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June 28, 2021 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 28 June 2021

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General Debate

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Tony Stuart

Imagine if a Minister in a National/Act government had made this flippant comment:

A grieving mother has been shocked by an off-the-cuff comment made by the Minister in charge of Courts.

When Aupito William Sio faced questions recently over increasing coronial inquest wait times, he made a joke that went down like a lead balloon with families waiting to learn vital information about an unexpected death.

Minister Sio appeared to jovially quip changes “could take three years, could take 18 years”.

His remarks have caused distress for families like Corinda Taylor, who’s facing heartache and frustration while desperately waiting for coronial inquests to be completed.

Corinda’s 20-year-old son Ross died by suicide in 2013.

“It is sleepless nights, it is nightmares, it is waking up in the morning not wanting to get out of bed, it is traumatic,” she told Newshub. “I’m exhausted, I’m tired of waiting, no one deserves to wait this long.”

And she’s not alone. Waiting times for the Coroner’s Court have significantly increased in the past year to 484 days on average. Currently, there are 5439 active cases.

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2021/06/minister-of-courts-aupito-william-sio-jovially-quips-changes-could-take-18-years-when-confronted-over-coronial-inquest-wait-times.html

This is disgraceful. As if losing a family member to suicide or some other sudden, unexpected cause of death wasn’t bad enough, waiting for months for an inquest to be completed must be gut-wrenching.

But worse for Aupito William Sio is what seems to be a threat to a news organistion; read on:

“Can you please explain to the committee, beyond the ‘discussing’ and the ‘exploring’ and these kinds of words that get used in written answers… what is actually taking place or what has taken place, more to the point, actually to reduce some of the backlog, for example, in the Coroner’s Court that you’ve acknowledged?” Penk asked.

Sio went on to say the Coroner’s Court is “quite challenging” and explained Labour allocated money in its first Wellbeing Budget which allowed for the introduction of temporary coroners, however some were promoted and others retired.

“We’re now exploring legislative changes that could take place, and I’m pretty confident that we’re in a really good space to be able to embark on that particular work,” Sio continued.

He acknowledged there are still challenges “that remain unsettled” but felt confident it was “heading in the right direction”.

Penk then rebuffed: “Frankly though Minister, you’re not”, before delivering relevant statistics – including the wait times now averaging 484 days as compared with 303.

“What else have you got?” Penk asked.

“In the overall scheme of things, the system is heading in the right direction… I’m not trying to take away from the fact in the Coroner’s space – I receive plenty of emails and I note the conversations that are happening in the public arena – and my acknowledgement of how difficult and challenging that is, but I want to assure this committee, yes we have started the work, to make some changes,” Sio said.

“We met up with some challenges, now we are looking at other opportunities, it’s a challenge that I’m up to… time will tell.”

Penk replied: “When you say ‘time will tell’ Minister, what does that mean?”

That’s when Sio retorted: “Maybe three years, maybe 18 years.”

Newshub approached Sio about his joke.

“You’re misinterpreting that, I spent that time teasing my colleagues who themselves were responsible at one point in time when they were in Government and now are raising these issues when they didn’t do anything about it,” he said.

When asked if the select committee meeting was the right time to jest, he said: “No it’s not and don’t try and make something out of this.”

Just what does Mr Sio mean by “don’t try and make something out of this”? Is he suggesting that Newshub shouldn’t be questioning him about an ill-timed attempt at humour? Does he not believe that a man of his status should be held to account for his words?

As I said earlier, just imagine if a National or Act Minister acted in this way. Sio’s words have been described on social media as “heartless” and “appalling”, and he should apologise for them.
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December 28, 2020 9:31am
- Linda Reid
  
  This is another example of a government minister failing to answer important questions but instead issuing a word soup that meant absolutely nothing – and then being so chuffed with his reply he felt comfortable making a joke.
  
  The wait is appalling. The minister is making it worse with his flippant response.
  
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  June 28, 2021 9:43am
  - Gravelroad
    
    Well they are very comfortable, aren’t they these incompetent government ministers.
    They know their leader and the party machine will protect them no matter what.
    And they know that the media has no appetite to challenge much of what they say – cause “Jacinda” and Covid and raaacismm.
    
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    June 28, 2021 10:05am
  - david
    
    And the “nasty” was lurking just below the surface, breaching (or should that have properly been broaching) with the implied threat.
    “Do you want to make something of it?” Is cheap punk bravado talk designed to appear aggressive and superior and used when the bully is unsure of their own strength or ability but is doubling down in an attempt to make the victim back away.
    That should have been a signal to Penk that Sio was uncertain and vulnerable and that his jugular was exposed.
    
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    June 28, 2021 2:06pm
- toowoketoosmoke
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  You right wing fucks are about to get what’s coming with these new hatespeech laws! Good luck!
  
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  June 28, 2021 10:51am
  - Swifty
    
    WTF?
    
    You would have people prosecuted for speaking their mind on matters of concern to them?
    
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    June 28, 2021 11:28am
  - Linda Reid
    
    Can you please explain that a bit more? What is coming for us? And why?
    
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    June 28, 2021 11:36am
  - Yabster
    
    too dumb to get irony in your post?- geeze what a tool.
    
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    June 28, 2021 12:13pm
    - toowoketoosmoke
      
      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      And you’re too fucking easy to get pushback from! Because you take this platform seriously! Ya futures looking bright!
      
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      June 28, 2021 1:14pm
      - Yabster
        
        If by pushback you mean a reply to inane post – I will oblige everytime. Your future is probably alot rosier now the benefit was raised, maybe you can spend the extra money in getting a better education?
        
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        June 28, 2021 2:10pm
  - Observer of Life
    
    TooWoke: Your words may be interpreted as “Hate Speech”… watch your back. Unintended consequences and all that ?
    
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    June 28, 2021 1:21pm
    - curry4me
      
      Observer of Life: Just another troll to ignore.
      
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      June 28, 2021 2:20pm
- 3-coil
  
  Su’a William Sio let the veil slip, and displayed all of his misogynist and racist ugliness is one weak pathetic attempt to crack a joke. Sio comes from the background of a patriarchal Samoan matai/chieftainship, served as a bishop in the Mormon church, and is a senior member (6 terms) of NZ Labour Party – maybe that sort of sexist arrogance is acceptable there (?) but not in a NZ Parliamentary Select Committee. Too long at the trough has left Sio ignorant of the hardships of the plebs struggling to survive under his ineptitude and that of his Labour Party’s government. Pull your head in and pull your socks up Sio, or get out of the way and let a smarter more sensitive MP do the job properly.
  
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  June 28, 2021 11:17am
  - Linda Reid
    
    Maybe someone needs to ask him who he thinks he works for. Because he is elected to work for us all.
    
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    June 28, 2021 12:28pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    I can’t find any evidence that Sio has ever done a decent day’s work.
    
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    June 28, 2021 1:42pm
Happychappy

This is a great example of our kind and caring Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern on the children of New Zealand.
And this after the lies and deceit she committed with her slogan on the previous Government National and still continues to do at every opportunity she gets, nine years of neglect and underfunding is her catchphrase in one breath and in another she gives Starship Hospital $10 million in funding for a $ 25 million upgrade and leaves
them to fundraise for the rest.
Hear is a quote from a nurse that says many unhappy staff are leaving their jobs in droves at Starship Hospital.
“My unit is trying to get funding for a upgrade that will cost $25 million the Government gave us $10 million the rest is being fund raised for”.
These are the most unwell children in New Zealand and we have to fund raise to accommodate them while cyclists get handed sum of $700 million.
It makes me and everyone In my unit angry with the Government that they dont have the children of New Zealand as a priority.
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2021/06/nursing-shortage-starship-hospital-workers-commonly-end-up-in-tears-make-mistakes-as-understaffing-takes-its-toll.html
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June 28, 2021 8:01am
- cmm
  
  I hope the pissed off nurse stops voting with her feelz.
  
  Starship is one hospital that really should be kept in top form. They take patients from everywhere and generally the most critical. Last night on Flightradar I saw there was a Starship plane flying from Timaru to AKL. Clearly more than they wanted to treat in Chch.
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:34am
  - Sacha
    
    Starship claimed, and was given, status as the main centre in NZ for treatment of sick children back in the ’90’s.
    At that time I worked in the ICU at Wellington Public Hospital, and we routinely looked after local children with all sorts of serious ACUTE conditions. Starship was the place for rare and challenging conditions.
    But quite suddenly, we were sending our children to Starship, with acute conditions that we could easily treat – partly, we heard, because the government decreed that Starship needed to keep all its beds full in order to keep its funding as a Centre of Excellence.
    One ridiculous situation arose when the helicopter arrived one morning with its retrieval team of medics, to transport a small child with an acute respiratory condition. It had to be ‘stabilised’ for transport, and they left about 5pm. The specialists at Starship evaluated the child the next morning, and the patient was returned to Wellington that afternoon, unventilated. (It would have had the same outcome, for less expense, if it had been kept in Wellington ICU)
    I appreciate that the population of Auckland has probably increased so that more beds are needed but maybe Starship still needs to be more astute deciding admission priority, so that the desperately ill from outlying centres can be accommodated.
    (Timaru would have consulted with Christchurch, who would have referred the child to Starship).
    
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    June 28, 2021 12:23pm
    - cmm
      
      It is always good to get inside knowledge. Thanks for that.
      
      I suppose too there’s some of the “been seen to be doing the right thing” going on too – something that has increased as any service providers are being put under greater pressure. The politically safe option is to send patients to Starship “just in case”.
      
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      June 28, 2021 1:56pm
- lifesgood
  
  My grandchild had a week in Starship recently. I could not fault the nurses but the place is definitely tired looking and even grubby in some places. Not good.
  
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  June 28, 2021 9:17am
Scott

DPF posted yesterday that the Republican-controlled Senate in Michigan found no evidence of election fraud- “Our clear finding is that citizens should be confident the results represent the true results of the ballots cast by the people of Michigan.”

Really? Well I revisited my old post about the 2020 presidential election in Michigan –

Was the 2020 presidential election stolen? Patrick Byrne in his book “The Deep Rig” lays out how it was done. For example in Michigan Trump wins on election night. At 2 AM polling locations in Detroit were shut. Ballot counters were told to go home. The voting stations windows were covered. Dominion executive shows up in Detroit polling station after midnight. Dominion is the manufacturer of the voting software. Trump’s election night lead disappears. Biden injection of votes appears. On November 7 at 6:31 AM Biden receives a vote injection of 54,199 votes. After that he goes on to win the state.

This happened in six states which swung the electoral college Biden’s way. After counting was “stopped” there were hundreds of thousands of ballot swings, often running 99.4% and even 100% Biden. There were occasions where a group of precincts in a state would in lockstep begin counting all presidential votes 17/18 for Biden, 1/18 for Trump. Then after 90 minutes their counting would all go back to normal, but another set of precincts in the state would suddenly flip to counting 17/18 for Biden, 1/18 for Trump. Precisely for 90 minutes. Then they would all flip back to normal. (Byrne page 32 and 33)
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June 28, 2021 8:05am
- Paulus
  
  It still appears that there is nothing wrong with the counting machines – it is the people operating and feeding them.
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:27am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    The machines are set up for fraud at the start. Read their manuals.
    
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    June 28, 2021 10:19am
    - Fidel Cashflow
      
      Yes. Why do they need some complex algorithm, when they just need to distinguish a vote for one guy, from a vote for the other?
      
      Trump was nearing a mathematically impossible-to-beat position, so they paused the count and started feeding in votes for Biden in statistically impossible batches of fake ballots. That’s what happened and they can obfuscate all they like, it won’t change that fact. The people no longer control the US.
      
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      June 28, 2021 11:14am
  - UrbanNeocolonialist
    
    Except that tabulation machines all over the place have been found to have SQL database software that they shouldn’t have on them (who put that there in contravention of law?) , and are sending vastly more ballots for human adjudication that they are by law permitted to, seemingly by design, and have been caught switching votes (eg Antrim county), having connections to internet, and myriad other issues that make them highly suspect.
    
    Voting machines were the big bad; unreliable, untrustworthy and easily compromised in all elections where democrats lost, but in 2020 are just dandy. In many jurisdictions they are administered maintained and controlled on election night by employees of Dominion (the vast majority of which are Democrats from donation records). There is an extremely dodgy appearance to their maintenance and procurement contracts – large contracts being awarded and increased election costs for states (often more expensive than paper ballot counting) highly suggestive of kickbacks to the same procuring politicians that are now defending them. Ownership of the voting machine companies also appears to have a very partisan slant with a large portion of ownership in PRC hands.
    
    If nothing else comes of 2020 investigations it is likely to upend the vote tabulation process – with many returning to manual counting of paper ballots.
    
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    June 28, 2021 10:35am
  - Fletch
    
    Yeh, the voting machines that weren’t supposed to be able to be connected to the internet in any way but were…
    
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    June 28, 2021 10:50am
- Than
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Scott, do you not realize how completely you are wasting your time?
  
  You are literally repeating the same “evidence” that everybody interested has already seen a thousand times. Those who buy it are already convinced. Those who don’t buy it won’t be convinced by repeating same debunked BS again.
  
  Try coming up with something new. Or, more productively, give up the delusion that Trump won and join the real world.
  
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  June 28, 2021 9:08am
cmm

Stuff has an article about a terminally ill man who is so fearful that he’s losing the rest of his life waiting for a vaccine. He’s already run out the clock of his expected lifespan and has a burning wish to do a few “bucket list” things.

Dude, grab life by the nuts and just go for it. If you hang around waiting much longer you lose the opportunity anyway. Getting a vaccine does not eliminate risks, but does reduce the impact of infections.

Playing the numbers game, that means getting a vaccination might increase your expected life by, say, a week (being generous), so if you’re putting your life on hold for more than a week for a vaccine then you’re short changing yourself.

I really wish you the best for what days you have left. Have fun while you can and go well.

More disturbing though is that stuff does not seem to think Maori and PI are people:
“Group 3 includes people aged 65,…, plus older Māori and Pacific people, …”. Doesn’t the group of 65+ already include older Maori and Pis?

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/125543784/covid19-terminally-ill-man-wants-to-know-why-he-is-still-waiting-for-a-vaccination
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June 28, 2021 8:05am
- kiwikidsnz
  
  https://i.stuff.co.nz/opinion/300342943/covid19-nz-why-is-the-vaccine-rollout-so-slow
  
  I read the comments after they closed & lost count of those from the Ministries of Health/ Propaganda
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:12am
  - peterwn
    
    Saturday’s DomPost carried a full page propaganda ad proclaiming how well the vaccinations are going. Is this corruption eh, Ginny Anderson (Labour’s corruption expert)?
    There is no need for Labour to waste money on this. National seems to be dog tucker now.
    
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    June 28, 2021 8:33am
- Simon
  
  In Auckland until a few weeks ago they were Ro vaxxing anyone who turned up. They were not busy. You could just rock up.
  
  Zero covid nut jobs. Its over except for this useless gubbermint and the cattle.
  
  Ro vaxx whoever wants it and open up. People under 25 years old should not take the Ro vaxx. 65 years plus and unhealthy should take it.
  
  This bullshit should be over by now even with Labo garbage roll out.
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:13am
  - cmm
    
    It seems to be a case of sort out the voters first.
    
    If there is a shortage, and people are supposed to be done in priority, then that’s the way they should play the game.
    
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    June 28, 2021 8:36am
- Rich Prick
  
  It’s just the obligatory “special mention”. It makes the typists at Stuff feel better. I ignore it these days.
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:26am
- Paulus
  
  As over 80 years with health so am I and my wife also.
  We do not believe we will get the first vaccination this year so !
  Hard and Fast too !
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:30am
  - Flossie
    
    I’m in Waikato DHB (don’t know if that is either here or there) but this morning got a text telling me I’m in Group 3 for the vaccine rollout, and will get an invitation to book an appointment.
    Not sure what value that text has really – I kind of already knew that, being past 65 and all. The “when” might be helpful.
    
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    June 28, 2021 10:34am
- Odakyu-sen
  
  Maybe the definition of “older” is different for Maori and Pacific Islanders?
  Perhaps 65+ is “older” for Caucasians and Asians, but 55+ is “older” for Maori and Pacific Islanders?
  
  (Based on health and average life expectancies)
  
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  June 28, 2021 9:03am
Waipuk

Just remember journalists and the media in general are scum.

You would have more trust in a used car salesman telling you the truth.
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June 28, 2021 8:07am
- gonzo
  
  I work in “the media”. Are you saying I’m scum? Or maybe I’m one of the lucky ones who aren’t scum because, as you say, we’re only “in general” scum? 🙂
  
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  June 28, 2021 12:19pm
  - surfing
    
    That’s identity politics for you…
    
    Kiwiblog is full of it, unfortunately.
    
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    June 28, 2021 12:37pm
  - Observer of Life
    
    Gonzo: Are you not embarrassed to be in the media with all the manipulation and intentional avoidance of publishing the truth? Serious question.
    
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    June 28, 2021 1:28pm
    - gonzo
      
      Hi Observer. No, I’m not embarrassed. I would say that in media I come across people of all persuasions; left, right, liberal, conservative…whatever definition you wish to put on an individual’s views. It would be the same as I have seen in other industries – and I have worked in a number.
      I do agree that it would be fair to say that “in general” the average journo/reporter would be “left/liberal”.
      I can also say that I have never been involved in ANY discussion either at a operational level journalist/reporter or at a “management-level” regarding manipulating news output to avoid “publishing the truth”.
      Interesting topic!
      
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      June 28, 2021 8:28pm
- Waipuk
  
  Tarred by the same brush.
  
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  June 28, 2021 1:44pm
Maggie Pie

TRENDING….

According to the latest update from ‘STATISTA’…

CHINA (pop 1.4 Billion) and the Home of Coronavirus…..have reported 4850 Covid19 deaths.

AMERICA (pop 332 Million) and the Home of the Free….have recorded 619,3587 Covivd19 deaths.

I smell a bat.
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June 28, 2021 8:08am
- Blackbob
  
  “I smell a bat” A Wuhan Laboratory bat no less…
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:17am
- RoboRob
  
  The Chinese stats are total garbage.
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:19am
  - Fidel Cashflow
    
    I’d posit that the US stats are also total garbage.
    
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    June 28, 2021 11:19am
- Greg Ettridge
  
  Maggie, it is very hard to believe anything that comes out of the WHO or China.
  China on Worlometers.
  April 17th 2020 they had 1290 deaths in a day.
  They have had 4 deaths since then.
  Look at a world map with outbreaks, Wuhan has had none, zero, zilch.
  Go figure.
  bat lady is a just figment of our imaginations.
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:32am
- cmm
  
  Incentives:
  
  China: There is no incentive to report a CV19 death. It probably brings big shame on the hospital, nurses & drs doing the treatment etc etc. Nope he died of a lung condition from too much smoking.
  
  USA: Hospital gets paid an extra $10k or whatever if they deal with a CV19 patient. Everyone has CV19 – even if you need to do a few extra cycles to find it.
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:41am
  - Greg Ettridge
    
    “Shame” it was more like instant lead poisoning or have your door wielded up in Wuhan.
    You are very lucky to get away with shame in China.
    
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    June 28, 2021 8:54am
  - MCos
    
    Re the US
    If you had a choice would you patronize a hospital where everyone was dying of covid-19?
    
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    June 28, 2021 9:30am
  - Ehlana
    
    Actually cmm, I think it is more along the lines of “on average, it costs $x to treat a patient with condition 1 and $xx to treat a patient with the more serious condition 2”.
    If you’re more seriously ill and need a ventilator, of course you will likely stay longer in hospital and cost more to treat. And any scheme, like Medicare, that pays treatment costs will find itself paying more for your care.
    That is not evidence that hospital staff are routinely lying about the severity of the cases they are treating in order to get more money for their institutions.
    
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    June 28, 2021 2:38pm
- Dr John
  
  here is a very interesting opinion by a REAL doctor – unlike the ‘experts’ who strut their stuff on our tv news almost every evening
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAHi3lX3oGM&t=923s
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:58am
  - MCos
    
    Are you a real doctor?
    
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    June 28, 2021 9:33am
    - Tall Man
      
      What a truly stupid thing to say.
      
      Watch the video and make your own mind up instead of twittering on.
      
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      June 28, 2021 11:05am
    - Dr John
      
      sort of.
      But not south of the neck.
      And if anyone is interested enough to read the original article in the American Journal of Medicine about treatments you should be having while sitting at home with a positive stick up your nose:
      Pathophysiological Basis and Rationale for Early Outpatient Treatment of SARS-CoV-2 (COVID-19) Infection – The American Journal of Medicine (amjmed.com)
      
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      June 28, 2021 11:12am
  - Tall Man
    
    Are many using prophylactic treatments here or is the fact that we have very few actually sick mean we are doing nothing?
    
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    June 28, 2021 11:06am
JibberJabber

It takes a lot to provoke New Zealanders politically. The last time it happened was in 1981, when a tour by the South African Springbok rugby team tore the country apart.

Since then, Kiwis have largely reverted to their default setting of complacency and passivity. Which makes it all the easier for Jacinda Ardern’s Labour government to push through an agenda of radical transformation quite unlike any the country has experienced.

https://www.spectator.com.au/2021/06/maorification-of-smiling-zombies/

The government has done its best to ensure continued media support for this ideological project by creating a $55 million slush fund, supposedly to support ‘public interest journalism’ but available only to news organisations that commit themselves to the promotion of the so-called principles (never satisfactorily defined) of the 1840 Treaty of Waitangi. What has been framed as an idealistic commitment to the survival of journalism is, in other words, a cynical and opportunistic bid for control over the news media at a time when the industry is floundering. This is a government so shameless, or perhaps so convinced of its own untouchability, that it is brazenly buying the media’s compliance.
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June 28, 2021 8:10am
- Paulus
  
  Not $55 million it is $105 million.
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:32am
  - JibberJabber
    
    Yes, the final installment is due in the lead-up to the next election. ?
    
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    June 28, 2021 8:53am
  - Nickc2
    
    Correct, the top-up seems to be lost sight of.
    
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    June 28, 2021 11:40am
- peterwn
  
  Yes, and toss all the real crims out of jail to hake room for political crims such as those who say things out of turn or company directors who do not include environmental matters in their reports.
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:36am
- John Pakes
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  ‘Since then Kiwis have largely reverted to their default setting of complacency and passivity”.
  Hardly JibberJabber.
  That they are not what you suggest was well illustrated a few years back when they rose up in anger and tossed out an incompetent National Government and replaced it with a Government with an unheard of majority under MMP.
  Hardly complacency
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:43am
  - Crisplion
    
    No, that was not complacency but misplaced gratitude to a PM who made political capital out of a pandemic by beating up terror in the population and then playing up her role in saving lives. So, in thus case it was fear and stupidity rather than complacency.
    
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    June 28, 2021 9:33am
  - Stellaboxer
    
    Keep smiling zombie.
    
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    June 28, 2021 9:49am
- In Vino Veritas
  
  Hmm, my recollection Jibber, was that a smallish minority of NZ’rs resorted to violence during the ’81 Springbok tour. Whilst there may have been more NZ’rs that disagreed with the tour, they were prepared to live and let live. And a good few that disagreed with the tour, disagreed because of the violence it was going to cause. So provoked? Tore the country apart? I think not.
  
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  June 28, 2021 9:29am
- Happy1
  
  Jibber, you are forgetting the Kiwis Care March down Queen Street by 60,000 on the 2 March 1981 led by Tania Harris. In the morning, the unions seemed unassailable. After lunch they were powerless. While it took 4 years for them to disappear, in effect there was nothing they could do to stop their decline.
  
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  June 28, 2021 10:36am
Maggie Pie

Karl du Fresne in ‘The Spectator’…..

‘It seems like a hostile takeover of New Zealand is underway and most people feel powerless to do anything about it.
The most visible change might crudely be described as ….’MAORIFICATION’

https://spectator.com.au/2021/06/maorification-0f-smiling-zombies/
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June 28, 2021 8:14am
- cmm
  
  This will not end well – least of all for the Maori.
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:18am
  - BeeJay
    
    cmm, you’re so right, this attempt to takeover New Zealand is being promoted by a Maori minority, supported by a socialist Government, and it will have a disastrous outcome for the majority of Maori! The silent majority of Kiwis will not let it happen! I see plenty of commentary, but no sign of rebellion yet! Will we wait until it’s too late?
    
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    June 28, 2021 8:40am
    - Nickc2
      
      IMO, it will never be too late!
      
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      June 28, 2021 11:49am
  - Brian McDonald
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    Ominous threat from an anonymous troll CMM?
    You’ve missed the bus, there’ll be a meeting of the minds and moderation of many views as a result.
    People have the right to say I don’t speak Te Reo or don’t want to as an example but nevertheless pick more of it up. Trying to stop the change that has been progressive over the years, and which is now embedded even in the Justice system, is futile, but maintaining and building NZ’s/Aotearoa’s culture is not. You have the myopic view that it is 1 culture or the other, while there are at least 2 primary cultures there is also a 3rd being a comfortable blend.
    Just like politics, a broad middle.
    
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    June 28, 2021 8:43am
    - Happychappy
      
      You need to take that big truck that you own or drive off the road and give it a decent service to take away those dirty diesel fumes you are inhaling as they seem to be clouding your vision Brian.
      
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      June 28, 2021 8:53am
    - cmm
      
      Dude I lived for 30 years in a country with MULTIPLE cultures and interacted with people form at least 5 different cultures on a regular basis so I understand some of the pros and cons of different cultures.
      
      I also learned to speak 4 languages well (still two fluently) so I am not adverse to different languages.
      
      I do not have a problem with people learning Maori if they choose. If there were many Maori speakers I would encourage teaching Maori in school because I believe people should be able to communicate. But most Maori can’t be bothered learning to speak Maori, so why force it down everyone’s throats?
      
      I do have a problem with this nonsense pushing for Maori separatism etc.
      
      While you have a very remote view of what separatism looks like, I lived under apartheid for 30 years. Separatism is destructive because it prevents the best rising to the top. Separatism is destructive because it makes for us vs them.
      
      South Africa still has separatism (except now it’s Black Economic Empowerment). That is even more destructive because it leads to massive corruption and still makes for us vs them.
      
      If you want to see what Maori separatism will bring then just look to Africa.
      
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      June 28, 2021 8:59am
      - surfing
        
        I think you are right about corruption.
        
        It already happens… Any time that non-maori try to make life better for themselves and their community, a maori will be lurking in the shadows looking to capitalise on their success.
        
        Ports of Tauranga for example, constantly being screwed over by maori. Harbour dredging is just a license for maori to print money .
        
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        June 28, 2021 9:03am
      - KevO'Brien
        
        If you want to see what modern Te Reo will bring look to English. They have to borrow so many words that Maori lingo is farcical. We have to chuck out all the transliterated loan words to see its paucity. Maori have been stuck in a time warp post Treaty but better that, than being eaten by another tribal bro.
        Now the sillies want it all back again. Do they propose to apply their brutal tikanaga to Pakeha too?
        
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        June 28, 2021 10:29am
- cas
  
  That link didn’t work for me Maggie
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:49am
  - Tall Man
    
    Look to the right on the page.
    
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    June 28, 2021 11:02am
- surfing
  
  https://spectator.com.au/2021/06/maorification-of-smiling-zombies/
  
  Fixed that for you.
  
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  June 28, 2021 9:06am
  - cas
    
    Thank you
    
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    June 28, 2021 9:28am
- RockyJ
  
  In a country with a real constitution, like the USA, Jacinda Ardern could be tried for treason.
  
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  June 28, 2021 9:16am
- Fletch
  
  I’m sick of the news using the Maori name for Auckland. It’s always just going to be Auckland to me. Leave it the hell alone.
  
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  June 28, 2021 10:58am
  - curry4me
    
    Fletch: So, be like me, and get your NZ news from Kiwiblog, NZ Issues, or YSB. Others have watched the news so we don’t have to.
    
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    June 28, 2021 2:34pm
hullkiwi

cmm, what a mixed up story and load of logic. As a born, bred and educated Kiwi, I fear for this country when I read articles such as this. The guy has a terminal condition, and he is putting his life on hold for a vaccine, that may or may not stop a variant?

Then there is the search for special status for Maoti and PIS, really? As a 60 Yr old white male, I can feel hate speech coming on.
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June 28, 2021 8:15am
- cmm
  
  It’s just the result of fear. Fear makes people lose their logic. This is well understood and explains lots of dumb things people do when stressed etc.
  
  It is also a great way to get compliance. Fearful people are far more likely to be compliant.
  
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incident_pit
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:45am
Frank the tank

Here we go. The Blairite, St Ash, squealer and the covid cult have got what they wanted all along – a told you so moment regarding the trans Tasman bubble.

Forgot that holiday to the GC back to the gang and emergency housing infested ‘holiday’ venues for the plebs. Enjoy.

This country is nothing but predicable………
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June 28, 2021 8:21am
Maggy Wassilieff

Judith Collins intends bringing the PM centre-stage into the “Hate speech” debate.

“I am calling on Jacinda Ardern to front these proposed ‘hate speech’ laws herself. If she is going to erode our democracy and control our speech she needs to own it.

“New Zealanders are entitled to hear from their Prime Minister as to why it is she thinks she is entitled to control even our most core rights.

“I will not be allowing her to palm the issue off to others. It is too important; preserving our democracy is too important. I will be going directly to the Prime Minister to get answers for New Zealanders. I certainly hope she has better answers than Minister Faafoi.”

https://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA2106/S00213/this-is-about-controlling-new-zealanders-lives.htm

It will be interesting to see the lengths the MSM will go to deflecting the issue away from our Dear PM.
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June 28, 2021 8:26am
- Gravelroad
  
  @MW:
  Wedding
  Ed Sheehan’s offer to sing at Jacinda’s wedding because she is the “best human on the planet” ( he loves her cheese scones also).
  New baby maybe
  More on the kindness of Neve
  Kids cookery book in works from Clarke
  More subsidies for electric cars and bike riding
  Etc etc
  All of the above more cute to the msm than challenging the gutting of NZ ‘S free society.
  Good on Ms Collins anyway – brave.
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:43am
  - Greg Ettridge
    
    You have to laugh, Australia manages to run a train with a few kilometres of carriages to cart coal, Jacinda’s cabal, ships it from Indonesia to save the planet, then trucks it to Huntly.
    They may as well start putting some serious permanent transport logistics in place, this is going to the only factor between blackouts and keeping the lights on.
    These people appear to not understand how a world carbon system works.
    Maybe they have lived in a bubble for to long.
    I wonder if Neve has been given a toy coal truck to play with. Maybe I should send her one.
    
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    June 28, 2021 9:08am
    - sooty
      
      No, but they do have a clown car!
      
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      June 28, 2021 9:54am
    - Jack5
      
      Greg’s … ships it [coal] from Indonesia to save the planet, then trucks it to Huntly.
      
      And Huntly sits on a coalfield.
      
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      June 28, 2021 1:56pm
      - Nickc2
        
        Typical University type lecturer thinking I’m afraid. It doesn’t have to make sense or pass any plausible analysis so long as it satisfies a bunch of easily lead students who will believe it no matter what.
        Unfortunately, we are currently governed by a bunch of these wankers who can’t or won’t rationalise such stupidity.
        Let’s face it, coal is coal FFS and it doesn’t matter where it comes from but shouldn’t we be considering the cost of importing the stuff against using our own supply of it.
        
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        June 28, 2021 2:22pm
  - Maxx
    
    He’ll have to sing via zoom then – no way Ardern gets the borders reopened intime and I can’t see Ed spending two weeks in MIQ with microwaved meals.
    
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    June 28, 2021 9:35am
    - alwyn
      
      If the PM wants the borders to be opened for her friends they will be opened.
      Just remember Moses parting the Red Sea. I’m sure she is just as good as he was.
      
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      June 28, 2021 11:59am
- krazykiwi
  
  This is good stuff from Collins. I want to see her go for the jugular on anything and everything that threatens civil liberties.
  
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  June 28, 2021 12:11pm
surfing

The covid vaccine rollout is a national disgrace!

Will it get better? My hopes are not high given labour’s track record.
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June 28, 2021 8:33am
Maggie Pie

I’m not exactly sure how many ‘Labor Governments’ we’ve had in New Zealand?
But this Variant seems a lot worse than the last.

You get the feeling it could be a long road back if it takes hold 🙁
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June 28, 2021 8:34am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  You get the feeling it could be a long road back if it takes hold
  
  I think this variety of Labour has been genetically modified in an identity politic Lab.
  
  It is rampant throughout the country with major hotspots in the major cities.
  
  There’s corpses of small businesses throughout.
  
  I’m not sure what we can do…
  I wash thoroughly after dealing with the infected.
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:42am
  - Frank the tank
    
    Has lingering effects on the mental capacity of of the feeble minded…..
    
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    June 28, 2021 9:09am
  - oldfella
    
    Maggy, this variant is believed to have been created by a woman wearing a bat costume. I don’t believe that.
    I suspect the culprit is a woman wearing the head and front half of a pantomime horse.
    I have no idea who is playing the arse-end of that horse.
    
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    June 28, 2021 11:18am
- Gravelroad
  
  Actually in times past the Labour Party in government had some competent and clever people.
  I might not have not have always agreed with their policies, but generally they were professionals – albeit with a cause.
  Wouldn’t be appropriate today though as they were almost all stale, pale males!
  
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  June 28, 2021 11:26am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    I only just saw the last stages of the Clark government. But I think she would have competently rolled out the vaccine.
    
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    June 28, 2021 1:55pm
Paulus

This is serious, I read yesterday that it is considered possible hate speech is used by Dr McCaskill in Shortland Street.
That will have to change – now !
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June 28, 2021 8:34am
- pdm
  
  Well I saw yesterday some University has cancelled a Charlie Chaplin show because it is offensive.
  
  Ask yourself – woke, woke, woke.
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:52am
  - Gravelroad
    
    Yes, you would have thought Canterbury University inmates would have had more sense.
    Cancelling a musical entertainment because of what the person might have done (“womanising”ffs) decades ago is meaningless.
    And then to replace a show about Charlie Chaplin and replace it with one about the ridiculous and juvenile Addams Family indicates a certain lack of mature judgement.
    
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    June 28, 2021 9:23am
    - oldfella
      
      Gravelroad, re universities and mature judgement, imagine if they cancelled the Chaplin show and instead restaged a genuine, 1970s Capping concert?
      
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      June 28, 2021 11:22am
    - Bob
      
      lack of mature judgement….. associated with a University!!!!
      Surely such a thought-mature judgment in an university- is an OXYMORON?
      
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      June 28, 2021 11:48am
    - Nickc2
      
      Since has womanising been a crime? Geez, if you don’t notice or pay attention to them, they will have you cancelled.
      They don’t go through all that dress-up, fashion and make-up stuff for nothing.
      No doubt saying this will get me cancelled.
      
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      June 28, 2021 12:11pm
      - Paulus
        
        I believe that Martin Luther King was not known to be a simple dutiful husband, as well as an idol.
        
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        June 28, 2021 1:46pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Are yes…
    The man who wrote these words must be cancelled:
    
    Soldiers! don’t give yourselves to brutes – men who despise you – enslave you – who regiment your lives – tell you what to do – what to think and what to feel! Who drill you – diet you – treat you like cattle, use you as cannon fodder. Don’t give yourselves to these unnatural men – machine men with machine minds and machine hearts! You are not machines! You are not cattle! You are men! You have the love of humanity in your hearts! You don’t hate! Only the unloved hate – the unloved and the unnatural! Soldiers! Don’t fight for slavery! Fight for liberty!
    
    https://www.charliechaplin.com/en/articles/29-the-final-speech-from-the-great-dictator-
    
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    June 28, 2021 9:33am
- Yvette
  
  If disrespectful references to Muhammed are unacceptable, as they demean a minority group in New Zealand, why not consider the blasphemy of Christ’s name on locally produced programmes that show at 7pm on state run and owned television, and must be offensive to a similar group, becoming a minority, partly perhaps through the normalising of blasphemy, as one small factor?
  
  Are Ardern, Little and Faafoi, having got themselves in this shit, going to be consistent?
  
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  June 28, 2021 9:06am
  - Maxx
    
    Too true. It appears that there is no determinant on what hate speech is, only that it is speech that is towards a group and illicits harm. As an example, I don’t like McDonalds advertising, it encourages me to eat unhealthy food (actually I don’t care, I can make my own decisions) which is harmful to me, and I am sure I could find enough people who agree.
    
    Everyone is in many ways offended by other people/groups. Most of us learnt in primary school what the difference is between someone who is an areshole and someone who wants to cause us harm. We already have laws for the later.
    
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    June 28, 2021 9:44am
  - rouppe
    
    Prophet! Rouse the believers to wage war. If there are twenty amongst you, patient and persevering, they will subdue two hundred: if a hundred, they will subdue a thousand of the disbelievers: for these are a people without understanding.
    
    This is a call to all Muslims for violence against all non Muslims.
    
    If this hate speech law goes through then this must be stricken from the Koran. Surely?
    
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    June 28, 2021 12:31pm
- Yvette
  
  And, Paulus, here is another –
  
  OPINION: The New Zealand-Australia bubble has closed completely for the first time and hundreds of Kiwis are stranded.
  It will be closed for three days initially but shut to New South Wales for longer.
  But firstly, to New South Wales Premier Gladys Berejiklian who doesn’t believe in lockdowns – what a d**k move to do nothing for weeks. These COVID-19 cases are on your head due to your grandiose position … – Duncan Garner
  
  That this is questionable speech (communication) is indicated by the use of asterisks, as Newshub obviously has doubt about boldy printing “dick”, which, in applying this term to a woman (even an Australian named Gladys) is in this context intended to demean her, but also denigrates all males – actually a minority group in New Zealand – and disparages their attributes.
  As do so many television ads which depict men as idiots, but women not quite so stupid.
  
  Are Ardern, Little and Faafoi, having got themselves in this shit, going to be consistent?
  
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  June 28, 2021 9:40am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    They don’t have that gift.
    Ardern and her govt are quietly self dismantling. Ardern offended God and there will a price to pay. Promoting Muslims against Christians in New Zealand was not wise.
    
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    June 28, 2021 10:38am
  - kowtow
    
    Docrap Gurner is a total prat .
    
    Gladys was doing her utmost to keep her head , keep things going as normal as pos , and that can only be the right thing .
    
    Docrap Gurner has earned himself a place in the pantheon of pro pandemic pricks.
    
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    June 28, 2021 11:09am
Happychappy

Another out of touch and heartless Minister that thinks his smart uncalled quips should satisfy parents and families wanting closure on their loved ones is what they need.
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics.html
Maybe 3 years, maybe 18 years quip about fixing colonial inquests wait times outrages families.
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June 28, 2021 8:38am
- alex Masterley
  
  The Minister is a complete waste of space.
  The reported comments are uncalled for. Shows his lack of ability.
  
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  June 28, 2021 9:23am
- hullkiwi
  
  ….and where is the caring government with its Aroha?
  
  As usual, Cindy and her mob can mouth what they want us to think, but reality is something different!
  
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  June 28, 2021 10:13am
JibberJabber

#stoppedclock

Tova O’Brien
@TovaOBrien
·
43m
The Prime Minister trying to shut down debate on hate speech on

David Seymour
@dbseymour
On the AM Show, Jacinda Ardern made 4 inaccurate statements about Govt’s new hate speech laws:

– This is about speech that incites violence
– Political opinion will not be covered
– It’s just a discussion document
– Govt is doing this because Royal Commission recommended it.@TheAMShowNZ

isn’t a great way to start the consultation on proposed changes
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June 28, 2021 8:41am
- KevO'Brien
  
  Biden’s doing it with the govt in the USA too:
  https://noqreport.com/2021/06/27/biden-quietly-signed-race-conscious-executive-order-that-will-destroy-americas-government/
  
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  June 28, 2021 10:39am
- oldfella
  
  JJ, I heard Cindy this morning and she kept saying that it was only about bringing religion into the hate speech tent.
  Does that mean that if a local Iman says something other Kiwis perceive as hateful, they could complain, or would Muslim leaders, and followers, get a free pass?
  Oh, what a sh*t storm this govt has started with this whole hate speech discussion. I look forward to the whole thing imploding.
  
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  June 28, 2021 11:33am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Is Cinders going full out to protect the Muslim community in their attempt to remove Christians as per their Prophets instruction manual?
    
    Further is she entering into the Christian churches freedom of religion arena? That is protected by the NZ Bill of Rights. There are some churches which rigorously affirm, as do the Scriptures, that “male and female” he made them.
    Anyone can be offended by almost anything. We do not have a State mandated religion in NZ, unlike the Muslim world.
    
    Ardern may not be aware that trying to remove the God as revealed through His Son Jesus Christ will cause offence in a higher place than she can control. The nation may be held accountable too with possible punitive consequences. She is putting herself and New Zealand in a very difficult place. She needs to repent.
    
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    June 28, 2021 1:24pm
- Nickc2
  
  He Puapua was supposed to be a discussion document too. However, our Govt is covertly enacting it without reference to the people of NZ.
  I’m picking hate speech laws will be passed in the dead of night and we won’t know anything about them until someone is arrested for breaches thereof.
  
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  June 28, 2021 12:24pm
Greg Ettridge

Here is some sound advice for Ashley Robin Bloomfield.
If you want to stop the fear and scaring people, do as Singapore is doing.
Only report Hospital and deaths, no cases.
They have 20 to 30 cases a day, 313 active cases, but life goes on, 80 flights a day.
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June 28, 2021 8:43am
- JibberJabber
  
  Bloomfield is a puppet, he’ll say what he is told to say. It’s a nice little earner for him, without having to do sweet FA.
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:47am
  - Paulus
    
    Last salary I saw for Bloomfield is $528,000, that is just higher than Ardern, but may have had a large Public Service increase since.
    
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    June 28, 2021 11:34am
- Frank the tank
  
  What accept that KuFlu is endemic like the ‘flu’?
  
  That’s crazy talk in (little) Aotearoa.
  
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  June 28, 2021 9:12am
Yvette

Tova O’Brien asked Kris Faafoi if strengthening the laws on speech will prevent another attack like the March 15 mosques massacres. Faafoi’s reply is, “That’s the intent. I think stopping that fermenting of behaviour in our communities, the one thing about March 15 is someone acted on their opinions and hatred of a particular group.”

In the Guardian’s version the headline is “New Zealand moves to toughen hate speech laws in wake of Christchurch attacks” and next: “Justice minister says allowing people to continue to spread hatred could lead to a repeat of mosque terror attacks”.

It has been often observed that Tarrant actually said very little – not any real “hate speech” that bought him to anyone’s attention – until he emailed his manifesto to over 30 recipients, including the Prime Minister’s office, but by the time Police were advised of those emails, the attack had taken place.

So in truth it would seem the Government is trying to address matters like Islamophobia and racism, which were referred to by many addressing the Royal Commission, and which existed in parallel to the shooting tragedy, but as abusive language were not expressed as part of the heinous event.

Perhaps a little more honesty, integrity and transparency around this could be helpful, when “hate speech” itself is a moral matter.
One reason why “hate speech” is damaging is surely an element of untruth. So what is the Government doing when they would foist this on us in a way that is not truthful?

Extremely ironically, “hate speech” had little to do with Tarrant.
The Government is bullshitting us.

And fucking dangerously misguided. If you stop people expressing themselves, prevent them from testing their ideas against the reality of others opinion, if you bottle their thoughts up for them to run misconceptions around and around in their own heads, untrue as they may be they solidify into beliefs, then you will have another Tarrant loose.
And perhaps not saying anything … but just eventually acting.

Instead of “hate speech” laws, the Government needs to look more at mental health and wellbeing – where they are failing abysmally with non-delivery … yet again.
_______
Tarrant reputedly selected his victim group for their greater birth rate, not so much religion, in his perception of the “Great Replacement” of his European culture – and as Europe is diverse, it makes him not a ‘white supremest’, but a ‘European supremest’, if any label can be attached.
Because of the very fact he didn’t indulge in notable hate speech, and as his manifesto is denied public examination, few people are aware of why he exacted his atrocity (and further confused by his selecting the wrong country – where no great replacement has yet occurred)
Is the Government using this ignorance to their advance of their agenda – shutting down free speech?
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June 28, 2021 8:46am
- Maxx
  
  And what is not talked about is that we already have laws that could have acted and prevented this but the dots weren’t joined or acted upon.
  
  As always Labours solution is to whack it with a sledgehammer without any thoughts of the repercussions. Job done – what else can we spend money on?
  
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  June 28, 2021 9:48am
cas

I watched that train wreck interview on Newshub Nation yesterday with Kris Faafoi and also watched a film on the musos from laurel canyon.

So under our proposed law, if the Mamas and the Papas sing “And no-one’s getting fat except Mama Cass” that is not hate speech but if they sing “and no-one’s getting fat except Mama Cass and her friends” that is hate speech?
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June 28, 2021 8:48am
Bobba Fret

So the “year of delivery” is finally starting with the vaccine roll out?
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June 28, 2021 8:49am
- sooty
  
  Nah, in ya dreams!
  
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  June 28, 2021 9:58am
- WellingtonBFF
  
  2019 was the year of delivery. 2021 is the year of the vaccine. If we are lucky 2022 will be the year of the delivery of the vaccine……
  
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  June 28, 2021 10:43am
  - Bob
    
    and if we are even luckier, and with a lot of deep thinking by the so called educated electors, we will be delivered a competent govt in 2023!!
    
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    June 28, 2021 9:05pm
Rich Prick

Why is Wellington still enduring alert level 2? I think the control freaks are busy getting their jollies.
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June 28, 2021 8:53am
- KevO'Brien
  
  Level 4 being prepared for the Delta variant ?
  Fauci & Co are busy dissing anything other that what they have a commercial interest in.
  
  The NWO (WEF) want a permanent lock down so they can continue with their grand plans to take you over as their serfs or get rid of you if deemed economically useless.
  
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  June 28, 2021 10:46am
Maggie Pie

LIKE FATHER LIKE SON 🙁

It’s no wonder Hunter Biden is such a racist twat.

This vid of his dad is doing the rounds again on Twitter.
A reporter asked Creepy Joe what he meant by the term…… “Roaches”?
Joe refused to answer.

According to historians, the word was coined back in the 60’s and referenced…. ‘Black children’

WATCH: (full screen / sound up)

https://youtu.be/3DbE2SmV2bs
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June 28, 2021 8:54am
Maggy Wassilieff

How successive Governments in NZ have conspired to hide the truth about mismanagement and torture of children at Lake Alice Hospital:

https://www.newsroom.co.nz/first-they-were-tortured-then-the-state-failed-them
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June 28, 2021 8:56am
- KevO'Brien
  
  Why should Lake Alice be better than the boys homes who kept kids in solitary without even underclothes for weeks? Sadists are everywhere.
  
  Is it going to be hate speech top denounce them?
  
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  June 28, 2021 10:49am
Maggy Wassilieff

I’ve had to swim in an outdoor pool for the last few months….but at least it’s heated.

Not too sure if I’ll go to the next step of regular open water swimming in winter.

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2021/jun/27/heather-massey-open-water-swimming-tips-dangers-hypothermia
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June 28, 2021 9:04am
kowtow

Our Media Pardy keep us updated on the tragic collapse of the Florida building .

But these things happen all the time in places like India and Egypt , and while such incidents are reported , we’re not kept updated or given details as per the Florida incident .

Clearly a racist media who pay waaaay more attention to white priveliged neo colonial tragedies than they do to , ahem , others.
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June 28, 2021 9:06am
I remember when

What has rugby become.
Harlequins have beaten Exeter to win the Premiership at the weekend .
Photos of their celebrations at the end of the game show the players in near spotless mostly white jerseys.
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June 28, 2021 9:07am
- mandk
  
  Drainage and grass technology have improved dramatically over the past 20 years or so.
  
  Fortunately, we just don’t see the mud baths we used to.
  
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  June 28, 2021 10:51am
  - zulumonster
    
    Yes, drainage and grass technology are factors … also note the game was played in the middle of summer!
    
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    June 28, 2021 1:35pm
Durden

Isn’t writer of this article Donna Miles, originally Donna Miles-Mojab, seeking to take advantage of white privilege by changing her name in the byline while opining that the term white privilege is not divisive ?

Delicious irony here.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/opinion/125554995/is-white-privilege-really-a-divisive-term

Her and Golriz G are the ultimate con artists. As is Behrooz B.
https://thespinoff.co.nz/author/donna-milesmohab/
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June 28, 2021 9:13am
- Tall Man
  
  “con artists” …. You are far too kind methinks.
  
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  June 28, 2021 10:52am
- James Stephenson
  
  I’d like her to go and talk to teenage girls on council estates in places like Telford and Rotherham, whose safety was sacrificed on the altar of Political Correctness, as they were abandoned to the abuse of muslim grooming gangs, that they have “white priviledge”.
  
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  June 28, 2021 11:44am
Frank the tank

So – everybody else enthused about having the favorite takeaway in a cardboard container.

I’m still getting used to sucking in cardboard when I get a milkshake or a smoothie.

I guess we get plastic tarpaulins for our front seat when picking up takeaways…….
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June 28, 2021 9:17am
- Maggie Pie
  
  I read where McDonalds are currently trialing reusable Ivory straws.
  
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  June 28, 2021 9:37am
- Flossie
  
  My favourite takeaway comes as it always has – wrapped in newspaper!
  Admittedly I can’t actually read it, as it’s an Asian language edition.
  
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  June 28, 2021 10:43am
I remember when

How long can we continue to have lockdowns to prevent covid outbreaks.
In Queenstown they are commenting on the economic outcomes rather than the dangers of covid.
Remember when it was just a matter of waiting until we found a vaccine.
Then it was – just wait to see if the latest variant is controlled by the vaccines.
In the background there is always the – what happens next year. How much long term immunity will vaccines and having had covid provide.
Will we need a booster every year. Is it possible to expect a organised rollout every year.
Are we starting to understand that eventually we have to accept that there will always be some sort of risk.
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June 28, 2021 9:21am
- MCos
  
  Queenstown isn’t in lockdown. You can go there any time you want and spend your money.
  Problem is Kiwis are stingy.
  
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  June 28, 2021 9:46am
  - sooty
    
    Yes but it does have a reputation of nz most expensive place, so people bypass it!
    
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    June 28, 2021 10:06am
    - MCos
      
      It does have that reputation.
      However.
      Back in April I stayed in an AirBRB with three of my family for $180/night with a fabulous view of the Remarkables.
      Mind you traffic was bad in the CBD, but in the surrounding area it was fine, Arrowtown was great etc.
      
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      June 28, 2021 10:53am
  - Tall Man
    
    What a load of crap. Do you hate all Kiwis or just those that aren’t millionaires like yourself …….
    
    Queenstown has styled itself on overseas demand and targeted overseas visitors. There are also transport limits plus many other options for Kiwis whereas International travel was a doorway to Queenstown.
    
    Maybe look at the entire picture before gobbing off.
    
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    June 28, 2021 10:48am
    - MCos
      
      Anyone who owns a freehold house in Auckland is a millionaire.
      There’s plenty of money around, but people don’t seem to want to spend it on bungee jumps.
      
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      June 28, 2021 12:13pm
  - SmokerGuy
    
    Stingy???? I don’t mind paying for tourist attractions but some of the prices charged down there are outrageous.
    
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    June 28, 2021 11:27am
    - krazykiwi
      
      Penal rates, Tangi leave, creeping minimum wage, H&S overreach, various compliance obligations and red tape, skills shortages, wage inflation, more public holidays, more sick leave…. not all of the outrageousness stems from operator greed.
      
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      June 28, 2021 12:29pm
Maggie Pie

A twitter-bestie chips in with her thoughts on the Matt Hancock affair 😛

https://twitter.com/Victori16532731/status/1409224499418091522
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June 28, 2021 9:31am
- JibberJabber
  
  Whatever you do, don’t go looking for the meme Lawrence Fox posted on his twitter acc about Hancock ?
  
  Can’t post a link, I’d get a holiday …
  
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  June 28, 2021 1:57pm
Maxx

I read the article on the Herald America’s Cup poll: How Kiwis feel about the Government’s $99m bid to keep Cup in NZ (paywalled) out of curiosity.

What I found telling, but not a surprise was that young people were more inclined to support this at any cost compared to those over 60 who thought the Governments offer was about right. To me shows that there is either a low understanding of finance or an apathy towards being fiscally responsible.

Perhaps a reflection that the this is why they support a Government spending large without any thought that they will be paying the bill for this tomorrow.
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June 28, 2021 9:56am
- Paulus
  
  The young believe that there is money for everything as they have never known real need, but only a bank card.
  New Zealand today is awash with bucket loads of cash – borrowed by our elected Government for which they are going to have to start paying back soon.
  
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  June 28, 2021 1:55pm
I remember when

Just a thought about the use of the burqa.
When was the last time, if ever if you are young enough, you saw clothing used as a sign of modesty and purity.
How many nuns have you seen in their old style habits lately.
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June 28, 2021 9:56am
- MCos
  
  You mean apart from Gloriavale?
  
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  June 28, 2021 10:42am
  - graham
    
    Better be careful, when those hate speech laws come in I fear that everybody who has said anything about Gloriavale will be accused of “inciting hatred against a protected group” and could – according to our esteemed Justice Minister – could lead to a repeat of mosque terror attacks.
    
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    June 28, 2021 11:48am
    - MCos
      
      I don’t think the criticizing Gloriavale is ever going to be an issue. After all there’s plenty to work with, as there is with the way a lot of the followers of most churches behave.
      The issue is stuff such as screaming at people in the street, because of their mode of dress, for example.
      
      I wonder where freedom to wear what one chooses comes in to all of this?
      
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      June 28, 2021 3:04pm
Maggie Pie

I’ll tell you what we did watch last night, which was extremely moving AND very sad….the interview on Sunday with Sir Bob Parker and his beautiful wife Jo.
Lady Jo has been Bob’s ‘rock’ since his devastating Stroke….and what an abfab Lady she is!
So caring and understanding. I’m not sure if I could ever do it.

Actually, I don’t recall having seen Jo before, but you could tell straight away she’s the type of person we would welcome as a member of the Tennis Club if they ever shifted to Remuera. Wouldn’t even need to make a formal application to join.

We remember Sir Bob of course as ‘the voice of calm & reason’ in the aftermath of the quake, giving people hope and solace.
Although Jo was saying, he still came in for a lot of abuse and criticisim which weighed heavily on his mind.
She related one particular incident, when he met with a delegation from Japan, some of whom were related to the Japanese students who died in the collapse of the CTV building.
According to Jo, they called Bob…. a Murderer! This was something he never forgot.

My partner was quick to remark… “Doesn’t sound like any of the delegation would have seen Merry Christmas Mister Lawrence then”
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June 28, 2021 10:45am
dave_c_

Ha !
Fear and scare-mongering porn is alive and well in the MSM.
$$tuff this morning reporting :
‘The Pfizer vaccine is safe and effective. Covid-19 is deadly.”
Wot ? Not so long ago we were being told that the recovery rate (withouth any special treatment) is in the order of magnitude >99 percent
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June 28, 2021 10:55am
Jack5

Donna Miles, formerly known to Stuff readers as Donna Miles-Mojab, swings her Stuff column today away from a purely Woke stand to attribute world problems to neo-liberalism:

”What divides us is the neoliberal system that creates class, race, sexuality and gender divisions in order to continue to consolidate power in the hands of a few.”

Donna’s a fine looking person, and might have shone on television in a country with a further-Left regime but without anti-female prejudices. Her very white appearance and heritage from Iran, land of the Aryans, has until now contrasted with some of her views on Wokeness and BLM-type topics.

Perhaps, Donna’s political views are changing with maturity, as happens to most of us. It’s an occurrence in line with a famous saying that may or may not have started with Disraeli:

A man who is not a Liberal at sixteen has no heart; a man who is not a Conservative at sixty has no head.

This epigram has been attributed to many people since about the time of the French Revolution. The fact that it uses “man” rather than “person” is evidence of its age.

Who said it first?

https://quoteinvestigator.com/2014/02/24/heart-head/
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June 28, 2021 10:57am
Michael

Talking about Maorification.
The use or should I say incorrect use of the word Aotearoa is a classic example. Winston Peters is on to it. Maori never had a name for this archipelago. The first name it was given was New Zeeland by the explorer Abel Tasman. Then along came Captain Cook and he decided to anglicise the name to New Zealand. Aotearoa may have been the Maori name for the North Island and surrounding islands but there is considerable doubt about that. Maori had different names for the North and South Islands. Aotea was the name for Great Barrier Island.
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June 28, 2021 10:58am
- MCos
  
  Abel Tasman called it “Staten Landt”, changed to “Nieuw Zeeland” by Dutch cartographers when they reviewed his maps.
  He named Australia “Nova Hollandia”.
  James Cook changed it to “New Zealand” (a bit like changing beetles to Beatles.)
  Aotearoa as an alternate name for the entirety of NZ seems to date back to William Pember Reeves, MP, in 1898.
  
  Winston seems to have a list of talking points he knows will wind up his (& ACT’s) base and Aotearoa is one of them.
  
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  June 28, 2021 1:57pm
- NoFax
  
  It seems to me that using “Aoteroa” is anti Te Tiriti. Surely, “Nu Tirani” is correct if we are to follow the Te Tiriti.
  
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  June 28, 2021 5:00pm
Fletch

Alan Jones on SKY News on the overreaction by the Australian govt to Covid etc…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nL105z3Ul4g
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June 28, 2021 11:01am
Scooter

So the Akl Rarotonga flight had no fuel to circle around after the aborted landing but could fly back to NZ, can someone explain that? Or were there covid passengers on board?
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June 28, 2021 11:17am
- greybeard
  
  Reminds me of that old anecdote about the man trying to swim the English Channel: he got to within a mile of France but realised he wasn’t going to make it so he turned back.
  
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  June 28, 2021 11:33am
- James Stephenson
  
  Enough fuel to get back to Auckland, if they made the instant decision to go, but little enough that they’d be up shit creek if they circled for a bit and still couldn’t land at Raro?
  
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  June 28, 2021 12:13pm
- alwyn
  
  Planes always have to have enough fuel aboard to fly to an alternate airport where they can safely land.
  For Rarotonga that may be Auckland.
  The runway at Tonga may be long enough but it probably isn’t strong enough.
  The plane will therefore have to turn back to Auckland while it still has sufficient fuel to get there. If they were to go around again and still not be able to land they could be below that minimum fuel value.
  
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  June 28, 2021 12:22pm
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  Don’t know why it couldn’t go to Apia and wait for the winds to die down.
  
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  June 28, 2021 12:32pm
- MCos
  
  Presumably if it landed elsewhere all the passengers would have to quarantine for 14 days, if it was able to land at all.
  
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  June 28, 2021 12:40pm
Maggie Pie

Don’t know if anyone else picked up on this…..

Ma was just telling me she listened to the ‘Political Hour’ on Magic yesterday morning. Heard Greg O’Connor say that the reason for the delay in us receiving the Pfizer vaccine, was because the government had originally committed to AstraZeneca before changing their minds later in the negotiations.

She reckoned the National MP on the show, was all over GregO like batshit in a Wuhan lab.
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June 28, 2021 11:45am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  That wouldn’t be hard. GregO is the biggest goose in a room full of geese.
  
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  June 28, 2021 12:36pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  I reckon a lot of vaccines got shipped to the ‘Islands’
  The C130 has been quite active – and for what else?
  Jacinda 1 and 2 have been active as well. What would I know? Can’t fly my drone – inside the Whenuapai geofence, but I was not inside 4 years ago …
  
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  June 28, 2021 6:53pm
Fletch

Joe Biden from 2012 & 2016 compared with Joe Biden today. Joe’s not “all there” today…

https://youtu.be/RiiP2ZLc_jM?t=92
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June 28, 2021 11:48am
Durden

Looks like the penny has dropped finally for journalists that their reputation has dropped below that of garden variety pimps.

That is why Tracy Watkins is now trying to pretend that she is asking the government tough questions? She also seems to be blaming “people” supposedly calling media “negative” for questions they have never asked ?

https://www.stuff.co.nz/opinion/300342943/covid19-nz-why-is-the-vaccine-rollout-so-slow

“Far too many people seem to be intolerant of any questions by the media as “negative”; many would happily close the borders again, rather than question the sense of that in a world where these sorts of scares are going to be commonplace, or why we are falling so far behind.”

” We have a proud history of questioning authority in this country; we should be forcing the Government to front every day on the reasons why people who were supposed to have been vaccinated by now, aren’t.
And we need to keep asking till it happens.”

This follows Patrick Crewdson’s (Stuff editor in chief) pathetic attempt making excuses and trying to explain their stance in:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/about-stuff/125478666/the-backstory-why-government-money-doesnt-corrupt-our-journalism

It won’t be easy to regain the reputation and trust lost by their abject capitulation to Ardern government’s bullying and lying.
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June 28, 2021 11:49am
- curry4me
  
  Durden: It’s permanently lost for the MSM.
  
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  June 28, 2021 2:55pm
- david
  
  Explaining is losing Tracy.
  
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  June 28, 2021 10:02pm
UrbanNeocolonialist

Did a little digging yesterday on vaccine benefits. Seems that they reduce risk of death from covid to about 5% of unvaccinated. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7996517/
Assuming 0.5% unvaccinated IFR then that is about .025% IFR in a vaccinated population. Flu IFR is up to about 0.1%

But then consider the list of drugs that appear to reduce covid risk of death if taken early or prophylactically; Vitamin D, hydroxychloroquine, ivermectin, fluvoxamine, proxalutamide and a few others. Accumulated trial and analysis data https://c19early.com/ suggest they reduce risk of death by 50-90% individually, and it is possible that in combination they will be even better. If true that isn’t far off being competitive with vaccination for risk reduction.

That might change the maths on who should be taking vaccines, particularly given health risks from vaccination to young men and as yet unknown impacts on female fertility (vaccine components accumulate strongly in ovaries with as yet unknown long term impacts). Though vaccination still seems to be the best choice for older adults.

Is that why there has seemingly been such a strong FUD campaign from medical establishment against drugs for Covid risk reduction in the west? and a complete failure to promote ultra-safe risk reductions like Vitamin D supplements (that would perhaps threaten vaccine emergency use authorisations)
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June 28, 2021 11:59am
Fletch

NewsHub reporter tries to get a straight answer from Chris Faafoi about what would and would not constitute “hate speech”….

https://twitter.com/dbseymour/status/1408634688747438081?s=19

It’s clear he doesn’t even really know. And if he doesn’t, how will the police?
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June 28, 2021 12:00pm
- kiwikidsnz
  
  Tova’s now onto it,
  https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2021/06/tova-o-brien-jacinda-ardern-has-misled-the-public-and-shut-down-debate-on-hate-speech-laws.html
  
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  June 28, 2021 12:53pm
  - Yabster
    
    wow Toxic criticising The Princess – whats happening here..? She said Ardern was making it up as she goes- not for the first time.
    
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    June 28, 2021 1:47pm
    - curry4me
      
      Yabster: The MSM have to give the appearance of not being paid government shills.
      
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      June 28, 2021 2:57pm
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Good thing it is only Ardern, and not Clinton ….
      
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      June 28, 2021 6:47pm
- MCos
  
  Therein lies the problem with that legislation.
  On the one hand one would expect definitive guidelines, but on the other opponents of the law would undoubtedly cross the line in numbers to prove it was unworkable.
  
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  June 28, 2021 1:08pm
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    Clearly the intention is to get a law in place that can eventually be used to send people to jail for criticising the Labour Government.
    Let’s get rid of these bastards while we still have time.
    
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    June 28, 2021 2:44pm
    - MCos
      
      The closest we’ve come to that scenario was during the waterfront strike under the first National government & there’s no chance anyone will be gaoled for merely criticizing anyone.
      
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      June 28, 2021 4:12pm
      - Steve Otto(North Shore)
        
        22,000 members of the Waterside Workers’ Union and other sympathetic labour groups involved.
        Under National, yes. Commies striking? Yes!
        MCos is a dodgy one, you should have asked Jaspinda before you commented Comrade
        
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        June 28, 2021 7:01pm
      - MCos
        
        You’re fuzzing the issue by calling me ‘dodgy’ & referring to ‘Jaspinda’.
        The strikers were denied freedom of speech, shock horror & it was an offense to give food to their kids.
        At the time that turned out to be a big vote winner, of course.
        Tell me, Steve, in the highly unlikely situation something similar occurred today would you want the government to act in the same way?
        
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        June 28, 2021 7:53pm
surfing

I see Ardern is now saying that vaccines are not really the answer to covid.

Personally, I completely disagree…. they’ve had tremendous success in the UK, even against the delta variant.

Even though infection rates are rising, fatalities are down because the vaccine lessens the severity.
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June 28, 2021 12:40pm
- Fletch
  
  OK, but most of Israel has now been vaccinated and yet, with this new variant, they are reimposing mask restrictions.
  
  TEL AVIV—About half of adults infected in an outbreak of the Delta variant of Covid-19 in Israel were fully inoculated with the Pfizer Inc. vaccine, prompting the government to reimpose an indoor mask requirement and other measures to contain the highly transmissible strain.
  
  https://www.wsj.com/articles/vaccinated-people-account-for-half-of-new-covid-19-delta-cases-in-israeli-outbreak-11624624326
  
  So it’s kind of like, what is the point?
  
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  June 28, 2021 1:18pm
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  vaccines are almost certainly the answer – so long as they are well tested and safe. But it does not clear to me that giving them to kids (1 in a million risk of death from covid) and teenagers (1 in 300000) or young adults (1 in 100000) who are at very low risk from Covid is in their best interest (even if it helps contribute to population herd immunity), particularly given reports on serious adverse reactions and deaths in many youngsters.
  
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  June 28, 2021 1:41pm
  - tf78
    
    They are not well tested as they are still in the experimental stage and still not verified by the FDA.
    
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    June 28, 2021 6:52pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Not taking an experimental vax after recent anaphylaxis. No way until Fauci, Gates, Biden, Ardern, Woods, Hipkins, Wiles, Bloomfield, Baker, Hendy, all stop telling lies.
  Shall I add more? Google is your source all you leftie sheeple
  
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  June 28, 2021 6:45pm
Maggie Pie

TRENDING TWITTER…..

Joe Biden is more confused than Michelle Obama’s gynecologist.
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June 28, 2021 12:47pm
- curry4me
  
  Maggie Pie: Priceless. For everything else, there’s Visa.
  
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  June 28, 2021 3:00pm
thirteenstars

Full text of the latest Free Speech Union update:

The more that our elected lawmakers talk about the proposed “hate speech” laws, the more concerned I become. And the more I want them to talk about it to highlight the folly of their scheme

Yesterday our Minister of Justice, Kris Faafoi, gave an interview in which he couldn’t say that millennials wouldn’t risk 3 years in jail if they blamed boomers for not being able to afford a house.

Tova O’Brien asked him about other examples – like if Israel Folau could be imprisoned for stating his belief that homosexuals are going to hell. Minister Faafoi couldn’t say whether or not the proposed law would apply. He didn’t know “hate speech” when it was presented to him.

And this morning our Prime Minister told us the proposed law was to clarify the existing legislation. She claimed it was to stop incitement to violence against groups, but political opinion would not be included as a protected category.

This makes no sense. Incitement to violence is already a crime. As it should be. Against anyone, whether in a group or not.

She omitted to explain that the dangerous changes are about “incitement to discrimination and hostility” against groups. They want to criminalise speech that is perceived as abusive or insulting.

All to enhance “community cohesion”.

These are the word tools used to oppress and abuse incumbent power the world over. The establishment gets to decide what is abusive or insulting, to determine what might incite to discriminate, and they get to prosecute, convict and punish with all the power and resources of the state, often with secret or suppressed evidence. As we faced in the Auckland High Court at the hands of Auckland Council last week.

The real proposals have nothing to do with incitement to violence. Either the Prime Minister knew that, and was actively seeking to deceive, or she has no idea what she is doing.

We stand firmly with the current law, and its protection of all, including political groups, against incitement to violence. We cannot imagine why our PM wants to allow incitement to violence against people with a certain political opinion? Who does she have in mind as the targets?

We are delighted to hear that both ACT and National will reverse the law, should it pass. We believe we’ve already had an influence – our standing up for free speech has helped ensure the two parties were ready to be clear and definite on Labour’s scheme when it was announced.

They need to go further now and commit to fixing the law National left in place that is being abused by enemies of free speech.

https://www.fsu.nz/
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June 28, 2021 1:09pm
- thirteenstars
  
  Apropos image:
  
  Credit: https://www.rightminds.nz/
  
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  June 28, 2021 1:45pm
kowtow

“Aotearoa” in a nut shell .

You couldn’t make this shit up.

“The teenage demonstrator had blocked the entrance of the car park and said they would only allow hybrid and electric vehicles to access the facility.

A driver who was denied access verbally abused the teenager, who reported to police that they felt threatened by the driver’s behaviour.

A police spokesman said the driver apologised for their actions to the protester after officers attended the scene.”

https://www.odt.co.nz/news/dunedin/protest-becomes-heated-teen-blocks-petrol-cars
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June 28, 2021 1:12pm
- thirteenstars
  
  Oh, and won’t that 14-year-old know exactly how to use the hate speech laws.
  
  It’s sickening that government schools (they are no longer public schools) have been churning out these activists for years, it’s even more so when the government enables them with laws that give them the power to shut down debate.
  
  But that’s always been the goal.
  
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  June 28, 2021 1:38pm
- Durden
  
  The driver shouldn’t have apologised. I hope there is video.
  
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  June 28, 2021 1:43pm
  - kowtow
    
    My limited knowledge of the law tells me that that was not a “protest” . It was an offence under common law ( obstructing the Queens’ Highway), at least and the Cops should have ( if they didn’t) let the snotty nosed brat know in no uncertain terms that he/she /it would be seeing the inside of the watch house should they pull that stunt again .
    
    And any apologies should have been directed to the members of the public inconvenienced by said prat.
    
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    June 28, 2021 2:52pm
- alloytoo
  
  Hybrid and electric cars should be banned from the facility
  
  8 1
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  June 28, 2021 1:46pm
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    Someone needs to ask that 14 yo their opinion of children in Congo being forced to scrape cobalt out of the ground so that electric car batteries can be made.
    
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    June 28, 2021 2:47pm
    - graham
      
      … and then pass over an atlas to point out where Congo is …
      
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      June 28, 2021 3:24pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  This arsewipe teen thinks they own the carpark?
  Trespass, come on Mr Plod. What’s that? Teens have rights?
  So do shoppers Mr Plod
  
  6 1
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  June 28, 2021 6:34pm
BeaB

Heard 0n grapevine local marae would give you a shot if they had leftover vaccine. Turned up and found a long queue of similar middle class elderlies hoping for leftovers. Heard someone say there were none that day so I bowled up to a desk and asked to make an appointment. Not a problem.
Have had my first shot and an appointment for my second. I have already had SARS and still suffering loss of smell and taste years later so don’t want another d0se.
But this is a crazy system. Is the marae just being paid for shots delivered so giving them to anyone who rocks up?
Lots of marae personnel directing traffic, marshalling queues etc. What is their contract with the government?
But it is a very funny sight – obedient middle class boomers being ordered about by bouncy y0ung Maori full of bonhomie.
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June 28, 2021 1:19pm
- kowtow
  
  There’ll be a cynical angle from the Kommissariat in all this , for years to come the Komrades will remind us about “how much was owed by so many to the tangata whatever few for their heroic role in the front lines against the Kung flu” And we should all be forever grateful , and beholden .
  
  Hail Glorious Leader .
  
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  June 28, 2021 2:44pm
RiP NZ

https://reason.com/2021/06/22/lawsuit-immigrant-kids-are-suicidal-eating-rotten-food-in-secretive-detention-facilities

What?
No AOC posing in angst, no ‘kids in cages’ screaming from every headline, leading every news segment?

Right, that was just manipulation from evil democrats and their compliant media dogs.
This is all Biden, lap it up
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June 28, 2021 1:22pm
kiwikidsnz

Back in the day (50 years ago when i was a smart ass teenager), someone would have smacked him one to wake his ideas up & he would have quickly realised that other people have rights too.
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June 28, 2021 1:32pm
Happychappy

Just been to Hamilton this morning to listen to what Judith Collins take on Jacinda Ardern and many other issues , 180 party members attended and I take back what have previously though of her whilst my previous thoughts on her was I believed she was damaged good over some her past decisions I was quite impressed on what she had to say and her determination to show people exactly what Jacinda Arderns agenda is and how she will deal with it and the politically corrupt media.
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June 28, 2021 1:46pm
- lifesgood
  
  Good on you. I am fed up with the constant carping criticism of Judith on KB. It must be all coming from people who have never heard her speak and who swallow the rubbish put about by the bought media. She is one smart, well educated, clever, successful lady, everything that Jacinda is not.
  
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  June 28, 2021 2:25pm
  - rockape
    
    I agree, I have heard her speak and have consumed a good bottle of red wine with her. Sadly she isn’t popular with the voters and therefore unlikely to ever be PM. That’s a sad reality but a reality non the less.
    
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    June 28, 2021 2:58pm
    - Captain Mainwaring
      
      Just proves how stupid voters are really.
      
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      June 28, 2021 4:15pm
Maggie Pie

RANDOM IMPERTINENT QUESTION….

Do callers to Talkback-Radio honestly believe, that other people would have the remotest interest, in hearing all the gory details about their personal battles with Obesity?

SHEESH!!
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June 28, 2021 1:56pm
Jack5

Anyone-else frustrated by Kiwiblog moderation?

You make a post, it goes into a queue and you don’t know that someone-else has posted on the same subject but the post is waiting higher in the queue.

Time for me to have a blog holiday.
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June 28, 2021 2:03pm
- curry4me
  
  Jack5: I just post regardless. There are low odds of anyone posting stuff from the same URL.
  
  4 1
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  June 28, 2021 3:05pm
- Ian Boag
  
  Nothing that other KBers can do about it. You need to complain to DPF – I guess he runs the moderators – and let us see his reply …
  
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  June 28, 2021 6:03pm
Bobba Fret

Oh dear! Have these two best buddies had a falling out? Or have media run out of money and need a top up?
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2021/06/tova-o-brien-jacinda-ardern-has-misled-the-public-and-shut-down-debate-on-hate-speech-laws.html
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June 28, 2021 2:11pm
- Humble Capitalist
  
  Excellent opinion piece Tova, when will normal service resume? Ahh tomorrow night at 6pm, I thought so.
  
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  June 28, 2021 2:41pm
- SB2
  
  A response to Tova O’Brien is in order What the PM really said not what Tova or others like to think Adern said
  
  Ardern told Morning Report the proposal was about strengthening what laws the country already had in place.
  
  “We already have provisions to deal with what I describe – you know some call it hate speech – I’d call it extreme speech.
  “The debate is whether or not in the aftermath of what we’ve experienced on March 15 we need to include the likes of religion, and that is something the Royal Commission did recommend we extend to.
  
  “So I would reach out to those across all sides of the House and say, look, given we have been called on to do this, I’d very interested in what their view is and what they would see as being a way to make sure that we are bringing in those who were at the most extreme end of an experience.”
  
  The opposition parties argue putting political opinion into the legislation created concerns, and there needed to be clarity over who would decide what the threshold for that was.
  Ardern said they were simply putting out for debate what should be included and what should not be.
  
  “Because at the moment under our human rights legislation, it covers discrimination based on ethnicity, religion, on sexual orientation, on disability, we haven’t included absolutely every provision.
  
  “The question we’ve asked is – because keep in mind this is a discussion document – what groups should be included and what groups should not.
  
  “I would much rather our opposition parties work with us to try and create legislation that responds to the extreme event [15 March] we had in New Zealand.”
  
  She said the government would not be the ones determining whether a person’s speech crossed the political opinion threshold, but rather law enforcement.
  
  She agreed that bipartisan support was crucial for a legislation like this.
  
  https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/445670/hate-speech-law-proposals-jacinda-ardern-calls-on-opposition-parties-to-work-together
  
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  June 28, 2021 4:24pm
- rangitoto
  
  I guess the $105 million ran out.
  
  8 0
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  June 28, 2021 4:35pm
  - [email protected]
    
    Perhaps the media are suggesting that some additional funding is required to keep them compliant.
    
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    June 28, 2021 6:17pm
JibberJabber

Has Tova had a lightbulb moment?
A sudden realisation that maybe the media may now have to be careful about what they say as well as us, the general public.

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2021/06/tova-o-brien-jacinda-ardern-has-misled-the-public-and-shut-down-debate-on-hate-speech-laws.html

One of the pitfalls of cosying up to politicians is that one day you may have to write uncomplimentary truths when they cross the line and seek to restrain the freedoms we expect in a democratic and free society.
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June 28, 2021 2:15pm
- david
  
  Instructions from the head of finance might be a more likely cause.
  Questions about the effective bribery and corruption racket offering protection to the Government have become too loud to ignore so Management has decreed that a multi-pronged approach has to be undertaken.
  Weak arguments as to why Government bribes have had no effect of the media did no really cut the mustard so phase two has been rolled out. This calls for a couple of senior scribblers to write something negative that can be pointed to as evidence.
  Fear not, the situation will restore to normal in a couple of weeks.
  
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  June 28, 2021 3:14pm
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ezp1M3Zf1ws

Leftist Teacher on CRT.

Oficially, CRT isn’t a thing in US schools. Unofficially, it is.
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June 28, 2021 2:16pm
curry4me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OnsLse5Hfxg

Biden’s meeting with Putin was like a ‘Monty Python sketch’.

Sky News contributor Caleb Bond says he thought he was “watching a sketch out of Monty Python” when Joe Biden handed Vladimir Putin a list of 16 critical infrastructure entities which Russia should not hit with cyber-attacks. President Biden recently travelled to the United Kingdom for the G7 summit with a number of world leaders, including prime ministers Boris Johnson and Scott Morrison, which was then followed by a meeting with his Russian counterpart in Geneva. [3:32]
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June 28, 2021 2:17pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Our Prime Minister has not been truthful.

https://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA2106/S00217/stick-to-the-facts-prime-minister.htm

Does that mean:
1. she has lied, or
2. displayed her pig ignorance of a topic (once again)?
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June 28, 2021 2:26pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  “During times of universal deceit, the truth becomes a revolutionary act”
  
  – George Orwell
  
  Who knew?
  
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  June 28, 2021 2:34pm
  - SB2
    
    MP, I don’t think Orwell had in mind National party press releases/ propaganda
    
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    June 28, 2021 4:10pm
- Loddenthinks
  
  3. All of the above
  
  10 0
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  June 28, 2021 2:53pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    You can have brains or beauty; but not all three.
    
    4 0
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    June 28, 2021 3:20pm
    - Tall Man
      
      My wife disproves that argument … totally.
      
      Mind you, the “eye of the beholder” and all that shit 😉
      
      3 0
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      June 28, 2021 7:11pm
- SB2
  
  [Deleted – trolling. Mod]
  
  1 9
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  June 28, 2021 4:06pm
  - SB2
    
    Not trolling IMO. Merely stating facts that the source was from the parliamentary National Party.
    
    As much it was similar from the Labour Party hardly an objective piece of reportage.
    
    [Mod. note: You merely repeated what was ALREADY IN THE LINK. For being disingenuous and disrespectful, take a 2 week ban.]
    
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    June 28, 2021 5:41pm
- Tall Man
  
  Two out of two Maggy……
  
  Astute as always.
  
  Must be the three doctors in the house.
  
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  June 28, 2021 7:02pm
lifesgood

Miles Davis on Newstalk ZB had a hilarious programme last night asking callers to tell him what should be cancelled for causing offence in view of the woke Canterbury Uni nutcases canceling Chaplin. Callers came up with everything from the Pope to Coro Street for its blatant displays of infidelity etc. It was very funny but also scarily possible.
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June 28, 2021 2:29pm
- surfing
  
  I bet 100% of woke people have done something in their lives that would cancel them out!
  
  8 0
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  June 28, 2021 3:42pm
  - Tall Man
    
    Being “woke” would be enough for me
    
    4 1
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    June 28, 2021 6:43pm
- Inandout
  
  life, yes I like Mile’s cockney humour. He does however stick to the ‘authorised’ when discussing politics which is a shame because I bet he considers our govermment a pack of clowns.
  
  6 2
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  June 28, 2021 3:51pm
  - Tall Man
    
    Met him quite a while ago. Had a rowdy beer or 11 … You may not be right.
    
    1 1
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    June 28, 2021 6:52pm
- graham
  
  Can’t help but wonder just how these poor fragile people who are so appalled at the idea of someone who (gasp!) was involved in a paternity suit and (double gasp!!) chased younger women will cope once they eventually have no choice but to move out of the sheltered academic life into the real world, where safe spaces are far and few between.
  
  Somewhat tongue in cheek, I also wonder what sort of people have such a problem with Chaplin’s predatory behaviour, while being quite okay with The Addams Family Musical, which according to the synopsis in Wikipedia features:
  
  – Raising the dead from their graves
  – Wednesday torturing Pugsley on a rack
  – Pugsley stealing a potion from Grandma and making plans to slip it to Wednesday (hints of date rape)
  
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  June 28, 2021 4:25pm
  - Tall Man
    
    Plus clinton shagging the young ones, hillary killing the young ones 😉
    
    How do they reconcile their views with labour party youth camp and ardern’s pet in her office “too valuable to dispense with” ……
    
    At least Charlie’s victims were willing participants …..
    
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    June 28, 2021 6:59pm
UrbanNeocolonialist

Woah. A study on Israeli vaccination programs (they genuinely went hard and early), says that vaccines are killing about 2 people for every 3 they save. (Reported on Bret Weinstein and Heather Heyring podcast).
Worse still; the people being saved are old, the people being killed are young. https://odysee.com/@BretWeinstein:f/EvoLens85:9?t=3093
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June 28, 2021 3:28pm
SmokerGuy

Is Tova finally starting to realise that her idol is a fraud?

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2021/06/tova-o-brien-jacinda-ardern-has-misled-the-public-and-shut-down-debate-on-hate-speech-laws.html

Took her long enough!
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June 28, 2021 3:29pm
- Tall Man
  
  I knew 3 1/2 years ago …
  
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  June 28, 2021 6:23pm
MrTips

The Govt of kindness:

– Kiwibuild fail
– Police under resourced (but thanks AFP/FBI)
– Gangs not out of control, but very flexy. Got their
guns tho!
– Starship Hospital in real pain
– Mental health crisis completely ignored
– Farmers constantly shat on
– Maximum coal burn EVER achieved, despite
climate change and EV diktat
– Rampant homelessness
– Drug use through the roof
– Health underfunded and no record keeping
– Babies in the womb now have no rights
– Taxes and levies increased, despite promises
– Strikes, despite promises
– A very good look-alike to separatist govt along
racial lines being considered
– Spin and more spin about hate speech proposals
even the media can see it

And we’re only half way through 2021.

But hey, Neve can bake a cake and the lyca clad nincompoops from Grey Lynn can cycle across to the NS to get their soy, foamless, cancer curing, morally superior Trade-Aid latte and mungbean cookie! Good times.
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June 28, 2021 3:33pm
- greybeard
  
  Typical socialist/communist procedure: get as many people as possible to be dependent on the State.
  That way they control the whole lot of us.
  
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  June 28, 2021 5:40pm
Than

Jacinda Ardern when questioned on The AM Show about the proposed Hate Speech law;

Ardern defended Faafoi on Monday, telling the AM Show he was “pepper-potted with a bunch of examples and it’s not for us to determine what a court may or may not do”.

That’s an… interesting constitutional approach (to say the least). Parliament doesn’t need to define the law and how they intend it to work, because they can’t know how judges will interpret it anyway. Why not just scribble laws as suggestions on the back of a napkin and have the courts make up the rest as they go along?
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June 28, 2021 3:34pm
surfing

These hate speech laws are going to be a minefield….Kris Faafoi even admits that millennials could potentially be imprisoned for hating on boomers.

How stupid are politicians? Noone has been able to define hate speech, yet they are pressing on with hate speech laws. Stupid stupid stupid ignorant politicians.

Kris Faafoi is a coward for refusing to answer questions about the law he is behind. He passes the buck to the police, but surely he is the one who is guiding the police!

Freedom of religion and the hate speech laws will directly contradict each other here too.

Surely we should just admit that the price of free speech is having to listen to odious views.

Hate speech laws will one day bite the hand of their creators.
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June 28, 2021 3:37pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Hate speech laws will one day bite the hand of their creators.
  
  Indeed, they might; but there will be collateral damage along the way before this mess gets sorted.
  
  It might be time to sniff out some smart lawyers or to start compiling a large reading list if you suspect a few years in the pokie is on the cards.
  
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  June 28, 2021 4:34pm
  - SB2
    
    MW , as posted earlier ( 4.24pm )the PM wants debate and discussion about the hate speech laws,
    
    “…I would much rather our opposition parties work with us to try and create legislation that responds to the extreme event [15 March] we had in New Zealand.”
    
    She said the government would not be the ones determining whether a person’s speech crossed the political opinion threshold, but rather law enforcement.
    
    She agreed that bipartisan support was crucial for a legislation like this.,,,”
    
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    June 28, 2021 5:45pm
    - Swifty
      
      You may well think it appropriate that a police force goes around looking for speech that offends some people, but that is because you are stupid – as you have proven on KB hundreds of times.
      
      I think it better for society that we have a police force going about their business continually reminding people that we live in a free country and that NZ citizens are free to speak their mind.
      
      Have you given this matter any thought at all?
      
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      June 28, 2021 6:53pm
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      The Prime Minister hasn’t got a clue about this proposed legislation…
      She’s been caught out big time today…
      and to save you from trolling… this is a press release from the ACT Party (but most of us can figure that out)
      
      https://www.act.org.nz/pm_on_hate_speech_wrong_wrong_wrong_and?utm_campaign=hate_speech_petition_rea&utm_medium=email&utm_source=actnz
      
      “Both Justice Minister Kris Faafoi and Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern have fumbled their way through interviews when asked about how the laws will work in practice.
      
      “While Faafoi seemed to have no idea, the Prime Minister made four claims that the ACT Party and the media have since proved to be wrong.
      
      https://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA2106/S00223/hate-speech-petition-reaches-20000-signatures.htm
      
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      June 28, 2021 6:54pm
    - Happychappy
      
      Haha SB2 Jacinda Ardern wants bipartisan support because she knows this will cost her just about all the political capital she has built up dispite her best efforts to have Chris Faafoi front it for her so he would wear some of the blame. But even he ended up being out of his depth and creating a bigger problem for our lying , decietful Prime Minister.
      
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      June 28, 2021 6:58pm
Inandout

‘LONG BEACH, CA – On Saturday, around 7:30 p.m., officers were in the area of Shoreline Drive and Aquarium Way when they were flagged down regarding a shooting that just occurred outside of a Hooters restaurant’.

My mate has a photo of him standing next to a Hooters blonde with large mammary glands.
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June 28, 2021 3:48pm
Maggie Pie

TWITTER TRENDING…..

Macca’s HR Dept have a lot to ansa for…

Can’t tell me this steaming pile of excreta wouldn’t have had priors 🙁

https://twitter.com/DailyMailUK/status/1409250196282920963
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June 28, 2021 4:33pm
- Tall Man
  
  Hard to get a decent kick in with Hush Puppies on 😉
  
  I learned a long time ago, don’t start what you can’t finish.
  
  https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/uknews/12355077/police-officer-man-woman-taser-wales/
  
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  June 28, 2021 6:11pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    I can’t breathe, I can’t breathe.
    Tough titties
    
    3 2
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    June 28, 2021 6:29pm
fernglas

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/125579853/controversial-businessman-richard-freeman-declares-bankruptcy
This is the man whose defamatory comments Winston Peters was prepared to repeat in the House under privilege.
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June 28, 2021 5:07pm
Gravelroad

Seriously, how big a personal risk is Karl du Fresne taking with this?
The government’s politburo of wrong speak won’t take this sort of challenge for too much longer.
I suspect Mr du Fresne will be canceled shortly.

Read Maorification of smiling zombies – https://www.spectator.com.au/2021/06/maorification-of-smiling-zombies/
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June 28, 2021 5:11pm
- SB2
  
  Gravelroad , announce the time , place and date when he is actually cancelled/ censored.
  
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  June 28, 2021 5:47pm
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Idiot
    
    13 1
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    June 28, 2021 6:29pm
- tf78
  
  Gravel, fortunately you can read his article straight from his website so he should be ok. (I hope) or we’re all doomed.
  
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  June 28, 2021 6:14pm
graham

And Heather Du-Plessis Allan joins the throngs of people weighing into the Government over the proposed hate speech laws.

In her introduction just after 4:00 pm today, Heather blasted both Jacinda Ardern and Kris Faafoi for obviously having ABSOLUTELY NO IDEA about just what the implications are. She picked out two examples from some TV interview this morning where Ms Ardern downplayed the impact of the proposed laws – or outright, err, was economical with the truth – and proceeded to read out the relevant parts from the actual discussion document.

How can they put forward something that everybody knows is going to be incredibly contentious, and then just wade into interviews without having a clue what they’re talking about?

You’re not on the Jono and Ben show now, Jacinda …
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June 28, 2021 6:07pm
- 70andstilllearning
  
  That’s almost nothing compared to the TV3 news together with the AM show.
  It’s starting to look like she has no idea what her Ministers are saying or doing AND has absolutely no idea of what the consultation document says. She insists that “Cabinet ” excluded political comment and also that “inciting violence” has to be in the mix. She hasn’t got a CLUE.
  
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  June 28, 2021 6:35pm
CAKE FACE1

The flick “Being There” is on my mind.

The main character is the middle-aged, simple-minded Chancey Gardener. He has never had a real job, except being a gardener. Through a series of accidents, Chancey eventually meets the President.

The President discusses the economy and Chauncey discusses gardening, as follows:

“President “Bobby”: Mr. Gardner, do you agree with Ben, or do you think that we can stimulate growth through temporary incentives?
Chance: As long as the roots are not severed, all is well. And all will be well in the garden.
President “Bobby”: In the garden.
Chance: Yes. In the garden, growth has it seasons. First comes spring and summer, but then we have fall and winter. And then we get spring and summer again.
President “Bobby”: Spring and summer.
Chance: Yes.
President “Bobby”: Then fall and winter.
Chance: Yes.
Benjamin Rand: I think what our insightful young friend is saying is that we welcome the inevitable seasons of nature, but we’re upset by the seasons of our economy.
Chance: Yes! There will be growth in the spring!
Benjamin Rand: Hmm!
Chance: Hmm!
President “Bobby”: Hm. Well, Mr. Gardner, I must admit that is one of the most refreshing and optimistic statements I’ve heard in a very, very long time. … I admire your good, solid sense. That’s precisely what we lack on Capitol Hill.”

Everyone thinks Chauncey is a deep thinker. Eventually Chauncey becomes President.

The entire movie is absurd. The story that a rookie who has never had a real job could become leader of a country is obviously absurd.

The idea that people could read great empathy or intelligence into nonsense an imbecile is saying also seems extremely unlikely.

Then I just saw Ms Ardern’s comments on the hate speech legislation, and I just can’t work it out. To some less charitable people than CAKE, it may seem that she is lying – a lot. Maybe there is an alternative answer to this?

I suspect that she may have the same difficulties as Chauncey. This may sound unkind, but I don’t mean it to be.

How to explain the numerous contradictions, nonsense and outright errors she babbles about the hate speech legislation?

I think the Prime Minister may be slightly mentally defective. Her IQ is perhaps at levels of someone who can function at basic levels of life, but not at levels anywhere near those needed by a Prime Minister.
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June 28, 2021 7:02pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  I think the Prime Minister may be slightly mentally defective. Her IQ is perhaps at levels of someone who can function at basic levels of life, but not at levels anywhere near those needed by a Prime Minister.
  
  I wouldn’t go to that extreme.
  
  I think she is intellectually lazy and doesn’t do the hard yards in mastering information.
  
  She has spent too long in the flim-flam world where shallowness abounds.
  
  I know some folks think she is clever because of her repartee at times… but it’s not difficult to learn a few
  verbal tricks to employ at staged events…. standard debating techniques which many school kids now learn.
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:01pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Oh look,
Our PM has finally realised that she didn’t have a clue about the proposed Hate speech legislation.

“This is about extreme speech where you’re inciting violence and hatred,” Ardern said.

But that’s wrong. The proposed threshold can be much lower than inciting violence. The Prime Minister has now been forced to concede there are other factors too – like insulting someone.

“In the interview from the Nation they implied political opinion is included – it is not,” she said.

That’s not right either. The Prime Minister says Cabinet ruled out including political opinion, but it is still included in their discussion document for the public.

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2021/06/prime-minister-jacinda-ardern-concedes-proposed-hate-speech-threshold-is-lower-than-inciting-violence.html
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June 28, 2021 7:19pm
The Feed

Do you support the governments proposed free speech laws?

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2021/06/have-your-say-do-you-support-the-government-s-proposed-hate-speech-laws.html

Oh my. Look at the “against”…..
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June 28, 2021 7:30pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Oh goodness,
  The fairy dust is blowing away…..
  
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  June 28, 2021 7:47pm
- Tauhei Notts
  
  I actually voted for the law change.
  Why?
  Because I want the law to come in.
  Because only when it comes in will the great unwashed population of New Zealand realise what a bunch of far quits we have running our country and that those reprehensible people MUST be voted out of office. A law change like that mooted will be the final straw. I want it. Then the detritus of our present regime can go and lick one anothers’ haemorrhoids.
  
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  June 28, 2021 8:27pm
mike45

News flash. The most recent exchange rate for the NZ dollar has just been published. $55million equates to 30 pieces of silver.
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June 29, 2021 11:51am

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