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October 7, 2021 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 07 October 2021

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General Debate

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fernglas

So the gangs are a reason for the widening spread of Covid in South Auckland and into the Waikato. I hope that the Maori Party will point the finger of blame squarely at them when their kuia and kaumatua fall victim to the virus they have helped to spread.
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October 7, 2021 8:00am
- peterwn
  
  No. Easier to blame racism and colonisation.
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:57am
  - kowtow
    
    Yep .
    
    ‘Cr Laufiso referred to a series of inequities faced by Pacific peoples and she said Covid-19 had exacerbated the struggles for survival faced by Maori since 1840.’
    
    https://www.odt.co.nz/news/dunedin/most-dunedin-council-vaccinated
    
    I wonder how she thinks they got on prior to that.
    
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    October 7, 2021 10:42am
    - In Vino Veritas
      
      Struggle for survival? Well I guess they were happy with being enslaved and eaten pre Europeans. But hold on you might say, they were awesome sailors! Except by European settlement, they weren’t. But wait! They looked after their environment you might say. But no, they didn’t. They wiped everything out they could in the search for a decent feed (including each other).
      
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      October 7, 2021 11:50am
    - Suze Wainwright
      
      Were you not aware that prior to colonialism, Maori existed in a blissful utopia – socialist equality for all, no sexism, harmonious rainbow community relations and no violence – everything went so well that they were able to explore the Antarctic.
      
      Did I mention abundant food supplies, environmental sustainability and beautiful stewardship of all natural resources…?
      
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      October 7, 2021 11:50am
  - WaveyDavey
    
    There was a Q from a journo at yesterday’s 1pm which included the “is colonisation to blame’ line – dunno if anyone else caught it
    
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    October 7, 2021 10:58am
    - Suze Wainwright
      
      It’s undeniably the cause – that’s why young Maori in particular are so susceptible to the misinformation propagated by white Europeans surrounding vaccines…
      
      😉
      
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      October 7, 2021 12:17pm
  - Ed Snack
    
    But it IS a Iraqi am and colonialism, they were MADE to become gang members, we forced them to do it. And we made them break the Covid boundaries too, wake up people, it isn’t their fault, it’s OURS !
    
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    October 7, 2021 11:46am
  - Bridgenag
    
    Must be exciting for the Waikato to have the gangs bring in Covid and shut their area of the country down
    
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    October 7, 2021 1:38pm
- Bridgenag
  
  Must be exciting for the Waikato to have the gangs bring in Covid and shut their area of the country down
  
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  October 7, 2021 1:39pm
Warren

New Covid-19 Testing regime to be announced today.
The Government will announce how it plans to roll out a much wider “rigorous” Covid testing regime.
A report was delivered to Cabinet on Monday from the University of Otago Professor David Murdoch who leads the Governments testing advisory group, and Covid Minister Chris Hipkinshas signaled that Rapid Antigen testing will play a much bigger roll in the new regime.
Just like what happened with the PPT gear debacle in 2020 this was not the Governments plan as 25 of New Zealands biggest Companies such as Mainfreight and Foodstuffs have called for emergency approval to use rapid Antigen tests at critical work sites, they jointly want to import 370,000 rapid antigen tests at critical work sites around the Country within the next week but needed the Governments permission to do so , however Hipkins said that would be unlikely in the next week.

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/453061/new-covid-19-testing-regime-to-be-announced-today
So just like the PPT gear that the Government were short of in 2020 we now have Business Bosses doing the same on antigen test kits which the Government should have had in place months ago and still they have no urgency to help have them here in quick time, by saying that would be unlikely within the next week.
The Government or Circus which ever you think is appropriate still continues to amaze.
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October 7, 2021 8:00am
- cmm
  
  Bugger the antigen tests. I want to see the antibody tests in action.
  
  Antibody tests will also give a hint as to people that have been infected and now carry some natural immunity.
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:56am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    Not likely. Finding some people with natural immunity will mean Jaspinda loses some control.
    Socialists NEVER relinquish control without a fight. Look at History
    
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    October 7, 2021 10:23am
  - septic skeptic
    
    Yes, wouldn’t it be nice to find out that Covid has been quietly spreading around most of the population asymptomatically and most of us have natural immunity. Maybe that sniffle we had last year was covid. Probably not though.
    
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    October 7, 2021 11:18am
    - Steve Otto(North Shore)
      
      Notice nobody gets the flu anymore? Or emphysema, pneumonia etc etc
      
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      October 7, 2021 12:23pm
- fisho
  
  About bloody time. The control freaks in charge banned these early last year, they’re in widespread use outside NZ.
  The advantage of anti-gen home testing is my workers can test before they rock up to work, which means I have the best possible chance of keeping my teams safe and able to continue operating without broad-brush self-isolations.
  I don’t have the luxury to stop operating while while Close/Casual-Plus contacts await test results.
  
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  October 7, 2021 1:11pm
Yvette

“Community immunity” against “a higher vaccine protection for individuals, especially the elderly”

Vaccine dose gap recommendation changed to three weeks.
On Wednesday, Director of Public Health Dr Caroline McElnay said that in light of the increased risk from the current Delta outbreak, New Zealanders should now consider a shorter gap between the two doses of the Pfizer vaccine.

“That’s because we need to protect ourselves, our whānau and our communities. We need as many people as possible to have their first dose to be partially protected, but we also need all those people to be fully vaccinated with two doses as soon as possible.”

When questioned about the optimal time between doses, Dr McElnay said their technical advisory group said “there never was any safety concerns with vaccinating” around the three week timeframe.
https://www.1news.co.nz/2021/10/06/vaccine-dose-gap-recommendation-changed-to-three-weeks/

However the 1-News article reports – After three weeks was still within the “realms of being optimal”, Dr McElnay said – but does not mention any of the international findings that a longer gap can increase the efficacy of the vaccine …

In May, researchers at the University of Birmingham found that delaying the second Pfizer dose to 12 weeks after the first resulted in a 3.5 times greater antibody response in older people. The increase is likely even greater in a younger cohort.
https://www.medpagetoday.com/opinion/marty-makary/94315

So why are so many New Zealanders being offered their vaccines three weeks apart?
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300348177/3-weeks-or-3-months-the-vaccine-dose-gap-matters

other references on the optimum gap –
https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/nz-urged-consider-longer-gap-between-each-pfizer-jab
https://www.pharmatimes.com/news/researchers_find_extending_the_time_between_pfizer_doses_boosts_antibodies_1373633
https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/spacing-pfizer-covid-shots-boosts-antibody-levels-after-initial-drop-study-2021-07-22/
Eight-week gap seen as sweet spot for Pfizer jab antibodies
• a three-week schedule generated fewer of the neutralising antibodies that can bind the virus and stop it infecting cells than a 10-week interval
• the longer schedule led to fewer T-cells overall but a higher proportion of a specific type or subset, called helper T-cells, which according to the researchers, supports immune memory
https://www.bbc.com/news/health-57929953
____________
A 100% vaccination of all those eligible – 4.2 million – is 84% of all New Zealanders.
A 90% vaccination of all those eligible is 75.6% of all New Zealanders.
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October 7, 2021 8:01am
- cmm
  
  Well clearly if people get the second jab after 3 weeks then the fully vaccinated numbers will go up sooner and Cindy can get bigger numbers before the end of the year.
  
  All politics, bugger the science.
  
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  October 7, 2021 10:00am
  - septic skeptic
    
    Not entirely. If we are heading for widespread transmission it makes some sense to be double vaxxed quickly now and deal with the reduced efficacy next year. The picture then could be quite different anyway with new vaxes, boosters and new variants all possible.
    
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    October 7, 2021 11:21am
- kowtow
  
  Aren’t there any “families” left in New Zealand.
  
  More race politics.
  
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  October 7, 2021 10:44am
- oldfella
  
  @Yvette
  Grant Robinson this morning (in the horrid)…
  
  … would not confirm if 90 per cent was the magic number and said there had to be further analysis of who the 90 per cent of people were.
  Regardless of which number you pick, he said, they had to get a high number of vaccinations so they were reducing hospitalisations and death rates.
  They wanted a “90 per cent plus” rate, Robinson said.
  
  Yep, 90%+, better than any other country in the world, and almost certainly unreachable.
  We are governed by idiots!
  
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  October 7, 2021 12:08pm
Vory v zakone

So much for vaccine-generated herd immunity
In an Israeli hospital outbreak, 96% vaccination rates (and universal masking) made no difference. And guess who had mild cases? Hint: not the vaccinated.

Alex Berenson
https://alexberenson.substack.com/p/so-much-for-vaccine-generated-herd?r=k5sck&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web&utm_source=

The story also appeared here
https://t.co/o7mdx34OPU
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October 7, 2021 8:01am
- dcrane
  
  14 out of 23 double-vaccinated infected patients having severe/critical cases or death is not very encouraging. It does look like many were older.
  
  I’m guessing that the 19 vaccinated infected staff who recovered fine were younger age, as well as the unvaccinated ones who had mild cases.
  
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  October 7, 2021 11:43am
Benedict Yu

This guy Baker and his mates are publicity junkies. Sadly they seem to have the ear of the government.

They want a permanent mask strategy, which would mandate masks being worn in most public places indefinitely. Read years to come.

” “Masking will have to remain, particularly indoors… While it’s kind of a foreign thing to Kiwis, it’s become part of the way we live and work.”

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/126597889/covid19-five-things-to-expect-between-now-and-christmas-as-our-coronavirus-strategy-changes

No it has not become part of the way we live and work. We have only been doing it for 7 weeks and most hate it.

I have not devoted any real time to researching whether masks are effective or not. I figure I get made to wear one nothing I can do.

But I don’t want this thing to be permanent. Life is about enjoying stuff. You only get one shot at it.

I’m still in the camp that says get vaccinated. Or not. And get on with our lives. These academics are addicted to the attention and harm minimisation at any cost. It really annoys me and I am sure I’m not alone.
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October 7, 2021 8:02am
- Frank the tank
  
  15 minutes of fame. That is all it is.
  
  Sometime in the next 24 months Baker, Plank, Hendy, Wiles et al collectively will be forced to crawl back under their rock.
  
  In the interim – ignore them
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:04am
- Don Beckett
  
  Masks are ineffective against a virus – there are a large number of reports & studies which show this is the case. Masks were developed for surgeons & paramedics so they would not allow droplets or bacteria to enter an open wound. Wearing mask to keep a virus out is like trying to stop a mosquito with a chain link fence.
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:07am
  - info@cruzpro.com
    
    Sorry DB, fat finger ended up checking the wrong box. Would be a good feature to allow an ‘undo’.
    
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    October 7, 2021 8:10am
  - PhilBest
    
    The only reason that masks might stop viruses temporarily is that when the mask becomes moist, the water closes those gaps in the fibres. But the moisture will evaporate into the surrounding air anyway, and the force of each exhalation and inhalation will help push micro droplets of vapor containing viruses into the surrounding air or pull them into the lungs.
    
    “Studies” that “prove” masks work even against aerosolized virus obviously suffer from some flaw that the “scientists” are not interested in getting to the bottom of.
    
    The big risk always relates to duration in an environment anyway; how much difference would it make if the residents in a rest home were masked 24/7 – compared to being given more fresh air and the viruses flushed out of the environment?
    
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    October 7, 2021 8:17am
  - Benedict Yu
    
    TBH I am not interested in whether they are effective or not. I think that is the wrong debate. You will be debating forever people who say they are effective
    
    We should just say no more. If we get high levels of vaccination, but we are still in so much danger that we need to wear masks forever, well we have been asked to give up on a normal life.
    
    This guy Baker and his mates are on a power trip.
    
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    October 7, 2021 8:17am
    - Simon
      
      “TBH I am not interested in whether they are effective or not. I think that is the wrong debate”
      
      100%.
      
      Who voted for this Baker wanker?
      
      No one voted for these expert turds. That Bloomclown saying NZ will have to live at level 2.5 for next 3 or 5 years. Who voted for this wanker?
      
      Or is voting just ceremonial? The same turds call the shots regardless. These so called experts have got a single focus on the ro. Elected officials should have wider considerations.
      
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      October 7, 2021 8:33am
    - Mr_Blobby
      
      The so called vaccine is proving to be a failure.
      
      It will not protect you fully in the short term, you can still catch and pass on covid.
      
      What was the point of vaccinating in the first place?
      
      Covid is here and it is here to stay we are just going to have to learn to live with it like we do everything else that can or could kill us.
      
      99.7% survival rate, higher if you are healthy, I’ll roll the dice and take my chances thank you.
      
      I certainly don’t want to wear a face nappy for the rest of my life.
      
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      October 7, 2021 8:34am
    - Taieri
      
      This guy Baker and his mates are on a power trip.
      —————
      
      Enthusiastically assisted by the paranoia of some, otherwise often astute, bloggers such as Chris Trotter.
      
      http://bowalleyroad.blogspot.com/2021/10/will-jacinda-stand-or-has-she-already.html
      
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      October 7, 2021 8:38am
    - rockape
      
      I totally agree, at my age, 75 I want to enjoy the years I have left. I don’t want to spend them double masked hiding under my bed. If things don’t change soon I will be off to the UK and back to enjoying pub and public life.
      
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      October 7, 2021 8:40am
    - RiP NZ
      
      That’s ludicrous – the essence of doing anything should be that it achieves a set objective.
      To not be concerned whether a mask is effective or not sums up the whole fkn Covid response.
      
      Stopped being about ‘science’ since day 1.
      
      What’s the scientific reason Canadian federal workers who refuse the vaccine are to be placed on admin leave without pay?
      
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      October 7, 2021 8:48am
    - Ehlana
      
      Agree. The information I’ve found that makes the most sense to me says they work for the larger droplets, but if you’re 2m away from others, those larger droplets will fall away anyway before others have a chance to inhale them. For smaller droplets the best answer seems to be good ventilation.
      
      Either way, it is ridiculous for anyone in a public position to be telling people that we will be wearing masks for years to come. We haven’t done that for all the other viral illnesses humanity has encountered over millennia and being threatened like that is hardly uplifting or encouraging.
      
      But then, this is the government which thinks it has done us a great kindness by allowing two households to gather (to a max of 10 people), but only outside, wearing masks, with no hugs allowed and the visitors can’t use the toilet.
      
      Is anyone down there thinking?
      
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      October 7, 2021 9:12am
      - PhilBest
        
        “…For smaller droplets the best answer seems to be good ventilation…”
        
        BINGO.
        
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGYyi5DqOzE
        
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        October 7, 2021 9:43am
      - cmm
        
        After the very early experiences with cruise lines, it was very obvious that:
        * The large drop theory was bullshit and that aerosols are a major transmission vector, but that was resisted by people pushing the large drop theory which is the basis for all the mask wearing and social distancing.
        * MIQs in repurposed hotels are a very bad idea, but cool for the hotel owners though – who can reap a good return on otherwise unused facilities. There are few infections in the open air. It would have been far better for everyone to have been put in tents in campgrounds rather than in hotels.
        
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        October 7, 2021 12:27pm
    - cmm
      
      Baker was already power tripping on flu before CV19 came along. CV19 was all his Christmases coming at once.
      
      In 2019 he was making huge noises about over a million people in NZ getting infected by flu each year and 10,000 dying. Nobody was really listening because we’re used to dealing with flu.
      
      Then came the fiction that CV19 is so very different, amp up the fear and people that were ignored are now in the limelight.
      
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      October 7, 2021 9:45am
  - Bevan
    
    “ Masks were developed for surgeons & paramedics so they would not allow droplets or bacteria to enter an open wound. ”
    
    Congratulations, you just explained how masks prevent virus transmission.
    
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    October 7, 2021 9:02am
    - rangitoto
      
      Doesn’t work against small viruses spread by aerosols.
      
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      October 7, 2021 10:24am
    - Ed Snack
      
      Wrong, but I guess you do not understand the difference between bacteria and viruses; or open wounds and abnormal skin.
      
      Surgical masks have a relatively minor impact can can, if properly used, reduce the likelihood of large droplets being accidentally expelled and ending up in surgical cuts.
      
      Covid is an aerosol virus, you *should* know that by now, but I assume you are too dense to understand. Aerosol viruses do NOT spread via large droplets but primarily by very small particles. There is the possibility that large droplets could pass the virus, which is why actual tests of masks in real life are the test, and NO, apparently that is an insignificant mechanism for passing on Covid. The science pretty strongly supports the idea that it is only in fine droplets that are actually aspirated deep into the airways that matters. This explains why masks, shields, “deep cleaning”, and other such mechanisms that reduce large droplets have no significant affect on the passage of Covid. But, ventilation and dilution do, so being outside is effectively completely protective because the viral aerosols never reach the necessary thresholds for infection.
      
      This is not even controversial at the scientific level, provided one actually follows real science. It is possible to show an effect in the lab, even if the “mask” is just a piece of toilet paper. But in real life, no.
      
      Masks are pure political theatre, and beloved authoritarians everywhere as a result.
      
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      October 7, 2021 12:00pm
      - Bevan
        
        Dude, seriously? The virus is spread by droplets – if you are wearing a mask, a significant amount of those droplets are captured IN THE MASK!
        
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        October 7, 2021 12:44pm
- Scott
  
  Well worth viewing National’s latest ad on Instagram. Jack Tame questions Jacinda closely on the slow vaccine rollout and that we are the second slowest in the whole OECD to get our people vaccinated.
  Jacinda admits that other countries had to be first in line because our people aren’t dying.
  
  Even media poodle Jack Tame is shocked by this and asks her when she made the conscious decision to put us lower down the line for vaccinations?
  
  So to sum up. We have been the slowest in the OECD to get vaccinated because our prime minister put other countries ahead of our own country to get the vaccine.
  
  Auckland and the Waikato, a third of our country is locked down because she put other countries ahead of her own country. We are spending a billion dollars a week, people are going mad, we are being confined under virtual house arrest because of a complacent and feckless woman who put other countries ahead of her own.
  
  Why is this not front page news? We have the most feckless leader in our history. When will someone report on this?
  Thank you to the National party for at last emerging from slumber and being the opposition. The people of NZ need to know this.
  
  https://www.instagram.com/tv/CUoAetCpgbO/?utm_medium=copy_link
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:08am
  - cmm
    
    The “be kind to others” line sold very well a few months ago when there was no active outbreaks and people were not feeling personally threatened.
    
    As soon as the outbreak started that “be kind to others” line doesn’t work.
    
    It’s like handing out life jackets on dry land – everyone feels very noble handing them to others. However on a sinking ship people will want the life jacket for their own use first. People then ask why we gave those life jackets away – why didn’t we make sure we had enough? Bugger some abstract people in Africa/wherever.
    
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    October 7, 2021 10:06am
  - UrbanNeocolonialist
    
    She’s really generous with other peoples money huh? 8 weeks of lockdown has cost the country 10-20 billion at least. call it $4k for each NZer so far because they couldn’t be arsed making a phone call or signing a contract a couple of months earlier. There are just no excuses for that magnitude of fuckup.
    
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    October 7, 2021 1:00pm
  - virtualmark
    
    Jacinda didn’t make that decision – the pharma companies did.
    
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    October 7, 2021 3:28pm
  - ex-golfer
    
    The roll of any Government is to protect its own citizens first and foremost.
    The smokescreen that we were delaying vaccination because other countries needed it more is just spin to cover up their incompetence at failing to order vaccines “hard and early”.
    And now the PM is happy to stand at her podium and blame and lecture us, the people, for not vaccinating quickly enough.
    She has no shame.
    
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    October 7, 2021 8:49pm
- PhilBest
  
  Baker is one of those who has belatedly come around to the need of ventilation indoors to flush out buildup of virus aerosols. There is also good virucidal air treatment available.
  
  Baker should stick to this, this is far more important than masks which cannot possibly stop viruses because they are so microscopic. The only motivations for this BS fall in the realm of deliberate psychological warfare against the population.
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:11am
  - Ed Snack
    
    UV treatment of air in ventilation systems is one I’ve seen suggested. No idea how available such systems are, or what sort of cost is involved though.
    
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    October 7, 2021 12:02pm
    - PhilBest
      
      A friend of mine who was well off, and a bit of a Polymath, and had an immune-compromised wife, paid out of his own pocket 20 years ago to have such a system installed in the church they attended.
      
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      October 7, 2021 1:54pm
- Ra Henare
  
  Well said
  For a starting point on masks I recommend
  https://swprs.org/the-face-mask-folly-in-retrospect/
  
  Those who are mask positive will quote
  The Bangladesh model which I assume(like me) you will see as quite flawed.
  https://med.stanford.edu/news/all-news/2021/09/surgical-masks-covid-19.html
  
  I dont have a problem with mask wearing in densely populated high risk areas.
  But wearing masks as a precaution (inside say a Christchurch Bunnings store) is just nuts in an environment with no known cases
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:15am
- Andrei
  
  The whole point isn’t your safety or anyone else’s – it is to condition you into blind obedience to the Government.
  
  We are slowly being dragged into a tyranny which may be best described as Public Health Fascism.
  
  Unfortunately a large number of our fellow citizens have been so terrified by relentless propaganda that they wont wake up until it is too late and they are living in a dystopian Hell called Aotearoa
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:15am
- Albert_Ross
  
  Of course they have the ear of Government, no Government could possibly not listen at all to what epidemiologists think about how to handle an epidemic.
  
  I don’t think, though, that you can look at where we are now, and how we’ve got here, and conclude that the Government is only listening to them, and not to anybody else. If that were the case, we’d all still be in level 4.
  
  This gives me some hope that – whatever Baker says about what we would need to do if our only priority were to minimise Covid cases – the Government is (albeit slowly, belatedly and uncertainly) starting to recognise that actually, that isn’t our only priority.
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:16am
  - cmm
    
    The government is not keeping us in perpetual L4 because they know they can’t push things as far as Baker etc say.
    
    Having Baker, the pink rincess and Hendy etc spouting their stuff and touting them as experts is useful:
    * It leaves a threatening atmosphere. If you are naughty we’ll do what the experts say.
    * It makes Cindy’s position seem reasonable.
    
    You will notice that they are completely ignoring the experts that are opposed to what Baker et al are saying.
    
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    October 7, 2021 10:11am
  - bronny1
    
    Baker may be an “expert” in the area but Hendy is a physicist and pink hair person is into glowworms or something (bioluminescence).
    About as expert as my family members who have PhDs in various sciences/maths.
    
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    October 7, 2021 10:59am
- Liberal Cliche
  
  It’s this simple.
  
  Look at the mask you have to wear while spraypainting.
  
  Look at the mask you have to wear for the most deadlist virus in human history.
  
  Children can work this out.
  
  The mask is the symbol of their new religion and they don’t want to get rid of it.
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:23am
  - oldfella
    
    @LC
    Basically, Baker is right, the science is settled, no conflicting POVs will be considered. Simple.
    Works with climate change. Ask the horrid. /s
    
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    October 7, 2021 10:20am
  - Doc Holliday
    
    35 clueless clots uptick!
    
    The mask is to stop your virus spreading FROM you, the paint mask is to stop the paint vapour spreading TO you.
    
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    October 7, 2021 10:39pm
- Mr_Blobby
  
  I am so over all this covid nonsense.
  
  It is a failed policy, at some stage we are going to have to learn to live with it and get on with life.
  
  Worse when it does eventually hit us the young will not have the natural immunity afforded by herd immunity.
  
  They could have been infected with no to low symptoms whilst the high risk groups isolated, they then act as a buffer.
  
  Now they will not have any protection when the bad mutations arrive.
  
  The vaccine is proving to be a failure, natural immunity is many times better.
  
  This will all end very badly.
  
  We are being killed by kindness, thanks jacinda.
  
  Her answer will be ever more and oppressive measures.
  
  So much for privacy and freedom, thanks for the illusion of safety, jacinda.
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:27am
- Bobba Fret
  
  Watching Des Gorman shake his head and roll his eyes, and the other expert (cant remember his name) smiling and laughing when Shaun Hendy was talking on the AM show yesterday morning basically saying we need to wear masks forever was priceless.
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:31am
  - ecco
    
    Des Gorman – the voice of reason.
    
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    October 7, 2021 11:11am
- JerJer
  
  This guy Baker along with the rest of them are morons. They don’t know what should, might or could happen.
  
  They have never dealt with an actual pandemic, they have only read about them in theory and have a qualication that says they read said theory.
  
  Things will go back to normal, these guys will disappear, never to he heard of again, except when we rememember them and laugh at their stupidity.
  
  People are over the bullshit.
  
  Things will go back to normal.
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:33am
- jv
  
  Winston’s comments yesterday reveal the root of the problem, but are no surprise – from day 1 normal Government checks and balances have been pushed aside. Everything has been run from the Prime Minister’s Office, without reference or meaningful reference through Cabinet and without scrutiny, by the PM with 3-4 Ministers, Bloomfield and hand picked “experts” who ignore all international intelligence that does not fit with their ignorant narrative. Along with a compliant media. Ireland have run the whole thing as a health rather than a political issue, they are now no. 1 and we are now no. 38. So there is only one person who has responsibility for success or failure – the PM.
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:33am
  - cmm
    
    ” So there is only one person who has responsibility for success or failure – the PM.”
    
    And that will be cherry-picked:
    * Successes – all Cindy
    * Failure – find a scapegoat.
    
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    October 7, 2021 10:12am
    - 7kiwi11
      
      Where’s that KFC girl gone?!
      
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      October 7, 2021 10:55am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Ireland at least has had the sense to keep their medical opposition MPs in the loop and on the ball.
    
    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/11/world/europe/ireland-leo-varadkar-coronavirus.html
    
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    October 7, 2021 4:35pm
- Northshoredoc
  
  Baker is the classic academic with not a skerrick of common sense and no grasp of life outside of university. Most clinicians at the coal face just tune out to his warbling as I’m sure do a large proportion of the public.
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:51am
- MCos
  
  “Life is about enjoying stuff. You only get one shot at it.”
  That’s pretty much the attitude that’s got us in the situation we’re in now.
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:52am
  - krazykiwi
    
    Nonsense. At age 70 you have lived 613,603 hours, each and every one of them offering multiple opportunities to enjoy life.
    
    Unless you wasted some of these hours cowering under your bed terrified of a flu-like illness.
    
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    October 7, 2021 10:57am
    - MCos
      
      73
      
      I’ve most certainly not cowered under my bed terrified of the flu, but I haven’t pleased myself what I do either.
      For example.
      There’s a bunch of people from a number of families who I’m told regularly congregated at a house not a km from here. Even put a marquee up to accommodate the crowd. After a few calls the police, who are inundated by such calls, finally went around after a week so and had a word.
      You could say they were people just enjoying life.
      Well, check out who’s getting infected.
      
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      October 7, 2021 12:16pm
      - Tom Hunter
        
        Inoffizieller Mitarbeiter
        
        They’re not remembered kindly by history.
        
        By contrast my family has observed any number of teenagers conducting late-night/early-morning “visit” to houses not their own and have not called the police or gone around to “have a word” with the families.
        
        No wonder Gen-Z despise Baby Boomers and refer to Covid-19 as the “Boomer Remover”
        
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        October 7, 2021 1:06pm
  - Ed Snack
    
    No, what got us into this situation was a relatively small group of scientists who said basically, “let’s experiment on viruses that are quite deadly but don’t spread very well by making them better at affecting humans. We get to understand them better, and after all, what could possibly go wrong ?”.
    
    And after such experiments were adjudged to be too risky and basically banned, the same group found a way around the ban and funded research in China where safety standards were even lower and less carefully applied.
    
    And after the s**t hit the fan, they then got together as a group to try to ensure that the truth about how this came about was completely obscured. In which enterprise they were given considerable help by the media and the political left as it was politically useful to them to have a large number of deaths which could be used to smear the administration of the day in the US.
    
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    October 7, 2021 12:07pm
- 70andstilllearning
  
  “This guy Baker and his mates are publicity junkies. Sadly they seem to have the ear of the government.”
  
  https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2021/10/covid-19-we-ve-lost-level-1-now-siouxsie-wiles-gutted-restrictions-being-eased.html
  
  “I’m kind of gutted – partly because this was a step that I hoped that we’d be taking some time next year …..”
  
  Maybe gutted more because the strategy change means the publicity platform’s been cancelled!
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:55am
  - maggiemay
    
    Ms Wiles contributed to that strategy change as I believe the masses thought if she can go out and meet up with others without a mask and watch a friend go for a swim, then so can I. She lead the revolution and the PM had to change step to keep up with what the populace were already doing.
    
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    October 7, 2021 9:41am
  - ecco
    
    Don’t think it’s a case of these guys having the ear of Ardern and co. It’s just a straight out commercial transaction between the two parties. It’s ‘you say this’ and then we’ll see down the track what select committee work is coming up.
    
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    October 7, 2021 9:48am
  - cmm
    
    I wonder whether Baker, Pink Rincess and Hendy will go back to their lives of relative obscurity in 3 years time (or whatever).
    
    Will they do that or, having tasted power and fame, will they need another crisis to be manufactured?
    
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    October 7, 2021 10:15am
    - oldfella
      
      @cmm, but will they depart as Sir Michael, Sir Shaun, and Dame Pinky?
      Wouldn’t be at all surprised.
      
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      October 7, 2021 10:40am
    - 70andstilllearning
      
      Read somewhere on this blog a while back that PP had a history of finding “publicity” platforms before reaching our shores. Leopards don’t …..
      
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      October 7, 2021 11:29am
    - 70andstilllearning
      
      @cmm
      https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2021/10/coronavirus-michael-baker-calls-for-drug-decriminalisation-as-part-of-effort-to-stamp-out-covid-19.html
      “One of the leading architects of New Zealand’s elimination strategy against COVID-19 has backed health officials’ move to enlist gang leaders in the vaccine rollout.”
      
      This guy just has to be a complete idiot
      
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      October 7, 2021 11:46am
      - In Vino Veritas
        
        70, disservice to idiots, that is making the assumption that the “leading architect” is sentient.
        I read somewhere that “One of the leading architects of New Zealand’s elimination strategy against COVID-19 was seen on lying on a beach, a formless blob of colourless goo”.
        
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        October 7, 2021 11:57am
- KevO'Brien
  
  Masks give people crook eyes. Avoid unless absolutely needed.
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:00am
- surfing
  
  Not a fan of Baker. His covid mortality modelling seems way over the top.
  
  I can temporarily tolerate masks, but I see no need for them once we reach sufficiently high vaccination rates.
  
  Covid will one day be just like the flu, just another annual bug that sometimes people catch. And we don’t wear masks for that!
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:17am
  - Don Beckett
    
    Sufficiently high vaccination rates won’t make any difference. You can catch & pass on the virus, vaccinated or not. Another of the huge lies we are being fed on a daily basis, and everyone uses it to bag the unvaccinated.
    What an idiotic people we have become.
    
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    October 7, 2021 11:18am
    - septic skeptic
      
      Yeah, Don I’m with you. And you can still die in a car crash even if you are sober and have seatbelts, airbags and new tyres. That’s another huge lie thay makes no difference.
      
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      October 7, 2021 11:30am
    - surfing
      
      It does mean fewer people in ICU and fewer people dying though.
      
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      October 7, 2021 1:23pm
- artemisia
  
  The masks thing is an attempt to be clear and simple. So everyone in the country knows exactly what to do.
  
  Fail. Mask rules and all the other ever changing rules are nowhere near clear and simple. And it is critical to bear in mind that half the population are under average intelligence, many with comprehension issues for various reasons. I guess the speech writers use some version of the fog (readability) index but that falls right into the abyss when rules keep increasing and becoming ever more complicated.
  
  Sample of one, and above average intelligence – took quite some time to find and more or less understand the rules around travelling to and meeting friends in a café at current level 2.
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:20am
- James Stephenson
  
  You could have knocked me down with a feather the other night, when for the first time in however long this whole SNAFU has been going on, TVNZ allowed a vaguely reassuring statement to be made in a bulletin:
  
  “There have been no cases of transmission of the virus outdoors in New Zealand.”
  
  Get that? If you’re outside and not right in someone’s face, you ain’t gonna catch it. Even the BMJ are saying that outdoor mask mandates are just forced virtue-signalling, and there’s really no point in them, even at events like football matches.
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:28am
- graham
  
  Agreed Benedict.
  
  Eventually I think someone is going to have to drag these academics, kicking and screaming, out of their ivory towers and explain the realities of life (and death) to them.
  
  I get that nobody wants to “see Granny die”. Who would? But the fact is that grannies DO die. And mothers, fathers, brothers, sisters, etc.
  
  Some causes of death are preventable, some are not. And sure, wearing masks *MAY* help to prevent some deaths from Covid. But if we start down this path, why stop with Covid? Do we start reducing speed limits to 20 km/h ACROSS THE ENTIRE COUNTRY because of all the preventable road deaths? Are we going to just ban – COMPLETELY – Burger King, KFC, fish and chips, and all other unhealthy foods because people are dying of heart disease?
  
  I’m sorry to have to break it to these academics, but people die. Always have, always will. And yes, it’s sad; heart-wrenching in fact. But that’s part of life, I’m afraid. You can only do so much to guard people.
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:32am
  - Odakyu-sen
    
    “You can only do so much to guard people.”
    
    My concern is that people who would control us tell us that it is all “for our own good” and that they are “protecting us.”
    
    “I’m protecting you, but you have to do as I tell you to stay safe.” That’s a good strategy for control.
    
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    October 7, 2021 10:36am
  - bennerg
    
    I’ve been beating this drum amongst my friends for some time now:
    
    Death is a Part of Life.
    
    Decisions need to be made by a multidisciplinary group, as any individual sector really only sees the picture from the point of view of it’s own domain.
    
    During war some people die so others can live. And we are in a sort of war right now. But the difference now is that it’s not that we need to make a sacrifice of them. It’s just that people have been dying in large numbers from infections, and lifestyle behaviours in big numbers for centuries. Are we going to risk bringing down our whole society to (IMHO vainly) try to change that?
    
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    October 7, 2021 10:54am
  - Don Beckett
    
    “Everybody wants to get to Heaven, but nobody wants to die.”
    How true are the words of this old song. 😉
    
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    October 7, 2021 11:12am
- ecco
  
  I guess if these ‘experts’ don’t say outrageous things like that they won’t be relevant. Kind of like the government’s shock jocks.
  
  I noticed, increasingly, less NZers bothering with the mask thing when I’m out on my walks. Even went into a business yesterday where nobody could be a**sed wearing a mask and the person at the counter was just letting it go. Understandable I guess.
  
  The people I’d really like to see having to put on a mask for the rest of their lives are the mongrel mob and other gangs… Let’s not punish everyone for the infractions of a few in NZ society.
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:46am
- WaveyDavey
  
  “…Osterholm makes it clear that he’s very pro-masking, “it’s really all about the whole hierarchy of environmental control,” he said, referring to the various methods for reducing risk within a space, a key concept in occupational safety. Vaccination is by far the most protective measure a person can take. Second is ensuring proper ventilation—replacing the air in a room at least five to six times an hour, he explained. Next is social distancing. And then there’s masking: “You keep going down in that order, and finally the lowest thing in terms of overall prevention potential is individual respiratory protection,””
  
  1. Vaccination
  2. Air changes in enclosed spaces
  3. Social distancing
  
  a long way down…
  
  4. Surgical masks
  
  a really really, long way down…
  
  5. Cotton masks
  
  https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2021/10/why-americans-wear-cloth-masks/620296/
  
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  October 7, 2021 11:09am
  - Batman
    
    Yes the vaccine is the best measure.
    
    If you hate masks, get vaccinated and encourage everyone you know as well.
    
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    October 7, 2021 12:07pm
    - WaveyDavey
      
      Don’t worry I am and so has everyone I know I’m very pleased to say
      
      4 3
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      October 7, 2021 12:15pm
      - Batman
        
        Bloody good on ya!
        
        I’m only halfway through thanks to the useless Ministry of Health / Govt roll out. Looking forward to shot #2!
        
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        October 7, 2021 12:28pm
      - WaveyDavey
        
        If you want to get it sooner just check out the vax sites and head there now – assuming it’s been 3 weeks
        
        Dunno where you are but New Lynn has plenty of availability right now
        
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        October 7, 2021 12:57pm
  - Ed Snack
    
    And he’s lying, through his teeth. Masking doesn’t make any actual difference, surgical or otherwise. N95 masks properly worn and handled can make a small difference. A military style anti-biological warfare mask will make a big difference with a filtered and treated air supply, just can’t see those being made generally available or worn myself.
    
    Use of prophylactic treatments do appear in some circumstances to possibly be more effective than vaccination. But that makes no profits for the drug companies it’s so isn’t on the table. Shame really.
    
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    October 7, 2021 12:13pm
- Flossie
  
  Now Baker is saying decriminalisation of marijuana would help in the fight against covid. I didn’t bother to read the details of his thought bubble. Wish they would just stop publishing evreything that comes out of his mouth.
  
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  October 7, 2021 11:38am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    If he thinks the gangs are just sitting around smoking marijuana, then he’s at least 20 years out-of-date.
    
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    October 7, 2021 4:19pm
- fisho
  
  The best place for a mask is rolled up and firmly inserted up Baker’s jacksie. Preferably an N95 for best effect.
  
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  October 7, 2021 1:14pm
Tomtoddy

Dear Jacinda. I need a haircut please.

Psssst. I am Mongrel Mob.
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October 7, 2021 8:03am
- Nickc2
  
  No probs Hone, you’re now an essential worker bro!
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:13am
- Bobba Fret
  
  No worries bro, just pop up to Whangarei or down south if you prefer….no probs.
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:32am
  - 70andstilllearning
    
    Bugger – looks like he already has and popped back home!!
    
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    October 7, 2021 7:49pm
- Colville
  
  https://lovelocsnatural.com/how-to-start-dreadlocks/
  
  Happy to help 🙂
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:12am
- oldfella
  
  Dear tomtoddy
  As you’re obviously one of our special people, I will send you a border crossing exemption, with a free ‘cut and colour’ coupon.
  Love and (masked) hugs…
  Jaxxy Vaxxy
  
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  October 7, 2021 10:45am
dcrane

Does anyone know if NZ vaccinators are aspirating the needle before the covid injection in order to be sure the drug is not administered intravenously? This step is being neglected in many countries, yet it was long regarded as a basic procedure for any intramuscular injection.

Dr. John Campbell has been raising the alarm. He seems to offer sober, informative medical information on covid.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBaIRm4610o
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgVsd6qoyU4
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October 7, 2021 8:03am
- argie bargie
  
  I was lucky enough to have an older nurse who knew how the process, and she happily obliged when I asked her to aspirate the needle.
  
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  October 7, 2021 10:01am
  - dcrane
    
    That’s good to hear.
    
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    October 7, 2021 11:30am
Yvette

Shut Down ‘They Are Us’ Movie, which side-lines victims of the March 15th terrorist attack
(from June 11, so 118 days)
74,759 have signed

Petition to change the name of New Zealand to Aotearoa and use te reo Māori names for towns, cities and places by 2026.
(launched September 15, so 22 days)
51,000 signatures

Charge Brian Tamaki over the illegal protest
152,240 have signed, still going (in four days)
https://www.change.org/p/nz-police-commissioner-charge-brian-tamaki-over-the-illegal-protest
All involved (in excess of 2000) were in breach of the current Level 3 regulations covering groups and gatherings.

Coster and deputy Commissioner Wally Haumaha spoke with Tamaki on Friday to discuss safety measures at the protest in light of COVID-19 restrictions.
Following the meeting, Coster wrote to Tamaki summarising their discussion.

• Did Commissioner Coster and Deputy Commissioner Wally Haumaha forbid any gathering, as it appears they should have under Level 3 conditions, or allowed it to proceed with a stated number and other conditions to comply with?

Police have taken a hands off approach to enforcement of illegal gatherings, most notably refusing to break up a rally of more than 1,000 anti-lockdown protesters who gathered at the Auckland Domain on Saturday. This was wise, because provoking a confrontation could have done enormous harm to social cohesion. But if police now start arresting people for low-level breaches, they will further erode social license. The authorities have snookered [screwed] themselves.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/oct/06/how-new-zealand-snookered-itself-by-calling-time-on-its-covid-elimination-strategy
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October 7, 2021 8:08am
Maggy Wassilieff

Kim Hill did a long interview with Chris Bishop at 6:10am, about the Government’s delay in getting the Pfizer vaccine, and now its delay in getting antiviral medication ordered.

https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/morningreport/audio/2018815376/covid-19-national-accuses-government-of-negligence-over-vaccine-procurement

At the end of the interview (not on this recording) she read out some derogatory comments that had just come in from listeners… including. something like
“Chris Bishop, just shut up” and ended with her customary giggle.

Classy stuff RNZ
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October 7, 2021 8:10am
- dcrane
  
  That is classic establishment – such people revert to high school insults the moment they’re cornered.
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:12am
- Benedict Yu
  
  That outfit is just a media arm of the government. They don’t even try to pretend any longer
  
  I listened to them in the car for years because I don’t really like commercial radio. But the bias and pidgin English ended it for me.
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:14am
  - Chris R
    
    In 1997 Lindsay Perigo described National Radio as the “pommie commies” I seem to recall. Has anything changed?
    
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    October 7, 2021 9:30am
  - Bridgenag
    
    The morning RNZ interviewers have a cute system where they turn down the microphone halfway through an answer they don’t like and over talk them. They also they chat and voice their own opinions after they have dismissed the interviewee. Where do we go for news? The TV1 site has gone weird. Never listen to the “1 news” now. Feel as though we have had a coup while distracted by the Covid fiasco.
    
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    October 7, 2021 9:56am
    - oldfella
      
      @bridgenag, can’t wait for the announcement confirming the final form of the Lab govt’s new TVNZ/RNZ amalgamation. All to be rebranded with a new, descriptive, Te Reo, name.
      How about ‘Puru Broadcasting Aotearoa’? (‘Puru’ to acknowledge its primary role of spreading govt BS.)
      Other suggestions?
      
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      October 7, 2021 10:59am
      - Bridgenag
        
        Extra they in the comment
        How about WOT [waste of time] BROADCASTING in cloud land or long cloud land.
        
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        October 7, 2021 6:18pm
- cmm
  
  Kill Hill has stated at least once that she’s proud to be a socialist.
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:21am
  - Tomtoddy
    
    Hill can “afford” to be a socialist on $300K a year. The test of her commitment to socialism would be how much of that income she either refuses to accept or that she gives away to a South Auckland family struggling to make ends meet.
    
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    October 7, 2021 8:26am
    - In Vino Veritas
      
      Or voluntarily gives over to the IRD. An argument I always make when I am told people should pay their fair share. None ever say what that “fair share” is. So, I ask, how much do you give as voluntary tax? Because you see, it’s never THEM that are not paying their fair share.
      
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      October 7, 2021 9:19am
  - cmm
    
    Sorry, typo there. I honestly didn’t mean to type Kill Hill.
    
    That was not an incitement to violence against Kim Hill or any other person.
    I hope nobody needed smelling salts.
    
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    October 7, 2021 10:19am
- Maggie Pie
  
  We saw a photograph of Kim Hill the other day.
  Don’t want to sound mean, but my partner’s mum is nearly 10 years older than Kim…..and looks about 10 years younger.
  
  Just saying.
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:25am
  - John Pakes
    
    Hisss
    
    12 38
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    October 7, 2021 8:37am
    - Yabster
      
      yes we realise your a pussy JP…
      
      18 3
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      October 7, 2021 8:45am
    - Northshoredoc
      
      Is that you Prof. Longhair ?
      
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      October 7, 2021 8:53am
  - G152
    
    Lying for a job must take it out of her
    
    9 1
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    October 7, 2021 8:39am
  - Biscuit
    
    Maggie, your ‘just saying’ got me to thinking…
    
    I have just sat down, had a bowl of Muesli, a Nespresso coffee and – I’m a devil – then another Nespresso coffee..
    
    And…
    
    I still can’t conceive of any situation where I’d want to see a photograph of Kim Hill.
    
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    October 7, 2021 10:02am
- R
  
  Kim Shrill, as she is known by, can be terribly unprofessional. Who can forget her interview with John Pilger?!
  
  Earlier this week she interviewed Judith Collins. She abruptly ended the interview and then said something that Collins couldn’t respond to as Hill had hung up! That was atrocious.
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:41am
- Simon
  
  Lol – RNZ.
  
  NZ will need boosters. After 4 or 5 months the vaxx doesnt stop hospitalizations or death.
  
  If you have had the double clot shot you will want a booster by March 2022. No booster consider by winter 2022 yourself unvaxxed.
  
  Where are the boosters? Will they be able to admin 2 million booster before winter 2022?
  
  NZ the hermit country to get hit hard winter 2022, just like everyone else has.
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:42am
  - oldfella
    
    @Simon
    I bet the fact that the current jabs offer only short term protection, and we’ll all need boosters next year, will not get a mention during this coming mad scramble to drive up our appalling vax rates.
    I’m double jabbed, but wish the govt would be more upfront with what is, and is not, on offer.
    
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    October 7, 2021 11:20am
    - Batman
      
      They’re not upfront because they don’t know, because the covid response has been good at one level but had absolutely nothing behind it, especially the vaccine programme.
      
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      October 7, 2021 12:16pm
- KevO'Brien
  
  Kim Hill is well past her use by date. She was stale 20 years ago. Probably now only worth 5 cents/kg.
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:02am
  - lifesgood
    
    She sounds like, and looks like, a very heavy smoker. She’d better watch out if covid comes her way.
    
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    October 7, 2021 3:30pm
- Suze Wainwright
  
  Kim Hill’s chuckle might just be her trying to reassure herself and laugh off Mike Hosking’s ratings…
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:06am
Mike

Wishing a very happy 90th birthday to Desmond Tutu.
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October 7, 2021 8:11am
- cmm
  
  While the other South African black leaders have been evil bastards one way or another (Mandela, Zuma, Ramaphosa,…), Tutu has almost universally been a force for good.
  
  Happy Birthday!
  
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  October 7, 2021 10:24am
Maggy Wassilieff

Another big announcement day today, it seems

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/453061/new-covid-19-testing-regime-to-be-announced-today

Let’s hope RNZ has figured out how to spell rigorous by this afternoon.
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October 7, 2021 8:13am
- alex Masterley
  
  Seems like another announcement of an announcement.
  Rapid antigen tests need to be permitted now. Not when Medsafe says so.
  They are commonly used in the UK and serve as a very good early warning system.
  The failure to permit their use is another failure of the government to do its duty by looking after its citizens.
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:32am
  - 70andstilllearning
    
    Ah – plan for government use/data control now sorted. Imports permitted!
    
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    October 7, 2021 9:05am
- graham
  
  “rigourous”
  
  Oh dear. 🙁
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:38am
Yvette

… case numbers are already highest among Māori and Pacific peoples, and the vaccine rollout has been worst among Māori due to poor targeting. So when we say “people will get sick and die” it’s Māori and Pacific peoples we mean.…
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/oct/06/how-new-zealand-snookered-itself-by-calling-time-on-its-covid-elimination-strategy

But hidden within that vaccine drive is an alarming inequality: only 57% of Māori have had their first jab and only 73% of Pacific peoples. That compares against 80% for Pākehā and 95% for Asian peoples. In the current outbreak Māori and Pacific peoples make up 83% of all cases. This confirms what we already know: that Covid-19 is a disease of the unvaccinated.
That means, in New Zealand, absent a dramatic change in vaccination rates, Covid-19 risks becoming a disease for brown people.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/commentisfree/2021/oct/05/by-ending-covid-elimination-jacinda-ardern-once-again-fails-to-turn-compassion-into-policy

The Treaty of Waitangi entitles Maori to protection
The Government (Crown) offers the vaccination as the only protection (apart from a few hygiene and spacing rules)
All New Zealanders must now be aware of that

But it is likely that none of this matters – if you are dead.
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October 7, 2021 8:14am
- Tauhei Notts
  
  The Guardian’s use of that snooker metaphor is apt.
  When you look at the people who have Covid one is reminded of what you do when you go in-off at snooker. You spot………
  
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  October 7, 2021 10:40am
CAKE FACE1

It has been obvious to me since day one that Zero Covid would fail.

It is surprising to me that the government seems to be completely caught out and and surprised by their strategy failing. How could they not know? They had no plan b, even though they had eighteen months to prepare one.

The current “short term” plan seems to be an eight week L3 lockdown in Auckland.

Longer term, it sounds like the entire country could be on L3 for two years plus, until the virus has become endemic.

There is not a shadow of doubt in my mind that the NZ government has handled this crisis the worst in the world.

Our economic costs, already monumental, will end up being far and away the highest as a percentage of GDP in the world. Already we must be close to first place, and we’re just getting started. Everyone else is finishing!

How have we performed on freedoms? Two more years of lockdowns will see us having performed comfortably the worst in the world.

Surely on health metrics we will do better than everyone else?

Alas, I still think we will perform amongst the worst in the world on this metric. We have no natural immunity – we are sitting ducks. We have very few ICU units, despite $150 billion spent on other stuff, and eighteen months sitting on our hands. Crucially, we have an incredibly unhealthy population.

An unmitigated disaster is on its way. It’s been rolling towards us for the past two years, like the fateful coin in “No Country For Old Men”.

Call it!
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October 7, 2021 8:15am
- cmm
  
  Zero Covid is like Zero Road deaths or any other stupid “policy”.
  
  It is just child-mind thinking to think you can wish it away.
  
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  October 7, 2021 10:26am
- ecco
  
  Would be interesting to see how much debt has been incurred per covid death by country. I’m sure NZ will be coming first in that league table.
  
  All the Ardern fans like to bleat on about how we’ve had so little deaths from covid. Of course these people have zero financial literacy and can’t seen any further than their own benefit/pension/nose. There has been a cost to taking this strategy, in people dying from other illnesses that haven’t got treated in time.
  
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  October 7, 2021 5:41pm
raven

Covid Conversations: 8 prominent doctors and scientists (video)
https://3speak.tv/watch?v=pandemichealth%2Fraukfhng&jwsource=cl

Worth a watch. They discuss that:
– The wrong protein was picked when making the mRNA vaccine (and it appears to be a biologically active molecule)
– Early treatment options are highly effective
– In their analysis about 90% of children don’t have covid; they have rhinovirus or RSV instead
– lockdown measures are resulting in lowered IQ in children.

So why are we still subjected to virus and vaccine propaganda?
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October 7, 2021 8:16am
Maggy Wassilieff

Just in case you haven’t hit Covid-overload yet..

How about being the first in your street with covid-toe?
Study reveals why some people get Covid toe condition
https://www.bbc.com/news/health-58801462
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October 7, 2021 8:18am
- PhilBest
  
  One of the things that has sickened me all along is that “post viral” conditions or viruses causing mystery symptoms, is a phenomenon that has been around forever. But the propaganda is relentless, that everything Covid does is something unique and new.
  
  The mood on websites and chat sites devoted to Chronic Fatigue Syndome is “Hel-looooooooooo, what’s new…. if you hadn’t been ignoring us poor bastards for the last 30 years you might know how to fix ‘Long Covid’ already”.
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:29am
- Taieri
  
  Study reveals why some people get Covid toe condition
  ——————–
  
  Said toe condition is more likely due to the climate change than to Covid.
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:40am
- Kiwi_in_Paris
  
  Is it like camel toe?
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:52am
- burt
  
  What I find curious is anything that happens to a person after getting covid is because of covid but nothing that happens to a person after getting the vaccine is because of the vaccine.
  
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  October 7, 2021 12:11pm
dime

Dime has a source very close to the buses that are driving around doing vaccinations…

One of the buses had a huge day yesterday..

they vaccinated… 16 people.
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October 7, 2021 8:23am
- Biscuit
  
  Dime, I had my second jab about a month ago.
  
  It wasn’t till I got home I realised that the good folk there hadn’t fully updated my wee card.
  
  No biggie … but after hearing the latest pronouncement from the Podium Of The Truth As We Wanna Portray It (about the introduction of vaccine certificates) I thought I’d better be a tad proactive in remedying that fault.
  
  So, around Noon yesterday, I went into a vaccination centre here, not the one I originally visited, and asked the v. helpful young lady if she could access my records on her laptop and then update my card.
  
  She could.
  
  She told me that I was only the sixth person (excluding accompanying kids on school holidays) to visit the centre that day…
  
  She commented that she really thought ‘our’ town was probably already at, or above, the magical 90% that Lord Ashley and Saint Jacinda had arbitrarily decided qualifies as ‘peak protection’ and that unless I was 80+ (I’m 69) or planning to visit a crowded Pasifika church I wasn’t likely to succumb to Covid…
  
  Curious, innit?, that the further away from the Podium Of The Truth As We Wanna Portray It you get, the more you tend to believe health operatives…
  
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  October 7, 2021 10:33am
- artemisia
  
  How many staffers on the bus? Could it be a highly successful taxpayer funded employment scheme?
  
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  October 7, 2021 10:37am
  - ecco
    
    Staff on the bus will be getting $25 an hour and double time in the weekends, for sure. Jobs for the bros…
    
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    October 7, 2021 11:14am
  - OTGO
    
    There are more staffers on the Shot Bro buses than there are paying customers on any of the regular buses driving around Auckland right now,
    
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    October 7, 2021 11:48am
all true

Just watch this one, a leading journalist from Germany and interviewed by three young Auckland woman living in Auckland
https://odysee.com/@voicesforfreedom:6/Freedom-TV-Ernst-Wolff:6
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October 7, 2021 8:23am
hmmokrightitis

Can some smart person please help me out – Ive been asking this question for weeks, and Im still yet to get an answer from anyone.

Weve had 2 winters of zero deaths from flu. Therefore, statistically speaking, we are around 1,300 deaths down on average.

What happens next winter when our flu deaths go through the roof, as history tells us they will?
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October 7, 2021 8:28am
- Ehlana
  
  Probably someone like Judith Collins or David Seymour will make a comment and they will then be attacked for trying to score political points out of people’s deaths, in a desperate attempt to make themselves relevant by attacking the good work this Government has done in keeping us safe from Covid-19. It will be pointed out that, of course, when they were last in government, many people died from flu and they did nothing about it.
  
  I think that should cover it – can anyone think of anything else that should be added to the attack?
  
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  October 7, 2021 10:09am
  - Bridgenag
    
    Why are the [400+..] Flu deaths that we had before never mentioned?
    
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    October 7, 2021 1:17pm
- cmm
  
  Of course it depends on how you count flu deaths.
  
  If you count them based on symptoms, then you get approximately 500 a year.
  If you count them based on sensitive test like the PCR test used for CV19 then there would be 10,000 a year (according to Baker).
  
  “Therefore, statistically speaking, we are around 1,300 deaths down on average.”
  
  It comes down to the harvesting effect. The flu normally takes those that are sick and frail and ready to go. Elsewhere there has been substitution and CV19 has been doing that job.
  
  But in NZ we’ve probably built up a lot of frail people that are going to give the Grim Reaper a bumper crop (be that through CV19 or flu).
  
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  October 7, 2021 10:32am
- bronny1
  
  I think we had all the missed deaths over summer. There was some data shared about that a couple weeks ago.
  
  This isn’t the source i recall from then, but seems to say same https://researchcommons.waikato.ac.nz/bitstream/handle/10289/14270/NZAE_Poster_postponed_deaths.pdf?sequence=14
  
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  October 7, 2021 11:21am
  - cmm
    
    Yup, virtually the grannies that Cindy “saved” last year are now dead by other causes anyway.
    
    Their grandchildren, however, need to live with the $100-200bn mess that has been created and will enslave a generation.
    
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    October 7, 2021 2:24pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  It might be blamed on climate change..
  It might be blamed on 9 years of neglect by the National Government ..
  
  It will not be blamed on over-insulated virus chambers (i.e. modern houses/apartments)
  
  It will not be blamed on lack of education about keeping safe and healthy during flu season
  
  It will not be blamed on poor flu vaccine roll-out to the vulnerable.
  
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  October 7, 2021 4:07pm
  - Doc Holliday
    
    So it’s lack of education that explains climate denial?
    
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    October 7, 2021 10:45pm
Yvette

But COVID-19 has its own rules – it targets the unvaccinated – and gangs chief among them.
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2021/10/covid-19-sweeps-through-new-zealand-s-underground-with-gangs-at-heart-of-waikato-delta-outbreak.html

Is his anthropomorphisation of the virus – giving it not only a brain, but “hate” or discriminatory motivation – actually media misinformation that misallocates the susceptibility of gang conditions to host the illness – gang ways at fault, not the virus?

… but the Government won’t front with numbers. They are happy to tell us the exact number of people linked to a Pacific Island church, but not the numbers linked to gangs. Why not? Do they know that NZers would be shocked how many are gang related? – David Farrar, kiwiblog 7am this morning
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October 7, 2021 8:28am
PhilBest

Comments placed at 7.10 am still not released from moderation, at 8.30am. Just curious if there is any parameters being aimed at in moderation delays.
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October 7, 2021 8:32am
- PhilBest
  
  9.10…. and my tone is now “worried that you guys are all OK”??
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:11am
JibberJabber

It’s all a jolly jape on ~~anti~~social media at the moment with the vaccinated gloating over how the unvaccinated can be banned from participating in normal life, sometimes from people who should know better.
Of course, it will all end in tears when they find themselves in a cattle car pulling out of Wellington, Auckland or Christchurch central et al for missing a booster shot or having the wrong opinion on yet to be determined group think?
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October 7, 2021 8:47am
- JibberJabber
  
  Yes, they really have done this.
  
  https://twitter.com/BernieSpofforth/status/1445670541159907334
  
  Anyone still not getting the picture yet?
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:00am
  - Ed Snack
    
    [deleted. Drawing unwarranted holocaust comparisons never gets a welcome reception on DPFs blog – Mod]
    
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    October 7, 2021 12:34pm
ecco

So blatantly obvious when Stuffed and the Ferald are putting out government sponsored propaganda every morning on their sites.

Articles like ‘Covid:19 Five things to expect between now and Christmas, as our coronavirus strategy changes.’ (Hendy is mentioned in this article, which is a sure fire sign that this article is just a government advertorial). Straight out of Ardern’s comms team in Wellington.

These two msm outlets are totally in Ardern’s grip due to wanting to gain access to the media bribe fund and also maintain their high volume, lucrative, government ‘covid related’ advertising revenue.
Such a joke to get that begging request at the end of every Stuffed article, when they are receiving millions of tax payer funds.

The only articles remotely independent and worth reading are all ‘hidden’ behind the Ferald paywall. The Ferald editor knows all too well that Ardern’s supporters won’t stump up for one of their subscriptions, so it’s safe to hide anti Ardern and right leaning articles behind that paywall and still keep up the ‘quota’ of right leaning articles appearing in the Ferald.

Most corrupt government NZ has ever seen with Ardern’s media bribe fund and other initiatives that are happening using tax payer money.

In saying that I must applaud tv3 and the newshub radio station for going out on a limb and consistently calling out the government for the increasing number of failures in tackling covid in NZ. Have enjoyed Hosking’s stand in, Yardley, in the mornings this week, who has been doing a great job calling the government to account.
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October 7, 2021 8:48am
- Flossie
  
  If I am not allowed (permitted??!) to travel to family at Christmas time then Ms Ardern better not be seen to be having any kind of wedding celebration with dozens and dozens of her lot in attendance.
  
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  October 7, 2021 10:36am
  - oldfella
    
    [leave out personal attacks on private lives – Mod]
    
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    October 7, 2021 11:27am
  - Ed Snack
    
    Nah, it’s different when they do it. Special permit will be issued, and only the serving staff will have to be masked.
    
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    October 7, 2021 12:35pm
- Biscuit
  
  ecco, the chances of Stuff getting any financial assistance from me are about as great as my 100%-male chances of becoming a mother.
  
  Their pleas for assistance offer you three choices of action:
  A) Yes, I’m a rabid Leftie. Have $500!
  B) Maybe later
  or
  C) I have already donated
  
  Clicking A), of course, would never get them off your back.
  
  Clicking B) simply has them reminding you that ‘maybe later’ happens far more often than it should.
  
  I thought I’d try a new tack and clicked on C). The ‘I have already donated’ one.
  
  A lie, of course, but they’re in the business of telling lies, right?
  (‘Your contribution, whatever the size, will allow us to continue providing quality journalism to all New Zealand.At Stuff, our mission has always been to provide you with trustworthy, accurate and reliable news and information.’)
  
  Did that work?
  
  Nope, today I got offered the three choices of action again…
  
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  October 7, 2021 10:47am
  - ecco
    
    I hate to tell you Biscuit but you are paying Stuff handsomely via the media bribe fund and the indirect government advertising contracts with Stuff, ostensibly in the name of covid. Stuff got over $2m from the first round of the media bribe handouts.
    
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300279296/covid19-the-government-media-bailout–who-got-what
    
    These contracts are actually a form of corporate welfare and bribery, in exchange for only spouting the government narrative. Thankfully this little arrangement seems to be breaking down with several journos calling it like it really is. Still far too many objective articles ‘hidden’ behind the Ferald paywall though.
    
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    October 7, 2021 5:46pm
    - Biscuit
      
      True, ecco!
      
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      October 7, 2021 8:04pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Looks like Auckland teachers aren’t keen to get back to work
https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/morningreport/audio/2018815393/covid-19-auckland-school-reopening-plans-worry-teachers

What a life, eh?
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October 7, 2021 8:50am
- MCos
  
  Working from home doesn’t count?
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:53am
- dime
  
  like clockwork.
  
  Dimes solution – you stay at home as long as you like until you feel safe. You wont be paid, but who cares about money if you feel that vulnerable.
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:53am
- Stu2
  
  Every primary school teacher should have been vaxxed by now, as their students will be vectors for the virus. Bet they haven’t.
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:55am
  - Ed Snack
    
    Actually, most studies show that children are both poor hosts and poor passers on for Covid.
    
    And if one tested properly, I suggest that one might find that most PCR 40 x amplification positive tests for Covid would also test positive for RSV and/or Rhino/Adeno viruses.
    
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    October 7, 2021 12:37pm
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  Because they have been told that they can avoid danger of catching covid with lockdowns. ‘Messaging’ prom propeganda corps needs to change to:
  Almost everyone is going to get covid during next 12 months. You can’t avoid it, you can only prepare. Get vaxxed, get healthy and get on with living.
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:00am
- kowtow
  
  “We really care about the kids” Yeah right.
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:01am
- Ruahine
  
  I don’t blame them at all. Fancy having to mingle with all those snotty nosed Auckland kids for six hours a day. One could catcha cold youse no.
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:05am
- Ehlana
  
  They do have a point though. If my hairdresser and I can’t be trusted to follow hygiene protocols, who actually believes classrooms full of young children who haven’t seen each other for weeks will do so?
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:16am
- Libertarians are right
  
  Easy fix for the Government employees who want to get paid for doing nothing. They are a big enough group of people that if they don’t get the vax, we won’t hit our targets.
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:17am
- smartin
  
  Union leaders have told RNZ their Auckland members are astonished….
  
  Don’t confuse what union leaders say with what teachers think.
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:28am
  - cmm
    
    “Don’t confuse what union leaders say with what teachers think.”
    
    Possibly, but it is surely close to impossible to survive a career in teaching if you’re constantly swimming against the tide of the unions and the people that vote for them.
    
    After 5 years of that, surely most non-union-friendly teachers just can’t take it any more and give up.
    
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    October 7, 2021 10:36am
- oldfella
  
  @Maggy, did you spot this nifty German solution to identifying those who have received the Rona vaccine?
  Germans show off their yellow badges to prove they’ve been vaccinated against COVID-19
  https://twitchy.com/brettt-3136/2021/10/06/germans-show-off-their-yellow-badges-to-prove-theyve-been-vaccinated-against-covid-19/
  Not sure the Germans have thought this one through.
  
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  October 7, 2021 11:44am
  - raven
    
    Do they change the badge colour every 6 months to show you’ve still got immunity?
    
    I guess the second-class citizens (un-vaccinated) should be banned from bars, cafes, swimming pools … sounds familiar.
    
    When this comes to us, will we have to choose a side, or will we tell government to bugger off?
    
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    October 7, 2021 12:53pm
    - Nickc2
      
      IMO, any certificate, badge, or the like identifying the holder as being up to date with Covid-19-D protective measures is meaningless if it doesn’t contain a photograph of the person entitled to carry and present it for entry/acceptance, etc and it must be incapable of being forged.
      Anything else is asking for trouble and defeating the intended purpose.
      
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      October 7, 2021 1:54pm
Kiwi_in_Paris

Apparently another Project Veritas video is coming out in 12 hours about Pfizer. In their words, this one is more shocking.
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October 7, 2021 8:51am
- westernScientest
  
  Thats good, because the last one was a real letdown, it wasnt anything that wasnt already in the public domain really.
  
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  October 7, 2021 10:39am
  - Ed Snack
    
    Well, it did contradict the standard narrative, but everyone who cares about the truth already knew, and those invested in the narrative don’t give a stuff about the truth and know that they themselves are just lying anyway, so it didn’t have a lot of impact.
    
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    October 7, 2021 12:41pm
Stu2

There is another Stuff story on ICU today. But this one has a crucial number – it says the usual spare ICU capacity across the country is 15 to 25 beds. Nothing.

A Covid outbreak would wipe that out quickly and mean operations had to be cancelled big time to free up ICU capacity.

And we are 100 specialist nurses short, which suggests the hospitals are going to struggle to staff their ICU surge capacity. Perhaps some nurses headed to oz during the pay dispute, we know there were recruiters here while the bubble was open.

Chickens + roost?

I can see why we are trying for 90% double dose while the aussies are reopening at 80%. They have vastly more ICU capacity.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/126599443/icu-plan-for-pandemic-covid19-wont-work-due-to-staff-shortages-expert-says
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October 7, 2021 8:52am
- Stu2
  
  The Covid patient that died in auckland yesterday had been in ICU for 40 days. The ICU numbers dropped to three at times during this outbreak, so we may have three long term cases in ICU.
  
  That may not be tenable during a major Covid load on the ICUs. Some tough calls might have to be made.
  
  What does it say to me? Get vaccinated.
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:00am
  - bronny1
    
    or lose weight/deal with your lifestyle diseases? Seems that these things kill even the vaccinated.
    
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    October 7, 2021 11:24am
R

John Tamihere wants private information about Maori Reo their vaccination status. That is a no-no. But let’s say he knows where unvaccinated Maori live, his approach to them is likely to fail for two main reasons.

Some unvaccinated Maori will say they have been vaccinated. They won’t want to get into an argument with some random door-knocker. So they will say what the door-knocker wants to hear, which is that they’ve been vaccinated.

Second, the few who may be prepared to admit that they have not been vaccinated may want answers to specific questions. Those questions may include:

Why are those receiving the vaccine not told about possible serious side effects?

Why are those receiving the vaccine not told about the high recovery rate of the relatively small number of people who ho have caught the virus? And why aren’t they told about the average age of those who have died with or from the virus?

Why are those receiving the vaccine not told that in January 2021, health officials here were saying that the vaccine has been approved for use, at the same they were discussing concerns about its safety?

Why are those receiving the vaccine not told that the vaccine’s effectiveness appears to wane considerably within a matter of months? And why aren’t they told that some medical experts and health professionals in the US wrote to the FDA and asked that approval be delayed because there is much about the various vaccines that is unknown?

Why is Pfizer indemnified against prosecution?

The random door-knocker won’t know the answers to these questions, so this issue and the earlier one (door-knockers being told what they want to hear) means that Tamihere’s plan – were he to gain access to private information- would be doomed to fail.
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October 7, 2021 8:58am
- R
  
  With the US awash in news about rising cases of the Delta variant, including among the “fully vaccinated,” the vaccine’s efficacy profile is in question. But some medical commentators are delivering an upbeat message. Former FDA commissioner Scott Gottlieb, who is on Pfizer’s board, said: “Remember, the original premise behind these vaccines were [sic] that they would substantially reduce the risk of death and severe disease and hospitalization. And that was the data that came out of the initial clinical trials.”
  
  Yet, the trials were not designed to study severe disease. In the data that supported Pfizer’s EUA, the company itself characterized the “severe covid-19” endpoint results as “preliminary evidence.” Hospital admission numbers were not reported, and zero covid-19 deaths occurred.
  
  In the preprint, high efficacy against “severe covid-19” is reported based on all follow-up time (one event in the vaccinated group vs 30 in placebo), but the number of hospital admissions is not reported so we don’t know which, if any, of these patients were ill enough to require hospital treatment.
  
  https://blogs.bmj.com/bmj/2021/08/23/does-the-fda-think-these-data-justify-the-first-full-approval-of-a-covid-19-vaccine/
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:07am
bronny1

It’s going to be interesting when the govt tries to make vax compulsory for teachers as indicated by CHipkins yesterday. According to last weeks news we are facing a massive shortage next year already.

My relative is a maths teacher/head of dept/dean at a medium sized school. She and one other teacher in her department will definitely leave if vax is mandated and two others are undecided. Perhaps they are not representative of NZ as a whole but even losing 2 teachers from EACH department at each school is massive. And to achieve what? Surely the students are more likely to infect each other? And given the latest showing viral loads are the same in vax and unvaxxed it seems like a very silly idea. Hope they try it.
https://www.ucdavis.edu/health/covid-19/news/viral-loads-similar-between-vaccinated-and-unvaccinated-people
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October 7, 2021 8:59am
- westernScientest
  
  well even if you make the generous assumption that we get to 90% vax, and that teachers are distributed approximately similar to the overall population in whether they will get vaxed or not, it stands to reason that you would lose 10% of teachers… Thats quite a lot by its self. Especially since its probably the maxist ones that are falling over them selves to try and get the unvaxed put into camps that will stay.
  
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  October 7, 2021 10:44am
  - Batman
    
    I know anecdata is not evidence but I’ll say it anyway…
    
    I personally know a Nat voting teacher (yes, a rare breed) who is champing at the bit for it to be mandatory following the challenges they had with just convincing their mainly left wing colleagues to get the flu vaccine, let alone the Covid one.
    
    So it’s possible that teaching is more like the good old days of two years ago when it was the left wing and Green voters who didn’t trust vaccines, and not the new Trumpist right wing.
    
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    October 7, 2021 12:03pm
    - All_on_Red
      
      https://unherd.com/thepost/the-most-vaccine-hesitant-education-group-of-all-phds/
      
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      October 7, 2021 3:46pm
Bobba Fret

Another lockdown death. Lock down causes more deaths than Covid.
https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/national/man-found-dead-after-disorder-incident-on-auckland-s-north-shore/ar-AAPd2dP?ocid=entnewsntp&pc=U531
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October 7, 2021 9:00am
smartin

People’s News update (sponsored by Pfizer):

>Government ministers are debating the finer points of when and where Aucklanders can use the lavatory. Health officials are awaiting Dr. Bloomfield’s latest advice on if and exactly how No. 1 or No. 2 may be permitted in an outdoor setting under Level 3, Step 1, and if masks are recommended.

>Continue to watch out for dangerous misinformation. Anti-health extremists may use the 68 vaccine-related deaths in NZ (latest Medsafe report https://medsafe.govt.nz/COVID-19/safety-report-29.asp) to push their loony propaganda. Rest assured that the Coroner has thoroughly investigated each of these deaths and bar one, ruled out any possible link to the vaccine.

>In exciting news, both main Parties have united for a glorious National Day of Action to promote the vaccine. The entire news media has also united in dedication to this wonderful cause in which all political differences will be put aside to support the glorious vaccination programme. The team of 5 million stand tall in support of this initiative.

>Trade Unions support ‘no jab, no job’ policy as Labour Day approaches, condemn those who oppose mandates and mass terminations as far-right facists.
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October 7, 2021 9:01am
Spring Bank Westie

For those of you who grew up with the great rock bands of the 70’s there is a 34 minute interview with Ian Anderson of Jethro Tull on youtube talking about their next tour and what an impact covid has on organising such an event.
It’s a long clip, but I found it to be one of the most informed and informative analyses of the true Covid situation, including his own testing of various masks, volunteering for beta vaccine testing, and even having a dig at NZ’s zero covid strategy.
Interesting for Tull fans and anyone who wants an unbiased view on what’s going on in the world.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rPKgNTVAiQU
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October 7, 2021 9:05am
Maggie Pie

TRENDING

Here’s a few facts about Cindy you might not have known…..

At this rate, we may well offer her an Honorary Membership of the Tennis Club 😀

https://networthandsalary.com/jacinda-ardern/
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October 7, 2021 9:07am
- Gravelroad
  
  If you actually read this drivel you will have seen that it claims Ms Ardern is married, is of mixed race and has American nationality.
  Not tennis club material.
  Nice serve though.
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:14am
  - Flossie
    
    And has light blond hair???
    
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    October 7, 2021 10:04am
    - oldfella
      
      [deleted for attacking physical attributes. This is your second moderation in an hour. One more and you’ll get a week off – Mod]
      
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      October 7, 2021 11:37am
- 70andstilllearning
  
  “Nick Name Jacinda Ardern”
  Think there might be a few other ones around!
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:14am
- dime
  
  If shes worth $14 million NZ, ill eat my own shite..
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:15am
  - Steve Otto(North Shore)
    
    The left are not good with numbers – we know this
    
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    October 7, 2021 10:39am
- RockyJ
  
  Hilarious Maggy. Her body measurements are 34-26-38. Just what I needed to know!
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:16am
- Sacha
  
  Oh.
  She’s American!
  Maybe that explains it.
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:17am
RoboRob

There are mumblings out of the Labour Maori caucus that the lifting of restrictions might need to be held up until more Maori get vaccinated.

I can sort of understand some of the reasons Maori might be hesitant to get the vaccine. But at this point, when the vax was available to Maori FIRST, it seems manifestly unfair to the rest of society for us to be held back because a subsection refuses to vax.

Certainly I suspect if the positions were reversed, Maori MPs would be complaining about Maori being held back by others.
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October 7, 2021 9:08am
surfing

Typical…

Taranaki Maori complaining about the vaccine rollout…

Graham Young, from Ngāti Ruanui, of South Taranaki, said money was a problem.

“That’s a real issue. All we’re funded for is for the jab into the arm. We’re not funded for the effort to get them there and that’s important going forward.’’

Maori now need funding to get off their butts and out of the house? Do we have to start funding maori to go to the supermarket? Or, to the kids rugby game?
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October 7, 2021 9:10am
- sooty
  
  More money for buses, with a door to door service and a meal of KFC aswell and a beer for the trip home!
  
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  October 7, 2021 2:54pm
Rusty

So Jacinda gave permission for a leading mongrel mob member (a criminal) to enter Auckland as a essential worker?

What a joke!

What’s next –Jacinda allowing the mongrel mob to assist the police keeping law and order in NZ?
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October 7, 2021 9:16am
ecco

Will be interesting to see if the Auckland members of the NZ men’s netball team are given an exemption to travel to Wellington for those netball games against the Silver Ferns in Wellington next week. My money’s on Ardern and Robertson allowing the men netball players to cross the border. It’s the ideal woke agenda that Ardern targets and fits her branding and voter bloc.

We saw this special treatment with the English netball series last month as well where the English netball team occupied multiple MIQ spaces ahead of NZ citizens trying for months to get back home. As we’ve seen the rules are applied differently depending on if you are one of Ardern’s target favourite sectors of the voting public.

Don’t get me wrong, I love netball, but it’s just another case of not what you know but who you know, when it comes to those Auckland border exemptions. I listened to that poor construction company owner yesterday who is stuck on the Auckland side of the border with 65 workers and has multiple unfinished housing projects 10 minutes on the other side of the border and has been turned down for exemptions 7 TIMES by Ardern’s government department. I mean how much are 65 construction jobs worth and the knock on effects of stopping his business in it’s tracks vs a couple of netball games?
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October 7, 2021 9:17am
- kowtow
  
  By the same token the persons with vaginas footy team that slipped the Hamilton lockdown , morally , should not travel to Chch this weekend.
  
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  October 7, 2021 10:48am
  - Paulus
    
    Just heard that Hamilton Airport is now in the exclusion zone – so they will have to try another airport Taupo or Palmy
    
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    October 7, 2021 2:00pm
- oldfella
  
  @ecco
  Not sure how the netballers can be given any kind of border exemption now the NPC’s Auckland teams have been knocked back.
  https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/provincial/126609633/npc-auckland-teams-ruled-out-after-government-knocks-back-exemption-bids
  
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  October 7, 2021 11:57am
  - ecco
    
    Let’s see what happens. She could kill three birds with one stone letting the Auckland men netballers travel to Wellington. ie the voting bloc of women/maoris/gays.
    
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    October 7, 2021 5:53pm
ABS4EVA

The RABID Anti Catholic Treatment
By ALL THE MEDIA to the

New Premier of NSW in AUS
is so so Hypocritical and Appalling.

Wow he has an Opinion in Abortion and
6 Kids

GASP ….

That is O Z Multiculturalism and
….. DIVERSTIY

It only applies to the CHOSEN FEW

and Certainly NOT – KIWIS

It is a Farce a Sham and a pretty SICK – JOKE
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October 7, 2021 9:18am
- Flossie
  
  I’m sorry but not totally sure what you’re trying to say here?
  
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  October 7, 2021 10:43am
  - Steve Todd
    
    Basically, Flossie, he is lamenting the fact that everyone is being mean to the new Premier of NSW, because https://bobmccoskrie.com/why-dominic-perrottet-will-make-the-liberal-elite-mad-as-hell/.
    
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    October 7, 2021 2:50pm
Kiwi_in_Paris

The new Project Veritas video on Pfizer is a doozy, according to Candace Owens, who just tweeted about it:

https://twitter.com/RealCandaceO/status/1445834239077924865
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October 7, 2021 9:24am
- Fletch
  
  It’s out now, I think.
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUXGB5FzhPc
  
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  October 7, 2021 2:09pm
Gravelroad

Wet and quiet on the gravelroad this morning so am having a trawl though online advertising (no, just clothes).
One retailer I have supported in the past has a new line in pants described as:
“Inspired from traversing the rocky takutai of the rivers in Aotearoa” and “the colour range references stones to be found in the crystalline water polished smooth over time.”
Ok, so using Te Reo has become a trendy (aka opportunistic) marketing tool, but am puzzled why a clothing manufacturer would want to use river water as an inspiration to purchase their products.
Havn’t all rivers, streams, creeks and waterways in rural areas been disgustingly degraded by the environmental vandals?
Won’t the pants be covered in mud and animal excrement?
Not buying.
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October 7, 2021 9:31am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  We went to our local roastery to pick up coffee beans…
  and I can now order a flat white in te reo….
  He mowai koa.
  
  cool eh!
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:37am
  - oldfella
    
    @Maggy, come back and brag when you can go into Starbucks and order a ‘Raspberry Cheesecake Mocha Frappuccino’ in Te Reo. 😉
    
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    October 7, 2021 11:51am
    - Nickc2
      
      He mowai koa
      No doubt that was the National Drink prior to 1840.
      Maori were the first Baristas in the world, weren’t they? They were running classes for Barista Apprentices prior to Capt James and Abe Tasman, weren’t they?
      
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      October 7, 2021 1:02pm
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      Yuck…
      that sounds revolting…
      
      Actually, I wasn’t bragging… but I liked the approach used in the cafe/roastery…
      
      They had xeroxed off sheets of words & phrases about ordering different types of coffee and tea in te reo… and just had them at the counter where folks could choose to read/ignore/take one.
      
      It’s an approach I like… I don’t appreciate being preached at or having stuff shoved down my throat, but I am receptive to having reading material provided with my coffee and munchies.
      
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      October 7, 2021 3:17pm
      - graham
        
        I think that probably most people are like that Maggy, and THAT is the reason that so many complain about the Maori being used in the news, in Government departments, on buses …
        
        Grown adults tend not to like having stuff spoon-fed to them or shoved down their throats, all the while being told ‘it’s good for you’ and ‘oh, you have to learn SOME Maori in order to be a REAL New Zealander’.
        
        Is it any wonder so many of us rebel? I honestly believe it’s not so much a dislike of the Maori language, it’s more a natural reaction to being told ‘you WILL learn xyz, and you WILL like it.’
        
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        October 7, 2021 4:52pm
- 70andstilllearning
  
  “Havn’t all rivers, streams, creeks and waterways in rural areas been disgustingly degraded by the environmental vandals?”
  
  3 W’s gunna fix – your ex retailer’s ahead of the competition.
  
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  October 7, 2021 9:43am
- westernScientest
  
  in the 70s, wasnt calf shit yellow coloured stuff all the rage? maybe its making a come back.
  
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  October 7, 2021 11:16am
  - sooty
    
    Yep, didn’t show the stains!
    
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    October 7, 2021 2:58pm
- Trev
  
  You are mistaking your words. Tutae is dung/excrement but takutai is the seaside or riverside in this case.
  
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  October 7, 2021 11:33am
Bill Felt

Mullet or ponytail?
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October 7, 2021 9:31am
rangitoto

Cindy’s voters again?

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/300424818/man-found-dead-after-police-called-to-disorder-incident-in-birkenhead-north-shore
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October 7, 2021 9:43am
otago-man

John Key’s interview seems to have panicked Ardern into a flurry of rushed ill thought out announcements
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October 7, 2021 9:49am
- Biscuit
  
  otago-man, that comment ALMOST seems to imply that our Saintess has made a habit in the past of making announcements that weren’t rushed and ill thought out.
  
  Can you link me to any of same?
  
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  October 7, 2021 11:20am
- herb1
  
  Her selection 4 years ago panicked her into a flurry of rushed and ill thought out announcements
  
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  October 7, 2021 11:36am
Tomtoddy

Question. What happened about the positive test for Covid in the Tauranga sewerage?

False test?? Quickly swept under the mat?? Inconvenient?? Not worth worrying about?? Was there a gang meet involving Auckland essential workers??
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October 7, 2021 9:55am
Flossie

I have reached such a low point that if I have to spend my remaining years wearing a stupid mask for no apparent reason then I don’t care if I get the disease and drop dead.
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October 7, 2021 10:02am
- Ehlana
  
  Time to give the news a break perhaps Flossie?
  
  Youtube has some lovely ambience videos of beaches, rivers, forests, etc. All much more relaxing than the daily diet of “news” – and probably just as informative.
  
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  October 7, 2021 12:10pm
  - Flossie
    
    Thank you. Mainly for caring…welled up when I read that.
    
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    October 7, 2021 12:41pm
    - Ehlana
      
      You’re welcome. This situation takes a toll on all of us.
      
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      October 7, 2021 2:33pm
dime

Im hearing some of the out of auckland cases are people in emergency housing. they were moved out of auckland without a test..
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October 7, 2021 10:09am
KevO'Brien

Is this where He Puapua is leading us too, as well as the land grab?
https://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2021/10/06/the-deracination-of-white-etnicities/

If we don’t value our hard won rights who else will?
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October 7, 2021 10:14am
Maggie Pie

A heads-up from twitter bestie Prof. Anne-Marie Brady.

Time to stock up on……. ‘XO Sauce’.
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October 7, 2021 10:21am
dime

Gang members trashing Jet park. Cops there. lol

how expected
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October 7, 2021 10:21am
- ecco
  
  They need to be isolating in prison. Mind you that’s probably already full.
  
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  October 7, 2021 11:16am
  - dime
    
    Cant we chuck em on an island? like we do with native birds?
    
    Im happy to have a mix of gangs on each island 😀
    
    Every week we do an air drop of Green party approved food.
    
    Come back in 3 months and see whats left
    
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    October 7, 2021 1:00pm
- Nickc2
  
  Taxpayers will pay the bill!
  
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  October 7, 2021 12:39pm
ross.mc

NEWSFLASH. Sweden, Denmark pause Moderna COVID-19 vaccine for younger age groups.
https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/sweden-pauses-use-moderna-covid-vaccine-cites-rare-side-effects-2021-10-06/
How far behind is Pfizer? Can somebody please let Jacinda and Ash know about this?
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October 7, 2021 10:25am
- dcrane
  
  Fwiw, the article says that these countries now recommend Pfizer.
  
  “Sweden and Denmark said they now recommended the Comirnaty vaccine, from Pfizer/BioNTech (PFE.N), instead.”
  
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  October 7, 2021 11:48am
- virtualmark
  
  The Moderna vaccine has a much higher incidence of myocarditis than the Pfizer one does.
  
  To be fair it’s still a rare complication. But a lot less rare than with the Pfizer vaccine.
  
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  October 7, 2021 3:30pm
graham

Good news! The Covid cluster in the gangs is all fixed, and no way are they dealing meth across the alert level borders.

How do we know? Because someone from the Mongrel Mob says so.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/covid-19-delta-outbreak-waikato-mongrel-mob-says-cluster-resolved-not-distributing-meth-across-border/5VWVOCCNIP6X2FQ3LUSONOVVVU/

Oh well, that’s all fine then. I trust them … don’t you? I mean, there’s no way the gangs would LIE, is there – they’re such fine upstanding citizens.
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October 7, 2021 10:58am
- Hollyfield
  
  I heard that interview on ZB yesterday afternoon. She was very defensive and antagonistic, and could rival Jacinda for waffling without answering a question. Simon & James were very gentle in their questions, and she was so rude in return. I didn’t believe a word that came out of her mouth. After she said the cases were resolved, Simon/James asked if that meant there were no longer any positive cases in the gang, and she waffled around and eventually said “it’s resolved”. She also said that “about 4” members had had covid. That doesn’t seem likely to me.
  Simon/James also asked if Sonny’s visit to Auckland had been successful and people had been vaccinated, and she waffled and waffled and said nothing. She is apparently their PR person – I would say the gang’s not getting their money’s worth from her, but she proudly states she’s a volunteer, so maybe they are getting exactly what they (don’t) pay for.
  In comparison, a man representing Sonny phoned Kerre’s programme in the morning, and he answered questions and stated the gang’s position calmly and reasonably.
  
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  October 7, 2021 4:21pm
Yvette

If, the Government has targeted Māori health as a priority area for spending in Budget 2021, and allocated $242.8 million for the sector, and that includes $98 million to set up the new Māori Health Authority (MHA), why can the principles, that justify this committed spending, not be applied to the present priority to ensure as many Maori as possible are vaccinated?
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October 7, 2021 11:11am
- Bridgenag
  
  Amazing how much money goes to the 16%
  
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  October 7, 2021 1:19pm
  - sooty
    
    When you add year on year for maori health. The treaty settlements. All the other stuff paid for. The maorifacation of very government dept and council. There can’t be much tax money left for personal vanity projects!
    
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    October 7, 2021 3:08pm
  - kevn
    
    @Bridge… The Brits think much the same of the Scots I gather.
    
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    October 7, 2021 3:15pm
CAKE FACE1

I never thought I’d post a link to a Trotsky article, but there is a first time for everything:

https://thedailyblog.co.nz/2021/10/07/will-jacinda-stand-or-has-she-already-fallen/

“MATTHEW HOOTON has raised the possibility of Jacinda Ardern being gone by Christmas. (Paywalled) He puts forward the scenario of New Zealand becoming as debilitated and beleaguered by Delta as New South Wales and Victoria. With the number of community cases surging above a thousand every day, the hospitals overwhelmed, and people dying for lack of ICU beds, Hooton insists that not only would Jacinda be obliged to go…”

The rest of the article is nonsense, but this is an interesting theory.

We will see…
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October 7, 2021 11:12am
- Paulus
  
  Never !
  
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  October 7, 2021 2:17pm
- lifesgood
  
  We can but dream.
  
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  October 7, 2021 3:40pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Hooton’s dreaming!
  
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  October 7, 2021 8:00pm
- Vory v zakone
  
  Yep she is a goneburger, if not by Christmas then early 2022. (And not because of the WuFlu debacle or Cindy4UN either)
  
  Bookmark Hooton’s article and this comment ?
  
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  October 8, 2021 1:19am
cmm

According to Stuff, the Chch hospital is squalid.

What rubbish. I was a patient there last year and it was perfectly adequate. Not 5 star, but certainly up to the job!

If it really is a critical time then we should be considering creating wards out of any suitable resources. People shouldn’t be worrying about a few scuff marks on the walls.

If it really is critical to get this set up, then stop looking for perfection. That gets in the way of good enough.

There’s not a hell of a lot you need for a Covid ward for large volumes of people. All you need is a bunch of beds and an oxygen supply to each. Take a school hall, put up 100 beds and get some rolls of plastic pipe from Mitre 10 to set up oxygen reticulation. Job done.

The same for MIQ: get a bunch of tents and set them up in a camp ground. All that fresh air is far better than being cooped up breathing airconditioner-recycled aerosols.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/126607226/ward-upgrade-at-squalid-christchurch-hospital-wing-to-take-covid19-patients
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October 7, 2021 11:22am
- dcrane
  
  Yes we need more of this thinking and less of the reasoning that says anyone working near a road has to put up traffic cones for miles and hire stop and go workers.
  
  9 1
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  October 7, 2021 11:46am
- Stu2
  
  You’ve misread the story CMM I think
  
  They said the quake damaged wing where they are getting a ward ready for covid patients was squalid, not the whole place
  
  3 2
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  October 7, 2021 11:57am
  - cmm
    
    They are talking about the Parkside wing.
    
    I was a patient there 20 months ago. It might be a bit tired looking in places, but it is perfectly fit for purpose.
    
    4 0
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    October 7, 2021 1:39pm
  - cmm
    
    Of course Parkside looks a bit tired when compared to the new obs/gyne wing and the new outpatients’ building. No dobt the staff prefer to work in the flash new buildings too (don’t we all like new stuff?). But that does not make it “third world” and squalid.
    
    I’ll bet the people bleating it is third world have never been to a third world hospital.
    
    I’ll bet most of the board members making noises are on a power rush. They want to add “demanded a multi-hundred million dollar upgrade” on their CV to impress themselves and their friends.
    
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    October 7, 2021 2:06pm
70andstilllearning

Pity the divorce will drag on at least 2 years more…

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/mood-of-the-boardroom-honeymoon-is-over-business-leaders-rate-prime-minister-jacinda-ardern/T2U3MFPE57S4ABIE6RT27FHGDA/
12 2
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October 7, 2021 11:40am
- Inandout
  
  70, the biggest problem with this govt is they have no idea where they are going. Any successful business owner knows without planning you may as well close your doors; academics haven’t a bloody clue what road to take. We are being led by aimless idiots.
  
  16 1
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  October 7, 2021 12:13pm
  - KevO'Brien
    
    They enjoy the game of catch the covid carrier.
    The advisers only follow what is on their games board and do not consider consequences outside those boundaries.
    
    What say they “saved” everyone but killed the economy so there was no work and all died from hunger?
    
    The lock downs are making the next year appear to be very bleak. The global catastrophe about supplies is starting to be felt here now and can only intensify. The other problem of no production and great spending “financed” through money printing is seeing prices taking off world wide.
    
    7 2
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    October 7, 2021 1:13pm
  - Paulus
    
    I am told that Confucius said
    “If you do not know where you are going any road will take you there”.
    
    8 0
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    October 7, 2021 2:19pm
CSadler

When will the hospitality industry figure out that making it harder to visit their establishments is unlikely to improve their economic outcome? Looking at you “publicity junkies” who I do not care to name.

As to the optics/logic of forcing people to wear masks to go to the counter then taking them off to eat/drink… right up there with Air NZ in the logic stakes.

The long term backlash from the safety propoganda machine may well be a substantial protracted shift away from dining out and a retreat to home entertainment (for those not already hiding under their bed). I can still remember when going to a restaurant was something done on birthdays or anniversaries (my parents’). Wonder if El Matador is still open with a dance floor…
10 1
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October 7, 2021 12:38pm
Maggie Pie

TRENDING

Developer offers hope to first-home-buyers looking to get on Auckland property ladder.

Only ONE catch…..they need to be ‘FULLY VACCINATED’!!

https://twitter.com/IndoCoalminer/status/1445674435134955521
5 2
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October 7, 2021 1:06pm
- All_on_Red
  
  Kelly McEwan- lol
  Not someone I would buy off
  
  4 1
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  October 7, 2021 2:20pm
The Boss

I find it very odd that the daily case numbers always end with a 9. Just saying.
12 1
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October 7, 2021 1:29pm
Bridgenag

Apart from wanting to know who is making the money from the slow testing up the nose procedure….I think I have worked out why people are waiting in 3 hour queues[or used to] If they have Covid, they and the whanau can have another holiday at home. Too bad about the poor sod paying the wages. And all of us subsidising everything
7 0
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October 7, 2021 1:30pm
Benedict Yu

Chris Hipkins says:

“We need those who have been vaccinated to have those conversations, he says. If you are vaccinated, talk to those who aren’t.”

Yes well good luck with that. People who have not been vaccinated by now do not want to get vaccinated. I only have one friend who has not been vaccinated. If I decided to “talk” to her she would tell me to shut up.

I just find all this crap of treating people like children. And that includes Maori. Any Maori person who phones up today to get vaccinated would be welcomed with open arms. What is the problem we are trying to solve here?
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October 7, 2021 1:35pm
Maggie Pie

And have you noticed lately that when you ask somebody something, they always begin the answer with saying…

“That’s a great question”
12 1
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October 7, 2021 1:36pm
- NoFax
  
  That’s a great question, I haven’t noticed that.
  
  13 0
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  October 7, 2021 2:09pm
- westernScientest
  
  patronising isnt it
  
  8 0
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  October 7, 2021 2:59pm
David Garrett

So, another 29 cases, and it’s now well into the Waikato…even remote Kawhia, permanent population less than 1000.

And this clown show demonstrates once again that they are making it up as they go along…Having first recommended a three week gap between the two vaccinations it then became six weeks – that was the advice I got when I had my first shot.

Now the party line is that we “should consider a shorter interval” between the two shots – without even saying how long that “shorter interval” should be.

They haven’t a clue as to how best to deal with this “deadly outbreak” which has so far killed TWO people, both described as “elderly”.
24 1
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October 7, 2021 1:47pm
- Benedict Yu
  
  There is good evidence that the optimum time between vaccines is 8 – 12 weeks. I now wish I had waited longer. We copied Israel with a 3 week gap, and there is good consensus internationally that is too short for optimum immunity.
  
  As for the pandemic, I’m not going to get into prediction games. But a plausible scenario is that once this thing gets going it will rip through the unvaccinated over the next 12 months and then through the vaccinated on a slow burn.
  
  You just need to look at Victoria – about the same population as NZ. Why would the deaths and hospitalisations be much different here?
  
  11 1
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  October 7, 2021 2:04pm
  - David Garrett
    
    Benedict: I had my first shot about 4 weeks ago. I was told then that the optimum interval was six weeks…so I am booked to have the next one in a week’s time.
    
    Now the instructions are changing, as they make it up as they go along. I wouldn’t mind so much if they actually admitted that that is what they are doing…it is perfect reasonable to alter views in the light of new evidence. But no; like in “Animal Farm” it is suggested that each new instruction had applied all along.
    
    23 1
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    October 7, 2021 2:18pm
    - Benedict Yu
      
      They want to reduce the gap to two weeks because they want to hit the “90 percent” target.
      
      But a 2 week gap is a VERY BAD move if the objective is to maximise the effectiveness of the vaccine. I mean a really bad idea – nobody internationally is doing that.
      
      If you want to maximise thee benefits you get from the vaccine, I would recommend you have about a 10 week gap – so get your second shot in the first week of December. As I said, I had a three week gap and I regret it.
      
      Just so you don’t think I am talking out of my arse, read this. British Medical Journal. I’ll take that over Chris Hipkins any day. In fact my advice is to pay ZERO attention to anything the Government recommends on the COVID vaccines.
      
      https://www.bmj.com/content/374/bmj.n1875
      
      16 0
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      October 7, 2021 2:57pm
      - septic skeptic
        
        A longer gap is of course only optimal if you don’t get Covid before your second dose kicks in. Personally I wouldn’t be waiting a full ten weeks if I had only had one shot. Partly because by the time your immunity declines next year the situation will almost certainly have changed considerably. New vaxes, boosters and variants.
        
        2 0
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        October 7, 2021 3:06pm
      - Benedict Yu
        
        Sorry that makes no sense at all. If you have a 10 week gap, the science says that your immunity will be much stronger and decline more slowly.
        
        4 0
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        October 7, 2021 4:18pm
      - septic skeptic
        
        Sorry BY, but re read what I said. Let’s say you got your first jab today and will encounter the virus in 6 weeks time (hypothetically). Are you better off with a 3,6, or 10 week gap to your second appointment?
        And nobody knows what the environment will be in 6 months time when efficacy from the jabs will be waning.
        
        5 1
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        October 7, 2021 4:49pm
    - Yvette
      
      @ David Garrett – You were told a month ago, that the optimum time was six weeks, because that was optimum for the Government – as they hoped to slow second doses up to allow them to get more people in for first doses in that three week period they had created – not to individually benefit you. Now, although as Benedict Yu points out just above, “There is good [international] evidence that the optimum time between vaccines is 8 – 12 weeks”, but the Labour Government has collapsed their six week interval back to three weeks, to second dose people as fast as they can, as well as do as many first jabs as they can. They must now have more capacity to do both.
      
      And one wonders why they are doing that – do they know the pandemic is on the verge of turning endemic.
      Or has Jacinda just got Christmas in mind – Christmas, which suffers a bit from being so commercialised and is now the be politicised?
      
      10 0
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      October 7, 2021 2:58pm
    - dcrane
      
      Four legs good, two legs better!
      
      6 2
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      October 7, 2021 3:01pm
    - Paul Marsden
      
      Which is why I do my own research and take my own counsel when it comes to all matters relating to the virus. Have done since I first became aware of it in China, late Oct 2019. One needs their head read if you rely upon anything this govt is involved in.
      
      8 0
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      October 7, 2021 4:14pm
- Paulus
  
  Could this short now rush period now be because the vaccines currently available have a short use by date – even when they were bought from Denmark and Spain a few weeks ago.
  
  9 0
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  October 7, 2021 2:22pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    More than possible.
    
    2 0
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    October 7, 2021 8:08pm
- rangitoto
  
  I’ve yet to see a good explanation of the India stats.
  
  https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/india/
  
  1 0
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  October 7, 2021 3:44pm
  - fernglas
    
    They rapidly acquired natural immunity by being infected, as well as having a degree of resilience in any event because there are so many other bugs drifting around there the whole time. The explanation of the Indian stats is that nature was allowed to take its course.
    
    3 0
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    October 7, 2021 6:13pm
NoFax

It seems the vaccination numbers are starting to improve – yesterday was 70k which is the highest it has been in weeks.

I wonder why the turn around? Vaccine passports? Some other reason?
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October 7, 2021 2:12pm
- Stu2
  
  First doses are up due to what is happening
  
  Second doses are way up because people got first doses 6 weeks ago (first doses peaked at the end of July)
  Second doses (if still on a 6 week cycle) will be strong for the rest of October.
  
  7 0
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  October 7, 2021 2:45pm
- dcrane
  
  Failure of elimination strategy, and the knowledge that covid is now here and spreading.
  
  4 1
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  October 7, 2021 2:59pm
- Steve Todd
  
  I wonder why the turn around? Vaccine passports? Some other reason?
  
  Whatever the reason, it’s great, though, eh?
  
  4 6
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  October 7, 2021 2:59pm
  - westernScientest
    
    Not really, its mostly people getting jabed before the optimal window. If your going to do it, at least do it properly.
    
    7 0
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    October 7, 2021 3:12pm
- westernScientest
  
  mostly 2nd doses, It is probably the change in policy from 2nd dose at 6 weeks to 2nd dose now.
  
  18k 1st doses though, so still double what it had been, probably the vax pass and that it does now look like it is going to get up and run so there is a reason to get one. I will get a dose in the next few days for that reason. There was no benefit to get it until it looks like you might actually encounter covid, which during elimination was extremely unlikely.
  
  Keep in mind, if it ran at 10,000 new cases a week, it would still take a year to infect half a million people. So realistically probably still jumping the gun on doing it now, but the stupid pass stuff tips it over the edge for me. It wont be festivals, it will be everything by the end of the first quarter of 2022.
  
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  October 7, 2021 3:10pm
  - MCos
    
    “There was no benefit to get it until it looks like you might actually encounter covid”
    By that stage you could be too late.
    A bit like converting to Christianity on your deathbed, just in case.
    
    3 1
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    October 7, 2021 6:21pm
Maggie Pie

WHOOPSIE! Say again Greta??

https://twitter.com/Frances40996115/status/1444562174098219009
4 3
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October 7, 2021 2:46pm
- dcrane
  
  That’ll be a deceptive edit, for sure. Need to hear the context leading up to that segment.
  
  It was fun when she had a go at Jacinda tho.
  
  4 2
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  October 7, 2021 2:58pm
kowtow

The Waikato persons with vaginas rugby team has upped sticks and moved again , first to beat the Hamilton lockdown and now from Cambridge , all so they play footie in Kung flu free South Island this weekend.

While they have not broken any laws surely this is morally reprehensible and is the type of thing that elicits all sorts of odium from the great and the good when other people do it.

Where’s the outrage ?
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October 7, 2021 3:43pm
- Russ the Muss
  
  From a organizational risk perspective , NZ rugby should have put them in their box. Poor leadership. If one if them transported the virus to the SI the damage to NZ rugby would rightly be huge. A risk not worth Taking for a massive corporate with a good reputation.
  
  4 1
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  October 7, 2021 6:14pm
dcrane

From the NYPost – US government secretly ordering Google and other search engines to track and provide data on anyone who searches certain terms through “keyword warrants”

https://nypost.com/2021/10/06/us-government-ordering-search-engines-to-provide-search-data/
7 1
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October 7, 2021 3:48pm
- Russ the Muss
  
  Very ‘secret’
  
  1 0
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  October 7, 2021 6:15pm
  - dcrane
    
    Is the list of keywords publicly available?
    
    1 1
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    October 7, 2021 8:16pm
Nickc2

Cindy’s mentor (Chairman Dan, Victoria Aust) has initiated a rather drastic measure. If you aren’t up to date with your Covid-19-D inoculations, you’re not allowed into the City of Melbourne.
https://www.melbourne.vic.gov.au/news-and-media/Pages/Statement-from-City-of-Melbourne-CEO-Justin-Hanney.aspx
Will Cindy make this edict Lockdown level 3 step 1 [Mod] for Akld and Hamilton?
3 2
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October 7, 2021 3:52pm
- JerJer
  
  I agree . He is a complete twat. He is just saying you can’t go to council buildings. No one will care about that.
  
  3 1
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  October 7, 2021 5:43pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    I think Premier Dan will have a few other things to worry about in the next few weeks..
    
    https://www.skynews.com.au/australia-news/politics/victoria-premier-daniel-andrews-grilled-over-ibac-investigation-knowledge/news-story/c6755ad48dd1c7df2fe88ca394794d56
    
    https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-10-07/daniel-andrews-covid-tests-ibac-corruption-hearings/100521078
    
    3 1
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    October 7, 2021 8:13pm
WaveyDavey

In other “The Experts™” “what a difference 6 months makes” news

March: Covid-19: Rapid testing at sold-out music concert in Spain unnecessary in New Zealand, vaccination requirements the way to go

October: Expert calls for rapid antigen testing

See if you can spot “The Expert™”

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/124684458/covid19-rapid-testing-at-soldout-music-concert-in-spain-unnecessary-in-new-zealand-vaccination-requirements-the-way-to-go?rm=a

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2021/09/expert-calls-for-rapid-antigen-testing-for-essential-workers-moving-between-level-borders.html

And we still listen to these shysters?
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October 7, 2021 4:34pm
cmm

Wasn’t half the point of using hotels for MIQ that hotels were already set up to receive and cater for the guests/inmates?

So why the hell are kosher meals being flown from Auckland to Christchurch?

Majorly entitled chap though…
“I am entitled to three warm meals like everybody else.”

“Well hang on, why am I different from everybody else? Everybody gets three proper meals a day with vegetables and meat or whatever, when I have to live on crackers and bread for 14 days.”

Well, yes, why are you different from everyone else? Nobody is forcing you to eat crackers. Why not eat something that other people eat? I bet there’s a vegan option and that is probably kosher!

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/covid-19-delta-outbreak-kosher-miq-meals-being-flown-frozen-from-auckland-to-other-facilities/XVGFOUC2T5RG24IDBMLZVYMSLQ/
10 1
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October 7, 2021 4:37pm
- MCos
  
  There goes that ‘entitled’ word again.
  
  That chap sounds particularly fussy.
  
  I wonder what would happen if he spent a bit of money getting his own food sent in?
  
  6 1
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  October 7, 2021 6:02pm
  - Taieri
    
    There goes that ‘entitled’ word again.
    
    That chap sounds particularly fussy.
    ————
    
    There’s nothing “entitled” about it. This bloke pays a few thousand dollars for the doubtful pleasure of being incarcerated in the MIQ facility. The least he can expect is an edible food. The rubbish pictured here: https://www.odt.co.nz/news/national/miq-meals-not-fit-human-consumption
    I’d not feed a pig with.
    
    3 2
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    October 7, 2021 6:53pm
- Ehlana
  
  Am I seriously to believe that a hotel in Christchurch is incapable of cooking and serving kosher food? I know we don’t have a vast Jewish population in NZ, but we do have tourists, so it can hardly be unknown to the hospitality industry. Did they try contacting their local synagogue? It’s only been there since 1864…
  
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  October 8, 2021 6:49am
westernScientest

another LOL for your afternoon:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300425113/covid19-plan-for-communitybased-isolation-under-way-as-miqs-fill-up

they really have no idea what they are doing. How come this wasnt thought of before now, its not like it isnt glaringly obvious.

“The news comes as figures supplied to Stuff from the Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment (MBIE) suggest quarantine spots for positive cases could be filled in a week.”
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October 7, 2021 5:08pm
Maggie Pie

Louise confirms to HDPA…

“No Covid in the Kingdom”
3 1
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October 7, 2021 5:45pm
ecco

Why does Ardern keep ducking for cover and not fronting at the 1pm podium of truth when there’s bad news to be announced? Instead chucks out her henchmen to face the music. Today it was that woman Verrall. I can’t stand the way they all read verbatim off some speech writer’s speech. They need to go to toastmasters.

Then we see Ardern is going to do a road trip around Gisborne to cajol the locals to get vaccinated. What about grow a pair and go and see how some of the Auckland small business owners are coping? Do a walkabout down some of the main Auckland suburban strips and get their feedback on how they’re finding her regime.
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October 7, 2021 5:57pm
- fernglas
  
  I missed today’s event. Did Tova or Jessica ask Verrall what she thought of the fact that rapid antigen tests have still not been introduced despite her recommendation to that effect over a year ago?
  
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  October 7, 2021 6:17pm
Stu2

A few numbers from NSW
They hit 70% double dose yesterday and are about 90% single dose

190 in ICU, break down:
Double dose – 1.6%
Single dose – 17.6%
Unvaccinated – 80.8%
7 1
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October 7, 2021 5:58pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Good.
The cops have arrested 2 Waikato/Hamilton men and charged them with the murder of Anthony Bell.

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/453112/two-charged-with-murder-over-king-country-dad-s-death-after-road-rage-incident
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October 7, 2021 6:17pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  We watched a doco on Aljaz last night…..
  ‘Execution Day – Huntsville Texas’.
  
  The female presenter was saying since 1982 until September this year, 572 have been executed by lethal injection – all of them for murder.
  Still nearly 200 inmates on ‘death row’ waiting for the jab.
  She interviewed a number of Huntsville residents on the streets….all said they slept very well at night knowing God was on their side.
  
  Here….life sentence – out in 9.
  
  NZ = The free range asylum.
  
  8 3
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  October 7, 2021 6:58pm
  - WaveyDavey
    
    “Cultural” reports to come…
    
    “Colonisation made me an axe-murderer”
    
    3 2
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    October 7, 2021 9:05pm
fernglas

It looks like David Garrett’s legacy to law and order will be gone soon.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/453106/man-to-be-resentenced-after-supreme-court-rules-three-strikes-sentence-beyond-excessive
4 1
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October 7, 2021 6:27pm
- Maggie Pie
  
  Perhaps Judge Winkelmann will consider putting Dan up in her house for a few months while they try to find him… ‘suitable accommodation’?
  
  SCHEESH!!
  
  4 2
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  October 7, 2021 7:16pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  The poor man should have been in the full-time care of mental health services yonks ago — not dumped out on the streets of Wellington.
  He has been known to the Psychiatric services for decades:
  
  Mr Fitzgerald is a schizophrenic who first presented to Psychiatric
  Services, in a grossly psychotic state, as a 15 year old. He is now 45 years old and in
  the intervening period has had numerous engagements with mental health providers.
  He has consistently been on medication with varying success. He requires constant
  mental health input
  
  https://forms.justice.govt.nz/search/Documents/pdf/jdo/dc/alfresco/service/api/node/content/workspace/SpacesStore/9c62c8ae-fbf4-40e9-b253-c501c96a82fc/9c62c8ae-fbf4-40e9-b253-c501c96a82fc.pdf
  
  4 1
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  October 7, 2021 7:51pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    Sitting here reading that link and finishing off a very leggy Shiraz (done Venison Medallions for dins).
    Just thinking to myself….. there would probably be a few government appointed Supreme Court Judges and a shiny-arse Police Commissioner, who’d be very happy that Winnie never anointed MOI to be Prime Minster.
    For a start, you would have been my Min. of Police, Maggs…..and David Garret the Chief Justice.
    
    2 3
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    October 7, 2021 8:26pm
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      I think I’d be better as Minister of Racing.
      
      3 0
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      October 7, 2021 8:51pm
      - Tauhei Notts
        
        I would not want to carry out a Caslick on a mare like you.
        
        1 0
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        October 7, 2021 9:48pm
fernglas

This Baker person has taken leave of his senses. How the hell is decriminalising the use of meth going to stop the suppliers from crossing the borders to get to their markets? Someone should remind these rod-wallopers that they are health experts, not social justice warriors. If they can’t keep their politics out of their opinions, they should be dismissed as experts for lacking impartiality.
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2021/10/coronavirus-michael-baker-calls-for-drug-decriminalisation-as-part-of-effort-to-stamp-out-covid-19.html
6 3
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October 7, 2021 7:33pm
Doc Holliday

Michael Baker is a professor of public health and you are _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
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October 7, 2021 10:48pm

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editor@kiwiblog.co.nz

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