 23, 2021 1:39pm
  - Batman
    
    A Muslim agenda? That’s barking.
    
    It’s just standard academic theorising, absent from reality, in a paper that doesn’t really matter.
    
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    June 23, 2021 1:48pm
  - rockape
    
    Would a certain weight lifter fit into that criteria?
    
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    June 23, 2021 3:20pm
    - Tall Man
      
      Is “bearing” the same as lifting?
      
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      June 23, 2021 5:33pm
- Gravelroad
  
  @Maggie Pie-
  Some years ago we took our son to a cricket test match at the Basin Reserve, Wgn, between NZ and Pakistan.
  The ladies around us on the bank spent more time ogling at Imran Khan than they did watching the cricket.
  Apparently he was/is very good looking etc. A lot of suggestive comments were made about and to Mr Khan when he was fielding.
  Son, who was heavily into autograph collecting at the time, thought he would try his luck and ran up to Imran Khan as he walked off the field to get his signature.
  He was told in no uncertain terms to f..k off.
  Women in countries such as Pakistan, Iran and Iraq are ruled by religion as well as men.
  
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  June 23, 2021 1:44pm
- Batman
  
  It’s not just middle eastern men, a woman in Britain was hacked to death by her male stalker just last week.
  
  It seems plenty of men can’t control themselves and end up blaming the women.
  
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  June 23, 2021 2:07pm
  - kevn
    
    @bat… One nutter v/s hundreds of ‘the other’.
    
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    June 23, 2021 4:42pm
    - Tall Man
      
      “hundreds” …. Millions.
      
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      June 23, 2021 5:34pm
  - chukar
    
    Can’t you all appreciate the Victorian mantra of “ a well turned ankle” ?
    
    Imrans taste perhaps!
    
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    June 23, 2021 10:03pm
- Pharmachick
  
  Well I never! I’m shocked, shocked I tell you.
  /s
  
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  June 23, 2021 2:42pm
- Pharmachick
  
  To be fair, it’s not Muslim men only…
  
  Women should be able to go about their lives and wear/do/say what they want*. In the Western, developed world this is largely true**
  
  When bodies like the UN or WHO are majority subscribed by non western, non OECD, non developed nations, statements like those that have been released in the last few days “Women of childbearing age should not drink alcohol” emerge. They’re unhelpful and they perpetuate the idea that UN and WHO are useless political bodies. This is not how they were envisioned, but maybe this is how they have become.
  
  *not more than Men, just equal. ** There’s plenty of commenters here on KB that are more than willing to ascribe sexual assault to “what was she wearing”. Dudes (mostly) ask yourself, would you do that? And if not (I’m pretty sure you wouldn’t, personally!), then maybe its irrelevant what she was wearing. And if yes, well… there’s a certain circle in hell for you according to Dante.
  
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  June 23, 2021 3:46pm
  - Tall Man
    
    A few years ago a collegue sat next to Japanese businessman on a flight out of Christchurch.
    
    He asked the Japanese guy what he thought of Christchurch. He told my mate that he thought it was a wonderful city but had far too many prostitutes. When asked why he replied that all the women outside the buildings smoking cigarettes were hookers as that was a signal where he emanated from.
    
    Cultural differences do make a differences and over the years I’ve had many women remark how they felt uncomfortable when the Japanese fishermen stared at them when out walking in the streets of Wellington.
    
    Now that doesn’t justify rape and that is not what I am trying to do but compare the two photos below and imagine your reactions as a man to the second photo is you came from a country when the first was not only the norm but was mandated.
    
    https://libertyunyielding.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/Women-in-burquas-burkas-and-hijabs-Muslim-dress-725×375.jpg
    
    https://i2-prod.irishmirror.ie/incoming/article10061158.ece/ALTERNATES/s615b/Punch.jpg
    
    or
    
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IrOUkkKHB1Q
    
    2 2
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    June 23, 2021 5:44pm
- MCos
  
  Imran Khan or Islam most certainly didn’t invent the concept of victim blaming for rape.
  Numerous religions, perpetrators and their lawyers and their families have blamed women for ‘dressing provocatively’.
  
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  June 23, 2021 4:20pm
WaveyDavey

NZ transgender academic (theatre since you ask) knows more about women’s sport than women who play sport

Or something…

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/tokyo-olympics-we-should-be-celebrating-her-kiwi-academic-urges-laurel-hubbards-critics-to-review-their-stance/2LOGZBH253OMVQTHDUTSBGA5TQ/

https://academics.aut.ac.nz/lexie.matheson
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June 23, 2021 1:36pm
- doggone7
  
  From one of the links: “Matheson has been involved in a number of sporting codes, both as an athlete and at a board level, and has contributed to work around enabling trans athletes the right to compete.”
  
  Was there a sense in the links that Matheson thinks she knows more about women’s sport than women who play sport? Or is the implication that she doesn’t know about women’s sports?
  
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  June 23, 2021 2:41pm
  - WaveyDavey
    
    Did you read the story? I guess not.
    
    She’s a theatre academic with precisely zero scientific knowledge and, had you bothered to read the article you’d have seen, she’s decided to opine on matters scientific.
    
    As for the sporting aspect. She was a bit part player in a minority sport that is of no relevance to the matter in hand.
    
    And as far as the “knowing more about…” she is the one trans academic that the NZH used (could dig up) to justify the celebration of this ridiculous decision.
    
    She’s neither qualified in the science or sport but hey she’s trans so she must be an “expert” right?
    
    All those other experts around the world arguing against this they must be wrong huh?
    
    After all only a kiwi theatre critic is the proper person to got to for advice on sport and science.
    
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    June 23, 2021 9:17pm
AlphaWhiskey

https://i.stuff.co.nz/business/300340148/why-i-took-a-60-per-cent-pay-cut-for-a-happier-life

Did less work than colleagues but would still have appeared as a data point in the fallacious wage gap b/s
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June 23, 2021 2:09pm
Tall Man

“Four close contacts, who met up with the confirmed case during his trip to Wellington, are currently isolating – but have tested negative for COVID-19.”

But but but … Delta plus …. Highly contagious dontcha know.

Covid porn takes a back seat to reality in all but the simplest minds.
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June 23, 2021 2:15pm
- Inandout
  
  Anyone watching Wellington airport for the MPs suddenly called away on ‘urgent business’?
  
  11 1
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  June 23, 2021 2:52pm
  - Tall Man
    
    “business” … You’re a funny guy 😉
    
    6 2
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    June 23, 2021 5:45pm
- Don Beckett
  
  Yep. Totalitarian Marxists cannot help but exercise their authority, & impose their ‘rules’ on the people.
  Wouldn’t dream of allowing people to make their own decisions
  – if you are at risk, stay home.
  – If you wish, get your jab.
  – if you wish, get Ivermectin or similar.
  -If you wish to look ridiculous, wear a mask.
  Use simple common sense, and consider others.
  But no, you must conform – you must get the jab and keep Big Pharma raking in the billions.
  The Scamdemic rolls along.
  
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  June 23, 2021 2:59pm
surfing

This Wellington covid pub crawl has all the ingredients for disaster. . .

Indian variant, twice as contagious.
Pubs, bars, and alcohol involved. Super spreader events seem far more likely in these scenarios.

The Matamata pub cluster, and the Dunedin wedding cluster come to mind.

On the positive side, the guy had one vaccine so maybe viral load is hopefully lower… fingers crossed.
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June 23, 2021 3:27pm
Maggie Pie

And in case you missed the news yesterday…

NSW Premier Gladys Berejiklian is now dating her Lawyer!

https://twitter.com/newscomauHQ/status/1407521288013418497
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June 23, 2021 3:33pm
- Nickc2
  
  Surely she can date/do/screw anyone she pleases. Its got nothing whatsoever to do with us.
  
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  June 23, 2021 7:34pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Well, front page news in ‘The Guardian’ Nick.
    Tweet had over 70k hits!
    
    A lot of other people think like me 😀
    
    3 1
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    June 23, 2021 10:26pm
    - Nickc2
      
      The Guardian Maggie? That’s the paper you’re supposed to tear into little squares and hang on your toilet wall.
      I stand by my statement.
      
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      June 24, 2021 3:59am
mandk

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/06/22/cannabis-users-five-times-likely-have-suicidal-thoughts-study/

And yet, some idiots (especially you Swarbrick) think legalising recreational cannabis use would be a good idea.
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June 23, 2021 4:04pm
- kowtow
  
  And people wonder why there’s a mental health crisis ?
  
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  June 23, 2021 4:09pm
  - Tall Man
    
    Precisely. Said that yesterday so not only has this government failed in it’s duty of care towards mental health patients, failed to honour a prime ministerial promise, they actively promote one of the very things that cause the problem in the first place.
    
    Can anyone imagine Tony Ryall pushing for legalisation of cannabis?
    
    Bloody fools the lot of them in this current numpty show.
    
    8 3
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    June 23, 2021 5:31pm
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  Hardly surprising. Cannabis wreaks work ethic and focus – which leads to dead-end shitty outcomes and despair.
  
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  June 23, 2021 10:26pm
MCos

Who’d want to be a politician?

When Todd Muller was elected leader of the Nats he was seen as some sort of bright light as the party slipped down the polls under Bridges.
Nobody, least of all himself, foresaw the mental problems he was to struggle with & some have no sympathy whatsoever.
So under Collins the Nats were crushed at the election and for some Muller caused it all.

https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2020/05/todd_muller_the_new_national_leader.html
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June 23, 2021 5:12pm
- septic skeptic
  
  So Todd Muller has been leaking. National will be much better off once this clown is gone. Next election is far too late, he will poison the chalice before he leaves. Perhaps this time they will have the courage to Waka jump him. Else we are facing a third term of Cindy.
  
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  June 23, 2021 6:27pm
  - Isobar
    
    Not sure they’d even win the by-election if he was to go now. Given they couldn’t even win Ilam.
    
    Best to let him go at the election. It would be embarrassing for the govt to win a seat off National at this time.
    
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    June 23, 2021 11:30pm
- greybeard
  
  And your point is?
  I can’t figure out what it is you are trying so hard to say.
  
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  June 23, 2021 6:29pm
  - MCos
    
    Everyone thought he was the bees knees when he took over, well not everyone, but the knives were soon out for him when things turned to custard.
    People who should have know better put his name forward & more than half the causing voted for him.
    Some fell on their swords, Hooten still has a column in the Herald.
    
    I suppose it’s handy to have a scapegoat for one’s own poor judgement.
    
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    June 23, 2021 7:23pm
    - tf78
      
      I had to google who he was, never heard of him before he took over.
      
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      June 23, 2021 9:23pm
Wired-one

Thank god we were fast and early and at the front of the queue for vaccinations for our people. This has allowed us to no longer need lock downs or to go up alert levels now that 80%+ of us are vaccinated. Oh wait a minute… incompetent bastards!
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June 23, 2021 5:14pm
- MCos
  
  According to Don Beckett, above, all the vaccines do is make Big Pharma rich.
  
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  June 23, 2021 7:29pm
  - tf78
    
    MCos, is he not correct?!
    
    2 1
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    June 23, 2021 9:24pm
CAKE FACE1

Back in the day, on a Sunday afternoon, there would be children films about a cool and popular set of kids, in a silly conflict with a misfit set of kids. The misfit kids would have a fat kid, a nerd, a ginger, and so on, whilst the cool kids were good looking and sporty. Typically, at the end of the movie, to the sound of stirring music, the cool kids got their comeuppance. They would lose in mini golf to the misfits, or some other such nonsense.

I can’t help finding our beloved Covid “experts” to be like the misfit kids in the flicks. They don’t seem like bad people, and they bring a smile to my face. Baker, Bloomfield, Wiles, Hendy et al are basically hilarious.

I saw Michael Baker on TV tonight. He puffed out his chest, and gave us his best flu scary speech. Great stuff.

Have you ever seen the flick “The Blob”? When I watch Professor Baker on television, I have to remind myself that this was only a movie. There is really no chance of a huge blob of Baker’s ego eating me through the television or cyberspace.

I once saw Professor Baker telling real European scientists that they should follow his elimination strategy, when the virus there is endemic! The looks of disdain from the European scientists were priceless, but irrespectively Professor Baker courageously retained his smug expression, completely undaunted by the derision of much superior scientists!

What a hoopla!
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June 23, 2021 6:24pm
CAKE FACE1

And a quick shout out for our other great “experts”:

Shaun Hendy – comes across to me as likeable but goofy. I would guess he is typically modelling the movement of some far-off galaxy, or some other such intellectual endeavour, which has no real-world consequences. I suspect that he would be upset to learn that his Rona mathematical booboos cost enumerable lives, be they cancer patients not treated due to lockdown, or deaths from suicides et al. It’s not really his fault.

I’m reminded of one of the greatest physicists in history, Sir Isaac Newtown. He famously lost all his money in the South Sea bubble, and was quoted as saying that he “could calculate the motions of the heavenly bodies, but not the madness of the people.”

Shaun can presumably calculate the motions of the heavenly bodies, but with regards to the likely deaths from Covid – not so much…

Siouxie Wiles – I always intrigued regarding the due diligence for her appointment as an “expert”. Did they meet her, face to face? I doubt it somehow… Due diligence, anyone? I try my best to take her seriously, but…

Raymond Bloomfield – I would definitely count cards at the casino with Raymond. Definitely. Definitely. Count cards. Count cards. Definitely. He was fantastic in that movie.
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June 23, 2021 6:45pm
Tall Man

Takes a special kind of man to shoot himself in the foot ….. Twice!
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June 23, 2021 6:51pm
greybeard

Whuk Matariki.
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June 23, 2021 6:55pm
Maggy Wassilieff

What is wrong with Folks in the National Party?

If you can’t get on with your colleagues, then get out of Politics and do your own thing.

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2021/06/national-mp-todd-muller-resigned-after-leaking-against-harete-hipango-to-journalist.html
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June 23, 2021 8:45pm
- Gravelroad
  
  @MW-
  I don’t understand them at all.
  They got rid of Bridges – why? Because he talked funny and was subjected to a sustained personal hate campaign on Twitter?
  Then they got rid of Paula Bennett- why? Didnt trust her with the election campaign after giving her the job?
  Then plotted to promote Muller- why? He was clearly not fit for purpose from the start.
  Time for someone in the Nat Party to start telling the truth.
  
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  June 23, 2021 10:18pm
- Prince
  
  This is so demoralising. Why is Muller hanging around for 2 more years (other than the obvious money) ? Surely the National Caucus could take a stand on this ? If not, Goodfellow should step in and kick him out of the party.
  There are loyal party members around the country who work hard for no personal benefit, while clowns like Muller treat us like scum and ponce around like they own the place.
  
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  June 23, 2021 11:34pm
Tom Barker

Paul Goldsmith and many on this blog are confident that colonisation was, on balance, very beneficial for Maori. Would they say the same for the native peoples of Australia? And if not, why not?
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June 23, 2021 9:06pm
- Cinematic
  
  Before I answer your question let me ask, why does it matter?
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:26pm
- tf78
  
  There are a lot aborigine movie stars now and they’re great actors – what’s your point. The hopeless ones will always be hopeless but most of them have moved into the 21st Century and contribute and enjoy their new society.
  
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  June 23, 2021 9:29pm
  - ABS4EVA
    
    Archie Roach – All Men Choose the Path They Walk
    
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EATZpASejvQ
    
    I listened to Archie Roach perform with his partner Ruby Hunter on the saint Kilda Water Front there last performance together
    
    this is my favorite
    
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    June 24, 2021 1:29am
  - ABS4EVA
    
    Some men are prone to misadventure
    Questions of guilt aren’t always clear
    Some men run from a fate they can’t avoid
    All men choose the path they walk
    
    Some can’t be faulted for their reason
    Failing to justly intervene
    Some men hide from the memories that haunt
    All men choose the path they walk
    
    Some men see everything through duty
    Cast off responsibility
    Some regret that their courage sometimes fails
    All men choose the path they walk
    
    Some men have attitude that’s righteous
    Care not about the consequence
    Some men fight with the violence inside
    All men choose the path they walk
    
    Some men have reached their destination
    Finding their own serenity
    Some men lead others till they recognize
    That all men choose the path they walk
    
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    June 24, 2021 1:33am
- ABS4EVA
  
  Maori Helped Colonise Aboriginal Australia with Samuel Marsden so much they have a land
  Claim for Parramatta
  
  So your point is?
  
  Led by Lady Crown, a group of Rangihou people fronted the Federal Court this week in an attempt to sue the City of Parramatta Council for a 112-acre plot of land it claims was gifted to their ancestors.
  
  https://www.sbs.com.au/nitv/article/2019/08/23/nz-maori-minister-urges-rangihou-people-think-again-after-sydney-land-claim
  
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  June 24, 2021 1:25am
Maggy Wassilieff

It looks like the Gloriavale Community is starting to implode

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/125540143/urgent-appeal-to-help-more-families-leaving-gloriavale
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June 24, 2021 9:29am

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