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September 9, 2020 8:00am by Kokila Patel

General Debate 09 September 2020

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General Debate

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PhilBest

More good stuff from Gary Moller, noted athlete and sportsmedicine doctor

https://www.garymoller.com/post/how-to-escape-from-our-covid10-prison-the-plan?postId=5f555abe2191660018be18ad

“How NZ should escape from its Covid prison”
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September 9, 2020 8:00am
- PhilBest
  
  He is right. What we are seeing is the uselessness of “Big Pharma” driven, bureaucratized “mainstream medicine”.
  
  How much messaging have you seen from official agencies about the value of health self-help through nutrition and supplementation, for example? Even among over-80-year-olds who get Covid, the survival rate is around 60 to 70 percent. I bet the survivors are not just those with less serious underlying health conditions, I bet they are the people who’ve consciously looked after themselves, ate healthily, supplemented intelligently etc.
  
  People in a state of hysteria about Covid-19 who are not taking Vitamin C, D, and Zinc at least, and not getting themselves fresh air and sunshine, are just part of the idiot masses being exploited by a dishonest “establishment”. I wish those of us who still have a functioning brain could opt out to a new Republic somewhere so we don’t have to go down with this ship of fools.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:06am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    I wish those of us who still have a functioning brain could opt out to a new Republic somewhere so we don’t have to go down with this ship of fools
    
    https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Seasteading
    
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    September 9, 2020 8:22am
    - Nookin
      
      Wasn’t there a documentary about this some years back — people living on the waters. Had Kevin Costner involved. Cost a shitload to make but didn’t really catch on.
      
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      September 9, 2020 8:39am
    - Jimmy White
      
      Mike Do you want me to start a GiveALittle fund to send you away to Nirvana. On condition they don’t have internet.
      
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      September 9, 2020 8:41am
      - mikenmildagain
        
        Sounds like it’s PhilBest who wants to escape this socialist hellhole for a libertarian paradise. In the absence of viable floating cities, perhaps he could try Somalia.
        https://mises.org/library/stateless-somalia-and-loving-it
        
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        September 9, 2020 9:05am
    - softail 1450
      
      MMA ,See what happens MMA you come up with a funny, interesting piece and because of the usual crap you spout still get down ticked to oblivion, Oh dear.
      
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      September 9, 2020 9:05am
    - Deagle
      
      Yeah, damn those people who want to take responsibility for their own future!
      
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      September 9, 2020 11:13am
  - The Proper Ghandi
    
    PhilBest
    One major factor is “the masses” blind trust in our so-called leaders, officially sanctioned experts and the various hyper-wealthy individuals who we know have done very nicely out of the panicked fear they have deliberately induced. The masses automatically assume that these people naturally have our best interests in mind at all times and this benevolence underlies what they tell us – I don’t think there is any real evidence to support this assumption.
    
    Your point on lifestyle choices and preventative measures illustrates what I mean. These are all good things that anyone can do to bolster their health and protect them from the virus, and many things other than Covid as well. But you hear nothing about this. Instead we are all to be treated uniformly as sheep guided down the same chute, to ultimately be fleeced (or worse) en masse by those who claim to know better.
    
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    September 9, 2020 10:08am
- Brian McDonald
  
  Quick KK go grow some berries.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:21am
- RBiggs
  
  Gary is also a noted anti vaxer and opposes water fluoridation.
  
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  September 9, 2020 9:08am
  - Tall Man
    
    Irrelevant.
    
    Even a broken watch is right ……..
    
    Just because one facet of a person’s beliefs seem wrong to you doesn’t mean they are wrong all the time.
    
    Obviously good nutrition is important for all health not just in relation to covid.
    
    I have a doctor mate who swallows vitamins like they’re lollies, 19 a day at last count.
    
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    September 9, 2020 9:39am
    - The Proper Ghandi
      
      Exactly. Let’s say he is wrong about vaccines. It doesn’t follow that he is wrong about everything. This fallacy is used a lot to discredit people with good ideas that others want suppressed.
      
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      September 9, 2020 10:14am
      - C J Southern
        
        It’s not a given, but it does increase the odds.
        
        Case-in-point – someone who thinks the earth is flat because they don’t understand basic physics will often think that the moon landings were “faked” for the very same reason.
        
        The “trick” these days is to closely examine how much credibility people have by looking at their qualifications/experience in addition to what their peers think of what they’re proclaiming; far too often people are given credibility only because “they sound convincing” when in reality they’re just smooth rubbish talkers.
        
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        September 9, 2020 11:28am
      - The Proper Ghandi
        
        There are only two things that really matter in any given argument: the supporting evidence (if the subject is an empirical), and the logical relationship between the propositions. That is all. The rest is subsidiary.
        
        Plenty of people with “qualifications and experience” who also have the assent of their “peers” have been wrong about all manner of things over the years. They aren’t wholly irrelevant, but they are fallacious arguments from authority.
        
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        September 9, 2020 12:30pm
    - Jimmy White
      
      Not if it’s broken because the hands have fallen off
      
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      September 9, 2020 10:23am
      - Tall Man
        
        Good point Jimmy. Nice to see you’re an out of the box thinker 😉
        
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        September 9, 2020 12:49pm
- Classic Liberal
  
  I’ve read his plan. Much of the nutrient stuff I believe is useful but don’t think it should be compulsory or taxpayer funded in schools.
  
  He doesn’t sound at all libertarian.
  
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  September 9, 2020 10:09am
Sigmund Freud

Down with this sort of thing!
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September 9, 2020 8:01am
- mandk
  
  Yes. If your Nana wouldn’t put up with it, nor should you.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:15am
- Loddenthinks
  
  I’M NOT REALLY A SIGN GUY, BUT GEEZ
  
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  September 9, 2020 9:29am
Flossie

Last night noticed a Newshub headline on their app….”Gail Force Winds….”.
It’s still there this morning
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September 9, 2020 8:02am
- kowtow
  
  Yan Bidges refers to his occupation as “boadcaster”.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:17am
- Inandout
  
  Flossie, I thought Gail had found a remedy for her flatulence.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:25am
- Dougal10
  
  Gail Force was an 80s porn girl someones spell check is probably using learned words.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:48am
  - Loddenthinks
    
    Thanks for knowing things the rest of us wouldn’t dream of admitting to…
    
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    September 9, 2020 9:30am
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  Toxic Tova could use that headline to attack aunty Collins saying National cannot spell properly.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:49am
MT_Tinman

There is a photo’ of the two Maori party spokesmen leading the news today, accompanying a headline stating TVNZ will recognise this overtly racist organisation.

What TVNZ do is their problem but the fellow pictured is wearing a business suit – invented in England and part of MY culture,

THAT is cultural appropriation!
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September 9, 2020 8:04am
- The Proper Ghandi
  
  We laugh, but that is the clear logical conclusion of the cultural appropriation argument. To be consistent, all indigenous people should all still be wearing flax skirts and/or butt-flaps.
  
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  September 9, 2020 10:21am
- GoVege
  
  I never could understand how people who complain so bitterly about Pakeha can accept their handouts, and even damehoods.
  When are they going to admit the good the English did for them?
  I suppose that would mean an end to neverending compo….
  
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  September 9, 2020 11:51am
wimpston peeeders

the multi billion dollar question…

does cindys internal polling show shes got enough political capital to push some envy taxes or will she play it safe and match nationals no new taxes?
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September 9, 2020 8:05am
- Loddenthinks
  
  Are you asking what she’ll say, or what she’ll do?
  
  There’s a difference, you see.
  
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  September 9, 2020 9:32am
  - Bobba Fret
    
    Good point!
    
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    September 9, 2020 10:19am
- RW Capitalist
  
  No NEW taxes
  They will just increase the old ones.
  Currently MBIE charge $125 per hour for any services that the govt. forces you to have…wonder what that will be next year?
  Port charges
  Inspection fees
  etc etc
  As the general public does not directly see these, they just see the price going up and blame the company.
  Like when they put a charge on landfills, on the councils….knowing the councils will get all the blame. (BTW…I’m no fan of councils)
  
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  September 9, 2020 10:13am
  - IC5000
    
    > Currently MBIE charge $125 per hour for any services that the govt. forces you to have…
    
    Only communist want something for free.
    
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    September 9, 2020 10:32am
    - RW Capitalist
      
      I pay for the govt. in my….wait for it….it’s startling……but true’………..T A X E S….moron.
      
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      September 9, 2020 12:41pm
      - IC5000
        
        Stop making excuses commie. Why should others have to pay your way.
        
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        September 9, 2020 3:41pm
- pdm
  
  Cindy is not going to be present apparently.
  Significant tax increases coming because she does not show for bad news.
  
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  September 9, 2020 10:23am
- TWEEDSE
  
  Robbo announces 39% rich prick Cullen tax.
  
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  September 9, 2020 11:39am
Maggie Pie

I see that Evangelical Church in Mt Roskill is STILL in the news 🙁
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September 9, 2020 8:06am
- artemisia
  
  Hidden overstayers maybe?
  
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  September 9, 2020 9:29am
- wimpston peeeders
  
  undisclosed contacts… there will be lots of overstayers that will not be contact traced. cindy and the gustapo will be dawn raiding to “stamp it out”
  
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  September 9, 2020 9:30am
- JamesP
  
  Noticed the government is starting to call it a “sub cluster” not a “mini cluster”. At 37 cases it would be our 9th biggest.
  
  Speaking of which, any progress on finding the missing link to back to the main cluster?
  
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  September 9, 2020 10:18am
- hullkiwi
  
  MP, wait until 1pm, the news is bigger than just 1 west Auckland school kid.
  
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  September 9, 2020 10:36am
Simon

How much NZ tax payer funding did the China concentration camp flick Mulan get?
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September 9, 2020 8:06am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Probably just the usual tax breaks and labour-law exemptions granted to this very special industry.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:23am
- wimpston peeeders
  
  cindy see nothing, cindy hear nothing, cindy know nothing.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:30am
- Lance
  
  They didn’t get a cent.
  They paid a bit less tax. I know that economics is a hard concept for lefties, they can’t figure out that a company spending million and millions in NZ is a good thing for NZ
  
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  September 9, 2020 9:22am
Maggy Wassilieff

How many people has the coronavirus killed?

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-02497-w
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September 9, 2020 8:08am
- G152
  
  The question should be..
  How many people have died from underlying causes and been counted as dying from Covid ?
  And why, if Covid is controlled and has been for some time , are there current infection cases ???
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:13am
  - tf78
    
    Does our usual flu which is also a corona virus show up in a test as COVID-19?
    
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    September 9, 2020 8:43am
    - Flossie
      
      Love to know the answer to that one. Partner became very ill in the US last December. A local GP there did the nasal swab and came back with “definitely flu”. We hadn’t heard of Covid at that point but have always wondered. (He recovered after a couple of weeks – where I feared he was about to die!)
      
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      September 9, 2020 9:45am
    - Ed Snack
      
      The influenza virus is NOT a Beta Corona Virus, it is a separate virus family with sub-types A, B, C, and D. A and B infect humans, C can do so but usually doesn’t, and D is so far only known in cattle. Type A is the common version in humans and has 18 H subtypes (hemmaglutinin) and 11 N (neuraminidase) coat protein variants, leading around 192 possible variants, of which 130 odd have been observed in the wild. The last pandemic was an H1N1 and the other common version is H3N2. Type B are less variable and don’t have the same H and N variants.
      
      The usual flu vaccine has one (sometimes 2) H1N1 variant, one or two H3N2 variant, and one B variant. The H3N2 version is the most variable currently and causes the most cases.
      
      BCV’s come from a different family which also has numerous sub families. One BCV variant family is considered to cause around 30% of colds (not flu) and infection with that may offer some or even complete immunity to Covid-19 causing viruses.
      
      Flu’s and colds are spread in very similar ways to Covid, so behaviours that cuts the spread of Covid almost certainly reduce the spread of colds and flu.
      
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      September 9, 2020 11:07am
  - JackRabbit
    
    More importantly, how many flu deaths have there been in NZ since the beginning of the year?
    
    We lose about 550 per year dead from the flu. And 9000+ infections are severe enough to require hospitalisation. Deaths as a result of non-hospitalisation probably have gone up.
    
    And as we know from the UK stats, that lockdown has ‘curbed’ Covid-19 but not the flu with 3 out of every 4 dying from the flu, but only 1 out of 4 dying from Covid-19. And annual flu deaths down.
    
    Based on our own historical stats say 400, down from 550?
    
    So maybe Covid 24, Flu 400?
    
    So multi-choice quiz in school:
    Which is the greater number of deaths?
    
    a) 24.
    b) 400.
    c) I can’t do maths.
    d) I’ll ask Cindy.
    
    Does anyone have the stats on the current flu deaths? Or increase in home deaths?
    
    And don’t buy into the ‘vaccine will save us’ crap. Especially if Gates is involved.
    
    https://www.woolstangray.eu/un-forced-to-admit-gates-funded-vaccine-is-causing-polio-outbreak-in-africa/
    
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    September 9, 2020 9:17am
    - wimpston peeeders
      
      This was on the “news” a few days ago. dramatic drop in cases of influenza apparently, hospitalizations at all time low as alot is usually imported/spread via tourists.
      
      imo this is setting us up for a shocker once the borders reopen, the vulnerable that didnt die this year will be a compounding problem next year. expect flu admissions and deaths to spike badly the next year or 2.
      
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      September 9, 2020 9:38am
    - cmm
      
      There were some Flu stats floating around.
      
      From my understanding, flu deaths are way down in various places (inc. NZ) and this is largely attributed to CV19 precautions (hand washing, masks etc).
      
      And I too see very little point in being “saved” by the vaccine.
      
      CV19 almost exclusively kills of people who were shortly to die of other causes any way, so taking a vaccine to dodge one disease just to be taken out by another seems rather pointless unless you also find a vaccine for all the other things that kill 82 year olds.
      
      To use my analogy again: it is like only looking for red cars when you cross the road. The blue, black and white cars are still going to get you.
      
      This is very different to, say, Spanish, HK and Asian flus which mainly killed healthy people in the 10 to 30 age group who would have expected another 50 years of life. Clearly vaccines help for these cases.
      
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      September 9, 2020 9:46am
      - Ed Snack
        
        Covid *can* kill or cause significant long term effects for younger healthy people, the exact reason that some are vulnerable isn’t, to my knowledge, known. It certainly does impact those with certain illnesses especially those that affect the heart and lungs far more.
        
        But although quite a lot of people do seem to get the virus and suffer no more than mild symptoms, enough get it even when younger and do suffer mild to severe symptoms to make the use of a vaccine a good idea.
        
        Same as with normal flu, I get the vaccine every year despite it varying between 30-90% effective, because the symptoms even when not life threatening are bad enough to want to avoid, and also because it can be life threatening if you are unlucky. And Covid, at least theoretically, offers a better target for a vaccine than the hyper variable influenza virus.
        
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        September 9, 2020 11:12am
      - cmm
        
        Yes, CV19 *can* kill or cause problems for young people, but the numbers are so small that they should not be dictating policy.
        
        We’re talking way, way less than other things people take as routine.
        
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        September 9, 2020 3:57pm
- Aliog
  
  Thanks Maggy – interesting and informative read. I order how many of the Covid naysayers will bother to read it.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:21am
  - Tall Man
    
    So because I don’t believe that a virus that requires 90% of those infected to be tested to actually discover they have it, that seems to primarily impact those who are already severely copmpromised is not a virus of “plague” proportions and am a “naysayer”.
    
    I say that those that fear the unknown, believe the liar in chief and the “crisis promoting” media are just plain stupid.
    
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    September 9, 2020 8:26am
  - fernglas
    
    I don’t see why an article that effectively says we have no way of accurately measuring Covid deaths should be seen to be for or against any perspective on the virus. Do explain.
    
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    September 9, 2020 8:47am
  - Jimmy White
    
    I see the women who received a positive Covid test six months after her death has had the reason for her dead retrospectively classed as COVID-19.
    CNC have said they are sorry for the mistake but it’s now been fixed. TIC
    
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    September 9, 2020 8:48am
    - JackRabbit
      
      You could dig up a six month old body and discover it’s full of earthworms. So you could relabel the death as ‘death by earthworms’.
      
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      September 9, 2020 9:26am
      - IC5000
        
        Umm no that’s not how cause of death works. Why isn’t this clear to you?
        
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        September 9, 2020 10:36am
      - Classic Liberal
        
        What can’t you get a joke, Icy?
        
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        September 9, 2020 1:18pm
      - JackRabbit
        
        @IC5000
        
        You didn’t get the innuendo did you?
        
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        September 9, 2020 1:22pm
  - cmm
    
    What is a “Covid naysayer”? Is that something like a “Covid denier”?
    
    Of course the virus exists., but there is, and should be, considerable debate about:
    1) How bad is it really?
    2) Has this been co-opted for power play?
    3) Is the cure (including all the lockdowns) worse than the disease?
    4) What is a sane way to move the emotionally charged decision making into a more rational space.
    
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    September 9, 2020 9:54am
- Tall Man
  
  As I have always said Maggy, until a full cycle has passed measurement is difficult at best.
  
  My personal view is that total deaths within the period will look relatively normal although there may be a future spike due to undiagnosed/untreated illness related to lockdowns.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:22am
  - Ed Snack
    
    I think figures already released do show a significant excess of deaths attributable to Covid – at least in some places. We may however see a reduction in the near future, so a bump as it brought forward the deaths of people with serious conditions with already limited life expectancies.
    
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    September 9, 2020 11:15am
    - Tall Man
      
      That’s why a full cycle is important.
      
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      September 9, 2020 12:50pm
- cmm
  
  Aka “It’s complicated”
  
  The ability to do mass testing has hugely changed the way we can detect diseases, but the statistical processes have not been modified to cope.
  
  During the Spanish Flu, approx 30% of the world’s population were infected. At the time there was no q-tip-up-the-nose testing so those infected people were all identified as infected by getting sick. With CV19 most people who test positive are asymptomatic thus our modern testing strategy grossly inflates the numbers compared with Spanish Flu.
  
  As we see from the excess deaths graphs, the death rates in many areas are already going below the expected death rate. This underlines what I have been saying – that CV19 has time shifted deaths by a few months. The excess deaths of the last few months are going to result in less than expected deaths over the next 6 months.
  
  This makes CV19 very benign compared to, say, Spanish Flu, HK flu and Asian flu which mainly killed young people without comorbidities.
  
  All the huge photo ops with mass graves and freezer trucks are not really because there are massively more bodies, but rather because the logistical supply chain has been screwed up by the responses.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:27am
  - Jimmy White
    
    Can’t been that bad this time as we don’t have carts roaming up and down the streets calling out “Bring out your Dead”
    
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    September 9, 2020 8:51am
    - Tall Man
      
      You’re an impatient bugger 😉
      
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      September 9, 2020 9:33am
- Bobba Fret
  
  Wasn’t it a while back that if you were diagnosed with Corona virus, but stepped out in front of a bus and were run over and killed, that was counted as a Corona death?
  
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  September 9, 2020 10:21am
  - IC5000
    
    No.
    
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    September 9, 2020 10:36am
    - Ed Snack
      
      Yes, there have been numerous documented cases of “death with” rather than death by. In the USA hospitals were given federal money to cover the costs of treatment for patients who died of Covid, hence there was a significant advantage to report any deaths with as deaths of. Not necessarily the same everywhere.
      
      But it has happened and possibly in significant numbers. I’m not sure of the whole context, but in the US it is possible that up to 90-94% of deaths are NOT entirely attributable only to Covid, so that only 6% are actual Covid deaths. It does depend on quite how comorbidity deaths are counted.
      
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      September 9, 2020 11:19am
MT_Tinman

I was in ChCh public hospital yesterday.

The people I dealt with were, to a man and woman, fantastic! I thank them.

One thing I did notice was that those who worked for their living at the hospital did not wear masks.

Sensible people!
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September 9, 2020 8:08am
- Jules99
  
  I was at an Auckland pharmacy yesterday and noticed that none of the pharmacists wore masks, although the sales staff did. This is one that locked down severely at L4 – it felt like you were entering a spaceship airlock.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:19am
  - Tall Man
    
    I was at a “specialist centre” yesterday.
    
    Not a single mask in sight.
    
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    September 9, 2020 8:28am
    - tf78
      
      I went for to a Skin specialist last week and they all wore masks and made me wear one too. Never again they were awful.
      
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      September 9, 2020 8:46am
    - Jimmy White
      
      Went to a dominatrix party last night and only the women wore masks
      
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      September 9, 2020 8:53am
      - fernglas
        
        I went to a Lone Ranger themed party last week and……….
        
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        September 9, 2020 9:19am
      - mikenmildagain
        
        Obligatory response to the Lone Ranger reference:
        https://www.pinterest.nz/pin/673710425484252573/
        
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        September 9, 2020 9:35am
      - Tall Man
        
        Or
        
        https://youtu.be/8uvDWmeKc2I
        
        Or
        
        “The Lone Ranger and Tonto find themselves surrounded by hostile Indians. The Ranger asks Tonto: “What are we going to do, Tonto?” To which Tonto replies: “What do you mean we, white man.”
        
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        September 9, 2020 12:55pm
  - rouppe
    
    I was in a pharmacy last weekend where one of the staff had that full face perspex face shield thing going on.
    
    I struggled to not laugh in her face
    
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    September 9, 2020 8:37am
    - cmm
      
      Those face shield only work for one thing: direct close up coughing of large drops.
      
      They do nothing to stop small droplets/aerosols which get carried by air currents as people breath in and out.
      
      23 3
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      September 9, 2020 8:45am
    - Loddenthinks
      
      I struggled to ~~not~~ laugh in her face
      
      7 2
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      September 9, 2020 9:40am
      - cmm
        
        Well, to be fair, the face shield would have helped for someone laughing in her face – but not much else.
        
        2 1
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        September 9, 2020 5:45pm
Evadne

Immunological characteristics govern the changing severity of COVID-19 during the transition to endemicity – Jennie S Lavine & Ottar N Bjornstad

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.09.03.20187856v1

As prospects for eradicating CoV-2 dwindle, we are faced with the question of how the severity of CoV-2 disease may change in the years ahead…. Our analysis of immunological and epidemiological data on HCoVs shows that infection-blocking immunity wanes rapidly, but disease-reducing immunity is long-lived….Our model recapitulates both the current severity of CoV-2 and the relatively benign nature of HCoVs; suggesting that once the endemic phase is reached, CoV-2 may be no more virulent than the common cold. The benign outcome at the endemic phase is contingent on the virus causing primary infections in children….

These results force us to re-evaluate control measures that rely on identifying and isolating symptomatic infections, and reconsider ideas regarding herd immunity and the use of immune individuals as shields to protect vulnerable groups.
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September 9, 2020 8:10am
- cmm
  
  Our model… kinda lost me there.
  
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  September 9, 2020 5:46pm
Tony Stuart

A report from BERL, which Andrew Little was desperate to remain secret until after the cannabis referendum, has been proactively released. When you have a flick through, you can see what Little did not want this to be in the public domain before the referendum.

https://berl.co.nz/sites/default/files/2020-09/Market-structure-for-recreational-cannabis-PROACTIVE-FINAL.pdf

Of particular interest, check out the table on P24 of the proposed volume and location of cannabis shops; more than 400 in total. I’m particularly alarmed by the six shops proposed for Whanganui, with an average population per store of 5570; one of the lowest in the country. Gisborne will get seven stores, and Napier and Hastings a combined total of 26 stores!

Interestingly, neither Stuff nor the NZ Herald gives this report much (if any) prominence this morning, which will please Little. It’s typical though that New Zealand’s most open and transparent government only released this information after significant pressure from interested parties.
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September 9, 2020 8:11am
- old skool reactionary
  
  ” I’m particularly alarmed by the six shops proposed for Whanganui… Gisborne will get seven stores, and Napier and Hastings a combined total of 26 stores!”
  
  That’s where all the Maoris are.
  
  I bet South Auckland will get a truck load. I can see the Indian diary operators getting a weed license to sell that shit along side booze and ciggies.
  
  Imagine how many Indians will get smashed up by “teenage yoofs” once they have weed stored on their premises.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:14am
  - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
    
    They know what they are doing.
    
    11 4
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    September 9, 2020 8:52am
- greybeard
  
  Hosking was on to it early. As usual.
  The Magic Talk show with Peter Williams should be good today.
  
  28 2
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  September 9, 2020 8:21am
- Bykmad
  
  A quick Google check shows that there are 344 McDonalds, KFC and Burger King outlets in NZ. Does that put some perspective around the report.
  
  24 2
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  September 9, 2020 8:23am
  - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
    
    maybe they will co-locate. Address the munchies directly.
    
    Shock Headlines from 2021.
    
    “Cannabis Use Connected to Obesity Epidemic, Road Toll: More at 6:00!”
    
    “Mother of obese teen victims of horror crash “gutted that Government didn’t warn us.” In depth reporting only on STUFFOFF/HERALDED your source of responsible journalism”.
    
    19 3
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    September 9, 2020 8:45am
    - Loddenthinks
      
      Settle petal
      
      6 1
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      September 9, 2020 9:43am
- MT_Tinman
  
  the proposed volume and location of cannabis shops; more than 400 in total.
  
  The reason the gummint never released this is probably because it has no meaning.
  
  You could put a shop on every second property and all that would happen is most would go broke.
  
  I seriously doubt a single extra user will come about because of the number of shops selling the stuff, just a whole lot of chancers going broke when they find out that running a business is not all milk and skittles.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:23am
  - Tall Man
    
    Depends on the margin doesn’t it?
    
    Next time you’re in an exclusive shopping complex overseas, count the people in the Rolex or Cartier shops.
    
    It’s all about the margin.
    
    10 3
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    September 9, 2020 8:50am
  - Jimmy White
    
    My supplier says he will: Match the stores price, Deliver and will be 50% stronger.
    
    17 2
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    September 9, 2020 8:55am
- mikenmildagain
  
  No one is ‘proposing’ stores. The report merely calculates likely demand for legal cannabis.
  Just because you would prefer people in Whanganui to buy their cannabis from gangs doesn’t mean there aren’t more sensible solutions.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:26am
  - cmm
    
    Yes these are “proposing” a number of how many licenses to allow.
    
    There will obviously be a demand side component (ie. will the shops have enough business or will they go broke), but there is also a supply side too and that is controlled by licensing which the government controls.
    
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    September 9, 2020 8:48am
  - Jimmy White
    
    Mike you don’t seem to mind that our government is run by a Gang. A gang of imbeciles
    
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    September 9, 2020 8:57am
  - Tony Stuart
    
    Do you seriously believe gangs will exit the cannabis market because it’s being sold legally mikenmild? I don’t; the gangs will simply undercut the legal sellers, and increase the potency of the dope they sell.
    
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    September 9, 2020 9:02am
    - wimpston peeeders
      
      they dont need to increase the potency, 80% of weed now will be above the thc limits in the legislation.
      
      I have no doubt that this bill will evolve greatly before it becomes law. its merely a trojan horse to get a yes vote then will be torn to shreds and rebuilt. dabs edibles high potency will all be in, this bill will be a skeleton of whats actually passed.
      
      17 3
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      September 9, 2020 9:09am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Depends on the market mechanisms. DPF has often commented that rising tobacco excise is fuelling a black market. given reasonable prices and quality assurance, most people will opt for a legal supply.
      Gangs will surely not be involved in Whanganui anyway. Didn’t you get rid of them all by banning patches?
      
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      September 9, 2020 9:11am
      - Tall Man
        
        “given reasonable prices”.
        
        There’s the end of your argument.
        
        14 3
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        September 9, 2020 9:31am
- alex Masterley
  
  I am alarmed – full stop.
  So much effort put into stopping smoking yet here we have tacit acceptance of smoking.
  Every vape shop anywhere will transition to dope if the stuff gets decriminalised.
  And then gangs will simply use stand over tactics to get themselves a slice of the action.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:28am
  - Tall Man
    
    They won’t need to use “standover tactics” Alex, the punters will be queuing up at their door for the lower cost, higher strength product.
    
    We have corporates right now assessing their options for all facets of the production, supply and delivery chain.
    
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    September 9, 2020 8:31am
    - Tony Stuart
      
      Agreed wholeheartedly Tall Man. The criminal gangs aren’t just going to stop selling the stuff.
      
      24 2
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      September 9, 2020 9:03am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Like all the other legal businesses the gangs control?
    
    6 27
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    September 9, 2020 8:38am
    - Tall Man
      
      Check out prostitution mikey, you may be surprised.
      
      24 3
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      September 9, 2020 8:59am
      - mikenmildagain
        
        Perhaps you have a more intimate acquaintance with that industry than I, so do tell.
        
        6 25
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        September 9, 2020 9:12am
      - Tall Man
        
        Happy to mikey.
        
        My clients come from all walks of life, From corporate to gang members, as long as they pay tax and stay legal in their dealings with me, so I am well aware of what the rascals, from corporate to the gangs, get up to.
        
        Now, seeing you obviously have a need, would you like me to put a word in for you with a couple of the Hutt locals to finally get you laid? It may improve your demeanour…..
        
        20 3
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        September 9, 2020 9:27am
    - Simon
      
      “Like all the other legal businesses the gangs control?”
      
      Gangs & others use legal business to launder money. Night clubs in Auckland are popular. A legal marijuana business will be used to launder meth proceeds on a massive scale.
      
      The state collects income tax & GST on meth sales.
      Which is one of the reasons to legalize dope.
      
      Everyone is happy.
      
      8 5
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      September 9, 2020 9:33am
  - Jimmy White
    
    Smoking is dangerous but the Government has ruled out edibles?.
    Anyone got any cookie recipes. Asking for a Friend.
    
    17 2
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    September 9, 2020 8:59am
    - Tall Man
      
      Nothing wrong with edibles …….
      
      https://www.therichest.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/mexico-obit-heaviest-2.jpg
      
      2 2
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      September 9, 2020 9:29am
      - Jimmy White
        
        Gummy Bears. mmmmmmmm
        
        4 1
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        September 9, 2020 10:40am
    - softail 1450
      
      Jimmy White, Had a friend about 40 years ago said she could make hash cookies with hash oil ,so she cooked up a batch and four of us made pigs out of ourselves and had 2 each, FFS 2 hours later after they initially started working none of the four of us were capable of getting off the couch.
      No talking, no moving, no laughing, just a hash oil coma for about 4 hours until it started wearing off and then it was very pleasant indeed,LOL.
      
      9 1
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      September 9, 2020 11:00am
      - Jimmy White
        
        Did not see the comma and was going to pull you up for saying that I had Friends.
        Had the same experience except after one hour we though they were not working so we had two more.
        Smashed……………….
        
        4 1
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        September 9, 2020 3:10pm
- Inandout
  
  US areas that legalised marijuana saw 80% of the stuff sold ‘off market’ by suppliers of stronger, and supposedly illegal pot. The expected tax windfall didn’t eventuate. I listen to Hosking for some facts.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:31am
- thirteenstars
  
  Well, well, that’s a fascinating document. I’ve only skimmed it but what it reveals is a deep dive into the regulatory mindset that drives black markets.
  
  It’s almost laughable, the minute detail they go into about how they will regulate and tax and constrain a market that hitherto has operated perfectly smoothly as an illegal black market. They are even so presumptuous as to estimate the current illegal consumption at 74 tonnes and thereby seek to establish a legal production quota of 120 tonnes, as if that will wipe out the black market.
  
  They go on to use Washington and Colorado as baselines for some of their projections while not mentioning that in all US states (and elsewhere in the world), the black market continues to thrive, and massively.
  
  It’s the regulations, dummy.
  
  But no, Kiwi bureaucrats are smarter than all other bureaucrats. Drug, tobacco, alcohol regulation failed. But they’ll get it right this time. Yup.
  
  The only way to fix the problem is to establish a minimum age for consumption and possession, enforce it ruthlessly, and leave adults to grow and consume un-taxed cannabis as they see fit.
  
  But no, what NZ is going to do is establish a regulatory regime tougher than anywhere else in the world, akin to what we currently have for tobacco, and expect pigs to fly.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:33am
  - Tall Man
    
    “The only way to fix the problem is to establish a minimum age for consumption and possession, enforce it ruthlessly, and leave adults to grow and consume un-taxed cannabis as they see fit.”
    
    And of course these adults would never sell or pass it on to any underage kids would they ………… Tui anyone?
    
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    September 9, 2020 8:48am
    - thirteenstars
      
      Of course some of them would. Some adults give those under 18 alcohol and tobacco. Some adults have sex with those under 16.
      
      What are you suggesting: that adults don’t have sex because some adults abuse children, or that we don’t have a legal age of consent at all?
      
      2 12
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      September 9, 2020 9:30am
      - Tall Man
        
        Merely pointing out the error of your logic.
        
        Your solution is not a solution at all.
        
        7 2
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        September 9, 2020 10:13am
    - thirteenstars
      
      “Merely pointing out the error of your logic.”
      
      No error in my logic. Some adults abuse children. You make it sound as if this would be unique to legal cannabis use. It won’t be. And it isn’t in any situation where activities are restricted by age. You seem to think it’s preferable to make an activity illegal for all people because some who are underage will do it, too. Hence the analogy with sex. Should it be illegal because some adults abuse children not of legal age? Your own faulty logic suggests it should be.
      
      “Your solution is not a solution at all.”
      
      Solution to what? Define the problem. Be my guest.
      
      2 5
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      September 9, 2020 10:42am
  - All_on_Red
    
    It’s laughable to think current drug dealers ( who in the main aren’t gang members) will submit to a regulatory regime and pay Taxes.
    
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    September 9, 2020 8:56am
    - Pharmachick
      
      Depends on how profitable any increase in volume of sales is due to legalization. Not all drug dealers are thick.
      
      6 0
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      September 9, 2020 12:08pm
- cmm
  
  Poor wee Andy doesn’t seem to realise that if they try to control things too much the “free market” aka black market will fill the void.
  
  I personally doubt that 400 legit weed shops can be sustained. That’s about 1 for every 2 bottle shops.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:37am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Why wouldn’t cannabis simply be sold through existing liquor, tobacco or vaping stores?
    
    9 16
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    September 9, 2020 8:39am
    - Tall Man
      
      “licensing” …….
      
      It may be but there are different requirements and currently liquor outlets like having big front windows and around here the vaping stores also sell many other products but hey, who really knows, not the coalition that’s for sure.
      
      7 2
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      September 9, 2020 9:51am
    - Loddenthinks
      
      Do a bit of basic research before asking silly questions.
      
      11 2
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      September 9, 2020 9:51am
- KevO'Brien
  
  The good news:
  $10/gm licence admin costs. (Half oz =$140+GST!)
  They think they can sew up the whole supply chain so no outsiders grow and sneak some of their own in.
  Like tobacco, prices will soar making an attractive market for the gangs and others as providers.
  
  Who’s going to make and sell the oil made from the remaining “cabbage” ?
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:52am
  - thirteenstars
    
    It’s nuts.
    
    There are 28 grams in an ounce. An ounce, according to my research, is about $350.
    
    Therefore, each gram is costing $12. But each gram will be levied a $10 admin fee. Then add GST.
    
    You’ve doubled the price of cannabis. Sorry, you’ve doubled the price of LEGAL cannabis. ILLEGAL cannabis still sells for half that price.
    
    This is why folks like me understand that regulatory regimes like this only serve to do one thing: to increase the size of the state, the tax it takes, and the number of bureaucrats it employs. The police still chase the illegal market because it doesn’t go away, and the bureaucrats have to police the legal market. Nothing is reduced. Nothing is made better.
    
    Indeed, the police would have every incentive from their political masters to even more diligently pursue the illegal dealers since they are in competition with the legal market and all that juicy tax revenue.
    
    Nuts. Fucking Grade A nuts.
    
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    September 9, 2020 9:47am
- herb1
  
  Hardly surprising Tony that Labour will do everything to allow and encourage drug use. … [Deleted – Mod.]
  
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  September 9, 2020 9:44am
- Fletch
  
  I heard this on the radio this morning –
  
  A legal cannabis market for recreational use could generate $675 million a year for the Government to spend on reducing cannabis-related harm, new economic modelling shows.
  
  Two reports by Business and Economic Research Ltd (Berl) also say that legalisation would see an initial spike in cannabis use, accompanied by more cannabis-related hospitalisations.
  
  But this would recede in the longer term and, with excise tax revenue put towards effective health interventions, cannabis users would have improved health outcomes while the justice system would save $11.4 million a year.
  
  https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/news/vote2020/legalising-weed-could-see-675m-year-spent-on-health-interventions-report/
  
  In other words, legalizing cannabis will be costly due to abuse of it and people being hospitalized, but it’s OK because the Govt will be able to spend money from it being legalized to help those people. That just doesn’t make any sense whatsoever to me. ?
  Seems like spending on one end to make up for damage caused by the same thing that is causing the damage on the other end….
  
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  September 9, 2020 10:26am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    All this from Berl is by people who have no responsibility. The disclaimer on their proposals formulated is horrendous. They provide schemes for a fee which the Public Service should have been capable of.
    
    3 3
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    September 9, 2020 12:31pm
- MCos
  
  There seems to be some sort of thinking that if there’s a ‘No’ vote in the cannabis referendum usage will stop.
  
  What a laugh.
  
  I’m not suggesting all drugs should be legal, but society has drawn a line and said these ones are fine and those ones are evil.
  Why cannabis is evil and alcohol, nicotine, are fine seems to have been an arbitrary decision by someone back in time.
  
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  September 9, 2020 12:53pm
Scott

Good story from the Federalist about the latest Trump hit piece where Trump is accused of not visiting the graves of fallen soldiers and describing them as a bunch of losers.
The Federalist notes that there is a growth of anonymous sourcing and no one has gone on the record to say that the story is true.

Secondly that there is confirmation bias. We know that Trump is a horrible person so this must be true!

Thirdly the liberal echo chamber where every anti-trump story is seized upon and amplified by the rest of the liberal media.

https://thefederalist.com/2020/09/08/3-crucial-breakdowns-in-journalistic-standards-that-explain-the-atlantics-trump-political-hit-piece/

I would add that the media have a business model where they have decided there is a tremendous appetite for anti-trump news and so this type of journalism will have a ready audience.

Lastly I would say that there is a hatred for Trump that defies all logic and reason. People here like DPF himself and David Garrett and Mikey just hate Trump, they hate his guts! Their opinions are not arrived at by reason. So you can’t reason with them.

But what it means, and it affects even this blog, is that we get a constant diet of anti-trump hit pieces that subsequently are proved not to be true. The Donald Trump is a Russian agent, he shafted Ukraine for electoral advantage and should be impeached are just two of the most egregious examples.
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September 9, 2020 8:14am
- Sigmund Freud
  
  Trump has black babies on toast with jam for breakfast.
  
  32 4
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  September 9, 2020 8:23am
  - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
    
    Rubbish, everyone knows he rolls them in Peanut Butter and fries them!
    
    20 4
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    September 9, 2020 8:47am
  - RW Capitalist
    
    So that’s why he got all their parents a job, so he could sneak in during the day.
    
    6 3
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    September 9, 2020 10:18am
- Scott
  
  The other reason for the anti Trump piece is that it was needed to counter the story that was gaining legs. Namely the Nancy Pelosi getting her hair done in a salon while every salon was closed to other customers. That showed Pelosi has a one rule for me and one rule for thee mentality. It was hurting Pelosi and so something was needed to distract from that story and get back on to bashing Donald Trump.
  
  The story was two years old. Think about it. The story was two years old and only just came to light at a time when it happened to be able to take the spotlight off Nancy Pelosi. Surely more than coincidence?
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:26am
  - Tall Man
    
    cindy is using the same tactic here.
    
    As soon as Judith Collins releases a National policy, we get a “puff” piece and a hit job story from the $50 million media.
    
    45 4
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    September 9, 2020 8:42am
    - Lance
      
      I see Robbo’s latest tactic is to proclaim at every opportunity that the National party are crap at this economy management stuff.
      The man is a self parody
      
      26 3
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      September 9, 2020 9:28am
      - Bob
        
        Clearly Robbo doesn’t understand the Economic Reports from the Treasury, if he actually reads them. Many of the words may be beyond his comprehension level, judging by his public statements on the economy.
        
        14 3
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        September 9, 2020 10:47am
  - Raphael
    
    Although I don’t think protesters should not be targeting people’s houses I do find it amusing that protesters are decorating the trees outside Pelosi’s house with hair curlers.
    
    12 2
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    September 9, 2020 9:41am
  - thirteenstars
    
    Spot on.
    
    Two years old. And it just happened to come to light now. Despite all the leakers and anti-Trumpers, and all the media and political hacks constantly looking for dirt on Trump, only now it comes to light.
    
    And they lapped it up like dogs.
    
    So that was the August surprise. Can’t wait for the September surprise. Then, oh my, that BIG October surprise.
    
    17 3
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    September 9, 2020 9:54am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
  Hey Scott, you don’t have to believe any anonymous sources if you don’t want to. There is plenty of stuff recorded from Trump’s own mouth to make up your mind whether he is a very stable genius or a narcissistic moron.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:28am
  - cmm
    
    Option C: narcissistic genius?
    
    20 4
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    September 9, 2020 8:56am
  - Raphael
    
    Yeah, Trump is an uncouth braggart who needs a filter.
    
    Yet most of the crap the media tries to claim he said/did, when you actually look past the soundbite you find he’s often said the opposite.
    
    If Trump doesn’t win, America is doomed to fall into anarchy and violence.
    
    16 3
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    September 9, 2020 10:27am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Nice try. but you know the stuff he actually does say is complete nonsense:
      
      “Person, man, woman, camera, TV”
      “You know they say the noise causes cancer”
      “The concept of global warming was created by and for the Chinese in order to make U.S. manufacturing non-competitive”
      “he’s a war hero ’cause he was captured. I Like people that weren’t captured”
      “She does have a very nice figure… If [Ivanka] weren’t my daughter, perhaps I’d be dating her”
      “I could stand in the middle of 5th Avenue and shoot somebody and I wouldn’t lose voters”
      “Nobody knew health care could be so complicated”
      
      Etc, etc ad infinitum.
      
      4 18
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      September 9, 2020 10:39am
      - The Proper Ghandi
        
        If saying stupid things is your disqualifying standard, then you should be consistent, apply it to yourself and never post here again.
        
        13 3
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        September 9, 2020 10:58am
      - GoVege
        
        Hehe.
        You notice people love to mock the French leader because of the 25 year age gap between him and his wife.
        Yet when does anyone mock the same age gap between Trump and his wife?
        
        6 1
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        September 9, 2020 12:06pm
      - Scott
        
        The proper Ghandi – Nailed it ! 🙂
        
        7 3
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        September 9, 2020 12:20pm
      - Raphael
        
        @GoVege Trump’s wife was never his school student.
        
        3 3
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        September 9, 2020 3:39pm
  - softail 1450
    
    MMA,, Ive heard from anonymous sources about some very worrying personal habits of your’s MMA , disgraceful actually, are they true????
    
    6 2
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    September 9, 2020 11:10am
    - mikenmildagain
      
      Quite probably – did they involve alcohol, fireworks, rubber gloves and small animals?
      
      1 4
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      September 9, 2020 2:35pm
- amospicton
  
  Headline on NZ Herald: Extraordinary claim: Trump unleashes ‘deeply ignorant’ military attack. He suggested the pentagon and military industrial complex have a vested interest in wars. If Obama said that it’d be a Nobel Peace Prize for him…..but orangeman bad. Extraordinary that the media can’t see the blinkered absurdity of their bias.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:34am
  - cmm
    
    Well of course the military industrial complex have an interest in war.
    
    And no, they’re not interested in the efficient execution of war either – they are more interested in the levers of power the whole war machine brings. The Pentagon are lobbied to death. They are part of the swamp.
    
    As an example of what I mean: The A10 warthog is the best close air support platform ever deployed. Ever. The troops on the ground love them. The Pentagon (and the military industrial complex) hates them. The Pentagon are pushing hard on spending up on the F35 which is a pretty awful machine in just about every way possible and is particularly awful for close air support.
    
    About a year ago Congress said they would approve more funding for the purchase of A10s. The Pentagon said that if that money was given to them they would spend it on the F35 program.
    
    #disclaimer: I make some of my money out of the US war machine.
    
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    September 9, 2020 9:06am
- Skippytony
  
  It’s not called TDS for nothing…
  
  https://lidblog.com/john-bolton-atlantic/
  
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  September 9, 2020 9:37am
- trout
  
  Also from the Federalist written by the credible (and lovely) Mollie Hemingway :
  https://thefederalist.com/2020/09/07/the-media-are-lying-about-the-election-again/
  An excerpt:
  ‘On August 1, Biden had a 25-point edge in the betting odds. By September 1, Trump had completely made up that deficit and the race was even among the betting public.
  In Florida, a state the Trump campaign must win, Biden’s lead of 8.4 points in the RealClearPolitics average at the end of July sits now at 1.8, with the latest poll showing President Trump with a three-point lead. Quinnipiac, a pollster that is not perceived as Trump-friendly, shows Biden’s lead plummeting 10 points, from 13 to just three.
  In Pennsylvania, an absolute must-win state for the Biden campaign, Biden’s lead of 8.5 in the RealClearPolitics average near the end of July has been cut in half to 4.2. Monmouth University, again another pollster not viewed as friendly to Trump, shows Biden’s lead falling eight points, from 11 to three points.
  In Michigan, Wisconsin, and North Carolina, Biden’s lead from the end of July to the end of August has been cut significantly, according to the Real Clear Politics average. Arizona is the only state where Biden’s lead has grown in the RealClearPolitics average. It should be noted that Arizona’s RCP average was significantly affected by a single outlying FOX News poll that claims Trump is down nine points in the state, which he won in 2016. CNBC, by contrast, has Biden up by only two points. Incredibly, both NBC News and the Cook Political Report continue to rate Florida as “Lean Democrat” according to their “experts.” No offense, but do they think people are stupid?
  Trump won Florida by more than one point four years ago and a state Democrats were unable to carry in 2018, when they lost both the governor and senate races. That year, the RCP polling average predicted Florida Democrat Andrew Gillum would win by 3.6 points. He in fact lost narrowly to Republican Gov. Ron DeSantis. The RCP polling average predicted Democrat Bill Nelson would win by 2.4. He lost to Rick Scott narrowly. Those polling averages were less off than the final result mostly because Trafalgar called the race correctly. The latest Quinnipiac poll shows a 10-point momentum in Florida toward Trump, where he trails within the margin of error, and where Trafalgar has the president ahead by three points. (For what it’s worth, Trafalgar was the only pollster to correctly poll key states in the 2016 and 2018 races.)
  The media and the Democrats may not like it, but this race is clearly different from where it was at the end of June, where Trump’s job approval had been going down for three straight months and he bottomed out at 41 percent in the RealClearPolitics average. Today Trump’s job approval is on a three-month upswing and is over 44 percent in the RealClearPolitics average. Three points may not seem like a lot, but in the real world where the critical battleground states will likely be decided by less than that amount, three points are the difference between winning and losing.’
  
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  September 9, 2020 9:52am
  - Inandout
    
    trout, Mollie is married to the grandchild of the great Ernest?
    
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    September 9, 2020 10:04am
  - Ed Snack
    
    Sure, but the Democrats have already signalled in multiple ways that they are not prepared to lose this election. If their primary tactic of using mail in voting to defraud the process doesn’t work, they’ve war gamed other scenarios to illegally replace electors at the state level and to ramp up violent riots to make areas ungovernable. The ploy is to prevent any decision being made by the statutory dates and so get Pelosi (assuming the Democrats hold the house) as interim president from which position she can complete the coup.
    
    No doubt the dirtiest campaign and election ever.
    
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    September 9, 2020 11:45am
- Fletch
  
  True. And the thing is, if you presented Trump’s policies on one hand, and Biden’s on the other (or even Ardern’s on the other) in a blind test, then the same people you mentioned above would go with Trump. No question. It’s only because it’s Trump they are against him.
  
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  September 9, 2020 10:30am
- virtualmark
  
  Scott, what matters with this particular case is whether the current and former US military personnel think Trump has their back or not. And the polling suggests they don’t.
  
  The only people supporting Trump on this are those paid to lie on his behalf, like Sanders, or members of the Fox Industrial Complex. There’s a deafening silence from senior military personnel.
  
  This is going to cost Trump votes. The only question is how many.
  
  Oh, and on anonymous sources … Trump himself leaks to the media like a sieve. Just ask John Barron, and John Miller, and David Dennison, and …
  
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  September 9, 2020 11:33am
  - IC5000
    
    > The only people supporting Trump on this are those paid to lie on his behalf, like Sanders, or members of the Fox Industrial Complex.
    
    That only lasts for so long. Looks like Fox has flipped on Trump.
    
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    September 9, 2020 3:40pm
- ex-golfer
  
  John Bolton who is no friend of Trump, has already debunked the claims made in the Atlantic article.
  He was at the function where the anonymous sources claim Trump made the statements, and he has said Trump said nothing of the sort.
  End of story.
  #fakenews
  
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  September 9, 2020 12:18pm
  - virtualmark
    
    Nope. Bolton said that he spent time with Trump that day in Paris and didn’t hear Trump say anything like that *while Bolton was with him*.
    
    But Bolton also said that Trump may have said those things to other people that day, when Bolton wasn’t with him.
    
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    September 9, 2020 6:19pm
I remember when

A five-month extension to current onshore visitor visas due to expire before end of October, 2020.
A new two-month visa has been introduced to help temporary migrants unable to leave New Zealand.
There are 19,000 people in NZ who hold current visitor visas that are eligible for the automatic five-month extension.
Since March, 2020, around 268,000 foreign nationals have departed NZ.
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September 9, 2020 8:18am
mandk

It’s ridiculous for the MoJ to claim that it released the BERL report proactively, when it refused an OIA request and was referred to the Ombudsman.
42 1
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September 9, 2020 8:19am
- Bykmad
  
  More lies from NZ’s most open and transparent Government ever.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:24am
- plc
  
  If I say it then it’s true
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:36am
kowtow

Go Early Go Hard.

Covid is a very cunning bug.

Some testing of port workers in Auckland and Tauranga ,cos it can sneak in only at those two ports .

No testing at any other ports as it can’t sneak in at any other port.
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September 9, 2020 8:24am
- Master Mariner
  
  https://www.maritimenz.govt.nz/commercial/ports-and-harbours/documents/COVID-19-guidance-for-Stevedores.pdf
  
  No enforcement / records and documented testing in other Ports. this is the issue when Ports are Privatised ( mostly). No clear guidance from Maritime NZ and ( Ministry of transport).
  Each to there own guidelines.
  Totaly at odds to practices world wide in Ports and Covid
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:56am
  - Master Mariner
    
    COVID -19 Maritime Industry Update 18 August … – Maritime NZwww.maritimenz.govt.nz › covid › documents › mariti…
    PDF
    Aug 12, 2020 – Auckland and Port Tauranga. 3. 2. Maritime and port industry liaison. 4. 3. Seafarer welfare. 4. 4. Crew changes. 5. 5. COVID-19 guidelines for workers in ports. 5.
    
    Google search and web page now not online. 18th August.
    Wow, “Early and hard”
    
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    September 9, 2020 8:58am
  - Ed Snack
    
    Nothing to do with privatisation, sorry. All to do with not organising to test and detect. Port ownership is irrelevant as they don’t control biosecurity or enforcement.
    
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    September 9, 2020 11:46am
- RW Capitalist
  
  It could come in on frozen food
  
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  September 9, 2020 10:26am
  - Ed Snack
    
    But rather unlikely.
    
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    September 9, 2020 11:47am
    - RW Capitalist
      
      Just repeating what cindy has put out there.
      She must be the first in the world to say/ notice this.
      Without any thought of how big the frozen food industry is and how she could wreck it all.
      
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      September 9, 2020 1:01pm
oldpark

What price free speech ? . Especially when it goes against Political Control Freaks . A school in Taranaki emailed the pupils parents pointing out the pros and cons of Legal Dope Smoking and a Fancy name for Legal Death .
Seems there are a lot of hurty feelings with that type of information causing angst amongst Politicians and as well as some Government Employees.
Whats the problem on people who will be voting on a referendum in the coming General Election their right to know both sides of the question .
Interesting on a recent news bulletin I heard a lot of vehement verbal dribble by a one man band Politician. Putting the boot into the Schools free speech democratic right to have an opinion .
Interesting on the same Station I heard another person from Taxpayer funded Drug Foundation to the tune of $300,000 saying how good it would be to say yeah to Legal Dope smoking .
It appears the Phrase “Say Nope to Dope” or Saying “NO” to the fancy name for so called Legal Death is causing a lot of heartburn to the type of Control Freaks who are running scared of their sneaky back door type of agenda . Like as if their Ideas and people who have the “Democratic Right” to challenge them are being virtually classed as Social Outcasts .
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September 9, 2020 8:26am
- Loddenthinks
  
  It’s the right of any principal or BoT to have an opinion on anything, but I question the validity of using the pupils’ or or parents’ email lists for political purposes. That’s definitely not what the lists are for.
  
  I’d also question the wisdom of taking any advice on these matters from a school principal or BoT, but it takes all sorts I guess.
  
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  September 9, 2020 10:27am
- Classic Liberal
  
  I’d tend to agree, Lodden.
  
  Free speech: headmaster posts opinion online or in media.
  
  Abuse of power: using the parents’ emails for political purposes.
  
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  September 9, 2020 1:44pm
Maggie Pie

Campaign 2020. NO masks. NO social distancing.
(And all just a little bit ‘sickening” anyway)

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EhW-RWRVoAA0Jtd?format=jpg&name=small
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September 9, 2020 8:26am
- Tall Man
  
  And that people, is the limit of cindy’s abilities.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:45am
  - calendar girl
    
    Self-promotion / “Look at me” take priority.
    
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    September 10, 2020 8:30am
- cmm
  
  Poor people sitting there trying to eat!
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:54am
Paulus

At a casual Church meeting morning a visitor from West Auckland (an Auntie of sorts) gave us some ideas of what is happening there re lack of testing. Basically the Church leaders have the power – more than the Government or Authorities – they and Mrs live well from the proceeds.
But they control who and what is understood and taken as gospel – like the Maori Huia.
It is fear that it now heavily endemic in areas that there are many overstayers in the area and the Pastor has told them that the testing for the virus is unproven, and that the Police will question them as overstayers despite the Health Minister telling them they will not.
They know who they will agree with hence we may have a greater endemic in differing areas.
They fear the Government more than their own leaders – who they fear too !
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September 9, 2020 8:31am
- Jack5
  
  The price of porous borders and the price of condemning and hampering immigration officials as they seek “illegals.”
  
  We could save the rest of New Zealand by “Singaporizing” Auckland: separating it as a fenced-off city state, Singapore style. That’s how Singaporean Chinese saved themselves from Malay domination.
  
  Aucklanders could then fight over a new official language: Putonghua Chinese, Hindi, Samoan, Tagalog, Tongan, Arabic, or even Maori.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:57am
Maggie Pie

What a fab day in The Mount.
Sir Michael is looking well.
Even the security guard looks happy 😀

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EhYeg-4VkAANiMc?format=jpg&name=small
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September 9, 2020 8:48am
- Inandout
  
  Well Maggie, at least the diseased ones won’t let their mouth vapour spread to Sir.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:53am
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    If only that was the Mount, but it’s actually Ohiwa.
    
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    September 9, 2020 9:04am
- softail 1450
  
  M P, Kiritapu’s husband isn’t a bad looking chick ???
  
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  September 9, 2020 11:19am
Billy Collins

Oh look, even John Kelly’s aide, Zach Fuentes, has come out denying Trump called slain soldiers “losers” and “suckers” and refused to visit them, and defends the case that it was a weather issue, which is backed up by emails, documents and John Bolton himself. Zach even criticises Trump for his remarks about Kelly in the same interview.

“You can put me on record denying that I spoke with The Atlantic. I don’t know who the sources are. I did not hear POTUS call anyone losers when I told him about the weather. Honestly, do you think General Kelly would have stood by and let ANYONE call fallen Marines losers?”

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2020/09/07/exclusive-zach-fuentes-top-aide-to-john-kelly-denies-atlantic-story-about-trump/

So John Bolton and the closest aide to John Kelly have both denied the claim.

If Trump said it, the question remains: Why would these people, who hate Trump, go on record to push an elaborate weather LIE in order to defend him? It doesn’t make sense, yet the weather explanation makes perfect sense.

Is DPF still gonna claim that you have to have TDS to reject Atlantic’s claims?
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September 9, 2020 8:50am
- mandk
  
  President Trump has more regard for slain soldiers than most of his predecessors, and especially Obama.
  
  Trump has worked really hard to scale back US overseas military adventures and to prevent young Americans begin brought home in body bags.
  
  How is it that Obama got a Nobel Peace Prize, while Trump hasn’t?
  
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  September 9, 2020 9:16am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Oh please. The death rate for US soldiers in the middle east has barely moved since 2014. Although it is now trending upwards, and there are more US troops deployed in the middle east than when Trump took office.
    
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    September 9, 2020 9:49am
    - mandk
      
      https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/19/world/asia/afghanistan-us-troop-withdrawal.html
      
      https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/12/world/middleeast/american-troops-iraq-syria.html
      
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Withdrawal_of_U.S._troops_from_Iraq_(2020)
      
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      September 9, 2020 10:15am
JibberJabber

SB2 spotted at St Lukes…

https://twitter.com/aTeXan575/status/1303413226865033216
21 4
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September 9, 2020 8:52am
- The Proper Ghandi
  
  Yikes!!
  
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  September 9, 2020 10:35am
Sir Cullen's Sidekick

Mark my words. Labour’s tax policy today:
100K – 150K taxed at 36%
> 150K taxed at 39%

As usual Sheeple will be happy to pay a “little bit extra” to help fund social justice e.g. James Shaw burning 12M for a rich private school.
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September 9, 2020 8:55am
- wimpston peeeders
  
  on the am show 85% said no new/higher taxes to pay for cindy and robbos great covid cash splash.
  
  Id say a massive lie is on the way, no new taxes and then a big fuck you once re elected and we get shafted(again)
  
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  September 9, 2020 9:18am
  - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
    
    Peeders good old lad – I will take that. If Cindy screws sheeple like that even sheeple will wake up and Labour will never see the light of the day. But Cindy is a commie in nature. She will announce tax hikes. They can always sell additional taxes to pay for hospitals and schools and Sheeple will fall for this trick. It is easier to sell tax hikes in NZ because the sheeple here are communists by nature.
    
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    September 9, 2020 10:10am
- Jimmy White
  
  Looks like I will have to pay the wife a salary.
  
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  September 9, 2020 3:13pm
Durden

Apparently you can’t take a stand on legislation it if you are a Catholic School.

“A Catholic school that has given parents “vote no” literature on cannabis and euthanasia has sparked a moral and legal row over whether schools should get involved in politics.”

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12363285

“Otago University law professor Andrew Geddis, author of the textbook Electoral Law in New Zealand, said the school board was a state agency and “there might still be a problem over whether the school’s policies were compliant with the Public Service Commission’s guidance on political neutrality”. ”

But it is ok if socialist indoctrinating state schools get involved in various campaigns with government interfering leading to politically driven legislative changes.

https://foreignaffairs.co.nz/2020/09/08/mil-osi-new-zealand-new-relationships-and-sexuality-education-guidelines-for-schools/

And it is OK if school/university teachers actively promote student indoctrination/activism in terms of UN’s climate change and sustainability goals, ask primary school kids to vote for cycleways, shut down free speech, promote cancel culture, get kids to sign petitions and send to the PM to ban oil and gas exploration.

The fact that Kindy Cindy spends so much time at schools is a clear example — politicisation is OK when the left do it.
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September 9, 2020 8:56am
- wimpston peeeders
  
  Hey its ok when the left do it dont ya know!
  
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  September 9, 2020 9:19am
- Ehlana
  
  So when state school teachers tell children to tell their parents to vote Labour (as happened to my nephew) are they acting in compliance with the “Public Service Commission’s guidance on political neutrality”?
  Altogether now” “It’s different … “
  
  28 2
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  September 9, 2020 9:31am
  - rockape
    
    Never mind using the children they teach to go and campaign for pay rises on their behalf.
    
    6 1
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    September 9, 2020 10:45am
- Fletch
  
  I see on last night’s news that there will be a new sex-ed curriculum in schools which includes “gender diversity” etc etc. I shudder to think what kids are about to be propagandized with…. ?
  
  9 2
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  September 9, 2020 10:49am
- KevO'Brien
  
  Try telling any school board they are under the Public Service Commission control and see what happens.
  
  2 1
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  September 9, 2020 12:56pm
  - mikenmildagain
    
    The board members will laugh at you?
    
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    September 9, 2020 2:37pm
Gulag1917

Causes of Venezuela’s economic depression

political corruption,
chronic shortages of food and medicine,
closure of companies,
unemployment,
deterioration of productivity,
authoritarianism,
human rights violations,
gross economic mismanagement.
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September 9, 2020 9:00am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  We have all of those except perhaps #2 and #7, so we’re almost there.
  
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  September 9, 2020 9:16am
  - wimpston peeeders
    
    theyre working hard on #7 captain.
    3 more years and theyll get there on all of those points.
    
    15 2
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    September 9, 2020 9:21am
  - Tall Man
    
    https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/leaked-ministry-health-email-reveals-nz-facing-temporary-shortage-flu-vaccine
    
    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/northern-advocate/news/article.cfm?c_id=1503450&objectid=12266850
    
    https://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PO2007/S00179/police-raids-following-facebook-posts-ruled-unlawful.htm
    
    Still unsure about #2 & #7?
    
    15 2
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    September 9, 2020 9:22am
- Bob
  
  These conditions of the economy are all for our own long term good, and a brighter future for our grandchildren to inherit; all whilst ‘sitting on the couch watching dear leader’s daily address to the nation “
  
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  September 9, 2020 10:54am
  - Jimmy White
    
    Bob make sure you have the curtains pulled if you are going to sit while the dear leader speaks. The neighbours might hand you in. 1 year at the Wuhan indoctrination camps at Owenga or Te One.
    
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    September 9, 2020 3:19pm
I remember when

Worldometer News:
Sweden drops out of top 10 deaths per million list.
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September 9, 2020 9:16am
- Critical Thinker
  
  Sweden had a common sense approach to the covid flu and didn’t enforce a harsh lockdown. They now have herd immunity ?
  
  Sweden deaths WITH covid flu vs deaths FROM covid flu:
  
  WITH covid flu = 5,813
  FROM covid flu = 872
  
  Deaths per million FROM covid flu = 87
  
  90% of Swedish covid deaths were those aged 70+
  
  https://youtu.be/8UvFhIFzaac?t=404
  
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  September 9, 2020 12:26pm
  - Critical Thinker
    
    Sweden’s ‘Herd Immunity’ Mastermind Gets Promoted by WHO
    
    “I believe [that] the virus is going to sweep like a storm over Sweden and infect basically everyone in one or two months…I believe that thousands are already infected in Sweden… it will all come to an end when so many have been infected and become therefore immune that the virus has nowhere else to go (so-called herd immunity).” – Johan Giesecke
    
    His article was met with a response by a collection of scientists, who raised several issues with Giesecke’s assertions. They said the idea that stopping the spread of the coronavirus was “futile” and fails to take into account countries where this has been done successfully, such as New Zealand ?
    
    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/swedens-herd-immunity-mastermind-gets-promoted-by-who/ar-BB18D5pZ
    
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    September 9, 2020 12:59pm
  - Jimmy White
    
    And they are not in recession and don’t have a Cindy doll as PM.
    
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    September 9, 2020 3:22pm
Capricardo

News:
“Winston Peters seen smoking at Smoke Free University Campus”
On an earlier post I suggested he would do anything to get some headlines regardless of their significance.
Would he have known he was being watched?
Of course.
Now wait for the next earth shattering revelation featuring Peters!
There’s bound to be more!
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September 9, 2020 9:17am
Tall Man

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/sport/2020/09/athletics-caster-semenya-loses-appeal-against-court-of-arbitration-ruling-on-testosterone-regulations.html

https://www.instagram.com/p/BO-Bd1BhObp/?utm_source=ig_embed

Perhaps the world should be looking more closely at the sponsors of these “atheletes”.
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September 9, 2020 9:18am
Rusty

Do you know who are behind a lot of these BLM protests in the USA?

It is left wing/far left high school and university teachers who mask themselves during the marches so they are not recognized.

Many of them organize these protests and encourage there students to do the same whether lawfully protesting or not.

Cindy and the Greens like targeting our schools with there marxist/socialist ideologies disguised as democracy — right?
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September 9, 2020 9:22am
- Albert_Ross
  
  An assertion, supported by no evidence, about something that is happening on the other side of the world, in a very different society, is supposed to prove something about the Government of New Zealand?
  
  Rightly in my view, we blame Government and the media for being driven by feelz and ideological bias, demanding instead proper science, objective cost-benefit analysis and rational assessment of the evidence in consideration of public policy. See posts about covid, climate change, vaccination, traffic management, child poverty, criminal justice etc.
  
  If that is to carry any credibility or moral authority we have to do better than garbage reasoning such as this.
  
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  September 9, 2020 10:18am
- Raphael
  
  BLM (the movement/organisation) is a far left Communist organisation that is seeking the violent overthrow of capitalism and the destruction of the nuclear family. (and their website says as much). They seek noting short of a complete dismantling of the Western World (while ignoring the fact that in the East and in Africa they would be ground beneath the boot of the nearest dictator who would think nothing of shooting the lot of them. It is only under Western Civilisation there even exists a space for them to sprout their nonsense)
  
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  September 9, 2020 10:23am
  - The Proper Ghandi
    
    It’s simpler than that: they are black supremacists who want to subjugate white people. Marxism is just the means. Any white liberal who “allies” to them is beyond stupid. Think about a society with these people in charge.
    
    https://twitter.com/odonnell_r/status/1302782415363092484
    
    https://twitter.com/odonnell_r/status/1302390888442757123
    
    5 2
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    September 9, 2020 10:47am
Critical Thinker

Covid data from the CDC: “Stay-at-home” orders for all didn’t make things better, in fact, they seemed to have made things FAR worse ?

https://rationalground.com/stay-at-home-orders-dont-work-they-may-have-made-things-worse/
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September 9, 2020 9:28am
surfing

Winter energy payment? All the whiner’s never complained about not having it when there was no such thing.

Where is the gratitude for what they do get?

This story is pathetic…
https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/122685705/winter-energy-payments-ending-i-dont-know-what-im-going-to-do
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September 9, 2020 9:32am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  If all of those whiners had voted National they would have ended up with a big boost in their Super which would have been far more than the winter energy payment and would have lasted all year instead of just three months or so.
  So those of them who voted for anyone else can bloody well stop complaining.
  
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  September 9, 2020 12:11pm
Maggy Wassilieff

This is the reality of post-wage subsidy life – the money was distributed to employers, and control of it stays with them. There is no obligation to retain employees beyond the end of the period covered by the subsidy, simply a strong encouragement to do so.
https://thespinoff.co.nz/business/09-09-2020/nz-biggest-businesses-are-making-huge-profits-thanks-to-the-wage-subsidy/
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September 9, 2020 9:36am
- wimpston peeeders
  
  as I said yesterday the economy is on govt life support its just dressed up as subsidies.
  
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  September 9, 2020 9:46am
Frank Hematuria

Until this morning I had never heard of Adam Dudding, Eugene Bingham, or their chosen expert Peter Bale who commented on their podcast “Tick. Tick” (which I also had never heard of until today. It seems Peter Bale is “a New Zealander who has had a distinguished career at organisations such as Reuters, CNN and as director of the Center for Public Integrity”. That center is widely regarded as being skewed to the left of politics, and people have their own opinions about Reuters and CNN.

These gentlemen tell us that “public disquiet about the conduct of journalists at the Covid-19 press conferences (sic, I think they mean “media” conferences) could be reduced if the cameras were pointed at the journalists”, and that “where the journalists are invisible has not done anyone any good in terms of journalists not appearing like a baying mob”. The entire article, prominent on Stuff early this morning but slipping down the page now, is worth a read if you enjoy satire. This bit is especially good – “in New Zealand, he (Peter Bale) said, journalists had struggled to question Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern in a public forum without appearing to be badgering her, which does not go down well with the public.
What utter and complete rubbish. Until nausea drove me away from watching the Covid-19 media events I never saw or heard any journalist “baying”, but I did see and hear quite a few asking soft questions every time the PM graciously allowed them to ask her one, and I never heard anybody ask anything that required any more than a smile, a torrent of words, and a high level of dodging and weaving to fill in the time before the next question. The plain fact is that there were no journalists present who had the slightest interest in asking about anything beyond the superficial, and none who had the ability or willingness to follow up on obvious half-truths and obfuscation from the PM and others sharing the podium with her.

Furthermore, the media has from the very beginning built a protective barrier around the PM, both by shielding her from any proper scrutiny and by their then savaging anybody who has the temerity to say “hang on a minute PM…..what about…….”. This has fed directly into the “close my eyes and stick my fingers in my ears” mindsets of the cadre of left wing supporters and their foaming at the mouth hangers-on who take to Twitter and Facebook to support the nonsense they have been fed and have neither the inclination nor the intelligence to question what they have had forced down their throats. For confirmation, check any number of Twitter and FB threads. So, the “public disquiet” we are told is rampant is actually led by a small number of lefties who throw raw meat to their followers who then dutifully vent in an entirely predictable manner. It is not representative of the public as a whole, and it is the result of a construct by the media which is the polar opposite of what the three responsible for this wonderfully satirical opinion piece would have us believe. And still nobody, outside perhaps of Mike Hosking, gets to ask the PM any hard questions. Ever.
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September 9, 2020 9:46am
- Ian Boag
  
  Wow! I bet that made you feel better. 🙂
  
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  September 9, 2020 12:03pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Behrouz Boochani – The Great Escape…

How to get to NZ (from about 19min in)

Broadcast on ABC yesterday
https://iview.abc.net.au/show/australian-story/series/2020/video/NC2002Q021S00
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September 9, 2020 9:50am
- Swifty
  
  Planned this way right from the start…..
  
  A number of lefties, and including Boochani himself, have decried any ‘politicisation’ of his situation but labelling any objectors or even questioners as nasty right wingers, and here is Golriz squeezing any political capital she can wring out of it.
  
  And all at our expense, unless of course Golriz and Donna can assure us they have met all his expenses since his arrival and that he has not drawn on the pockets of hard-pressed NZ taxpayers………
  
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  September 9, 2020 10:45am
- RJ
  
  Considering he had been granted a place in the USA, labour broke all the rules in granting him a place here. But hey, corruption, nothing new to this government of clowns.
  
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  September 9, 2020 12:19pm
- Jack5
  
  Yep, the invitation to the scribblers’ festival, Write Christchurch, was a pretext to get Boochani into New Zealand.
  
  A picture at the end of the video has Boochani between Miles-Mojab, the NZ ethnic Iranian activist who seems to have open entry to Stuff, and TV’s teary lefty, John Campbell. Golriz Ghahraman is also in the line.
  
  Two points of interest:
  
  1. Canterbury University seems to have given Boochani a research fellowship. That means taxpayers are supporting him.
  
  2. When Boochani gets residency will he go through the back door to Australia, or will Canberra end visa-free entry for New Zealanders?
  
  Well spotted, Maggy!
  
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  September 9, 2020 1:21pm
old skool reactionary

The latest #BLM hoax in Rochester has resulted in the police chief (BLACK) quitting, with his deputy and all the command staff following him.

This latest hoax was actually an incident from months ago. A druggie going bonkers, running around starkers and spitting on police. Thats why he got the bag over the head – I’d call that extremely humane treatment for scum trying to infect law enforcement personnel.
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September 9, 2020 9:52am
Flossie

Now we hear of previously undisclosed Covid19 cases coming out of the woodwork. People have been hiding contacts. Perhaps this sort of dishonesty coming to light could actually reveal how this current cluster began – somebody wasn’t exactly truthful?
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September 9, 2020 10:01am
- kowtow
  
  Well Cinders , how’s that team of 5 million thingy goin’ ?
  
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  September 9, 2020 10:56am
- jv
  
  They have been “a challenge to work with”, “they are now being educated on the gravity of the situation” – and the team of 5 million welcomes them to uighurland
  
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  September 9, 2020 1:09pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  It’s so “fustrating”
  https://play.stuff.co.nz/details/_6188960566001
  
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  September 9, 2020 5:53pm
dave_c_

Covid scam planned ? You bettya.
World Bank Records COVID-19 Test Kits Exported In 2017, 2018, yet ‘Covid 19’ tag was not created until February 2020.
https://nationalfile.com/world-bank-records-covid-19-test-kits-exported-in-2018/
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September 9, 2020 10:07am
- fernglas
  
  If you could explain to me why $20 million of Covid-19 test kits would weigh 2.5 million kg, it might help to clear up any confusion.
  
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  September 9, 2020 11:18am
Maggie Pie

Nobody is spared…..

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EhV9c90X0AAtWVC?format=jpg&name=900×900
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September 9, 2020 10:14am
- The Proper Ghandi
  
  If anyone was still deluding themselves, the fact that “black owned business” signs are seen as necessary to protect one’s livelihood from the “peaceful protesters” should tell them what their motivation is.
  
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  September 9, 2020 10:51am
- mandk
  
  That’s because BLM doesn’t actually care about black lives and livelihoods.
  
  BLM is fundamentally anarchist/marxist and nothing else. The objective is to wreck the economy and social order.
  
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  September 9, 2020 11:54am
oldfella

(Don’t tell DPF.)
WHY MOST POLLS ARE GARBAGE…
https://www.redstate.com/scotthounsell/2020/09/08/your-definitive-guide-to-understanding-polling/
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September 9, 2020 10:33am
wimpston peeeders

maori party want to double benefits and imediately raise minimum wage to 25bux. Just when I thought no ones as retarded as the greens tamihere said “hold my beer”
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September 9, 2020 10:44am
- wimpston peeeders
  
  and cancel all debt owed to govt via welfare loans.
  
  sends a clear message that intergenerational dole dependacy will pay off if you stick at it long enough and vote for twats like that.
  
  maybe maori party should look to Maori in australia and work out why they do so well… hint theres no welfare for them they have to work and succeed.
  
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  September 9, 2020 10:48am
  - Flossie
    
    Quite right WP. When a group of people are told they are in need of help and support it becomes a self fulfilling prophesy. I am sure free school lunches etc just frees up the parent/caregiver’s time – and money – for “other purposes”. Put some personal responsibility back on the table!
    And how do the Maori Party propose to PAY for their largess?
    And I’m one of them.
    
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    September 9, 2020 12:22pm
oldfella

Black Lives Matter… unless they are black and live in a Democrat hell hole like Chicago.
Scores of people are shot there every week in what CNN and other MSM media would probably describe as ‘Peaceful Shootings’.
https://dailycaller.com/2020/09/08/chicago-labor-day-weekend-shootings-child-teen/
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September 9, 2020 10:51am
mark15

Work is going to a four day week.
Thanks Jacinda!
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September 9, 2020 11:07am
Swifty

The Maori Party predictably proposes to bribe their way back into Parliament with massive financial incentives for people who give them their vote:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/122707734/election-2020-mori-party-wants-to-raise-minimum-wage-to-25-immediately-and-double-benefit-levels

No mention of how they’re going to pay for it – as they admit to not having any costings nor, I suspect, any analysis of the negative consequences that will occur from their policies.

Here again we have Party A (the Maori Party) proposing to use the power of the state to force what Party B (taxpayers and business owners) will do for Party C (potential Maori Party supporters).

I thought Tamihere might be better than this, but no.
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September 9, 2020 11:08am
wimpston peeeders

labour must have had a hiding in the internal polling, no guts to try envy taxes and a policy that will affect fuck all.

their political capital got sucked up with covid botch ups so no wriggle room hence why we are seeing no real policy and no big announcements/flagship policy just rather insignificant filler stuff.
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September 9, 2020 11:09am
- alloytoo
  
  I find myself agreeing with your analysis.
  
  I also think the public holiday went down like a ton of sick with many people.
  
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  September 9, 2020 1:48pm
Wired-one

So a new top tax rate for those earning over $180,000pa. I earn half that and will not be affected but I completely disagree with this approach from Labour. This group already pays far more than their fair share. Time we stopped with all the nice to haves such as free tertiary education, child start payments, working for families and winter energy payments. And we also need to trim the fat from our public service and make them as efficient as possible. I wonder how much of the tax take this group will pay now? 25-30-60%? Its a joke.
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September 9, 2020 11:09am
- Ian Boag
  
  I gather GR estimates $500 million from the tax. Not quite 1% of the total $80,000 million total tax take.
  
  Income testing the pension would save a lot more …:-)
  
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  September 9, 2020 11:59am
  - Evadne
    
    They say it will “generate” $500 million.
    
    It will do nothing of the sort. That $500m is reallocated, not generated. It’s not new money– it’s currently being spent somewhere.
    
    What Robertson is doing is stopping it being spent in one place (at the discretion of the earning party), and forcing it to be spent somewhere else ( by order of the government). That may or may not be a good thing (ymmv), but it is disingenuous to claim it is being “generated”.
    
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    September 9, 2020 1:29pm
    - alloytoo
      
      It may very well stop it being generated at all if some of those people decide to reduce their output or restructure their earnings.
      
      It just seems to be a policy absent of any originality.
      
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      September 9, 2020 1:51pm
    - Swifty
      
      Very well put Evadne.
      
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      September 9, 2020 2:48pm
- rouppe
  
  In order to generate $550million they are assuming there is about $1.4 billion of paye income above $180k.
  
  I’m not sure how many people 2% represents but that seems like a heroic assumption…
  
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  September 9, 2020 12:35pm
  - Wayne Mapp
    
    Roberston uses the misleading figure of 2%. That is all taxpayers; kids, students, part time workers and elderly retired, not just those in the full time workforce.
    
    Those on over $180,000 are much more like 5% of the full time workforce, maybe a bit more.
    
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    September 9, 2020 3:58pm
- KevO'Brien
  
  Tax your richest and watch them call their tax lawyers or just depart.
  
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  September 9, 2020 12:42pm
  - Jimmy White
    
    AS I said further up, the Wife will be paid a salary.
    
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    September 9, 2020 3:25pm
- Evadne
  
  Robertson has obviously spent too much time watching cartoons of Scrooge McDuck, and Richie Rich. He seems to think that high earners have wads of cash under their beds, and rooms piled high in gold coins, just waiting to be given to the government in wheelbarrow loads.
  
  In the Real World, people have budgets, and spend (or invest) their money. It is usually all accounted for. Forced with having to suddenly find $thousands extra to meet their tax bill, and no way of dollars sitting idle under the bed, which of the following does Robertson want these people to do?
  
  – default on their mortgage
  – put off buying that new car / boat / bathroom
  – sack their cleaner
  – mow their own lawns / wash their own house (etc) instead of paying for someone else to do it
  – stop eating out
  – cancel their annual holiday to Queenstown
  – reduce their investments, and take money out of the NZX
  – reduce Kiwisaver & retirement savings
  – cut back on charitable giving
  – cut back on shopping trips / spending at local mall
  – ?
  
  11 1
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  September 9, 2020 1:24pm
  - Evadne
    
    And anyone who says ” didums, they can jolly well mow their own lawns / clean their own houses / cook their own meals / go without a holiday and pay their fair share” should be forced to explain the concept of “fairness” and “kindness” to the people who have lawn mowing or cleaning businesses / cafes / hospitality jobs put at risk as their customer base drops even further.
    
    Economics 101: don’t increase taxes in a recession, as that takes money out of the system and discourages spending just when you need to be encouraging spending.
    
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    September 9, 2020 1:47pm
Maggie Pie

Be interesting to see if the Horrid blocks me as well 😀

https://twitter.com/nzherald/status/1303203554581151744
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September 9, 2020 11:09am
- graham
  
  Heh, looks like about 97% of the comments are along the lines of, “who the hell cares ‘what it was like inside Siouxsie Wiles’ house in the days leading up to lockdown’?”
  
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  September 9, 2020 11:38am
wimpston peeeders

this reminds me of the meme: what did socialists use before candles… electricity.

looks like socialist hellhole california is heading down that path.
https://youtu.be/KzhedZ7CVAk

the same state you gotta choose between doing laundry or having a shower each day.
water shortage
power shortage
poor sanitation
tax tax tax tax tax
Plague of homeless

yup socialism is a winner
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September 9, 2020 11:15am
Captain Mainwaring

So Robbo is going to reintroduce ‘call me Sir’ Cullen’s 39% rich pricks’ tax for those over $180,000 per annum.
For the piddling $500,000 it’s going to raise (which it won’t because the tax accountants will see to that) it’s nothing more than virtue signalling.
“Don’t get rich, or we will make you pay.”
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September 9, 2020 11:18am
- Swifty
  
  That’s $500M annually, Cap’n, according to Robbo.
  
  And, of course, depending on what Robbo has assumed regarding NZers moves to protect themselves from this robbery.
  
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  September 9, 2020 11:29am
  - RW Capitalist
    
    To raise an extra $500mill
    That means $500mill = 5% (approx.)
    
    Total core Crown revenue for the 2018/19 financial year was $119.3 billion. Tax revenue is the major source of core Crown revenue; this totalled $86.5 billion in the 2018/19 financial year.
    So I say…Bull shit Grant.
    
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    September 9, 2020 3:53pm
    - Ian Boag
      
      $800 mil is 1% of $80 bn, so $500 mil is about 0.6% of all tax. I think you lost a zero someplace …
      
      If you really want to claw back non-productive spending you could start by income testing the pension. Even if you made the limit higher than the $150/week allowed for other benefits there would be a billion or two saved from the current $15 bn costs.
      
      Ah wash my mouth … 🙂
      
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      September 9, 2020 4:34pm
- JerJer
  
  Thats fine.
  
  I’ll get caught by this, but, there are ways of reducing tax, so, I’ll make sure I pay less rather than more.
  
  All easy and competely legal too.
  
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  September 9, 2020 11:30am
- riffer
  
  Still pales in comparison to what the tax rates were in the Muldoon years:
  http://keithrankin.co.nz/Rankin_Muldoon-years_Hamilton-conference_2014.pdf
  
  I can only aspire to pay an extra 2% tax…
  
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  September 9, 2020 11:35am
  - Ed Snack
    
    The tax rules were a lot slacker in Muldoon’s time though. I was briefly taxed at 66% but my company vehicle was completely untaxed, so my effective rate was considerably lower. And that’s just one example.
    
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    September 9, 2020 11:55am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    Muldoon’s situation was different.
    The NZ dollar was fixed at that time and we were very short of foreign exchange. The Arbitration Court forced wage rates up which put on more pressure of spending. That landed up too on the balance of payments.
    The measures were harsh at the time but they worked to stop a wage price spiral.
    
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    September 9, 2020 12:40pm
    - Captain Mainwaring
      
      But they didn’t stop the wage/price spiral. Wage increases factored in the after-tax effect and inflation ran rampant.
      The only benefit was that house price inflation basically turned mortgages taken out 15 years prior into beer money.
      
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      September 9, 2020 12:57pm
- riffer
  
  Oh, and it’s $500 million, not $500 thousand…
  
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  September 9, 2020 11:36am
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    Sorry, my bad, but it’s still piddling.
    Message to successful people: “stop being successful or we’re going to take you to the cleaners”.
    
    10 2
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    September 9, 2020 12:17pm
- RJ
  
  I don’t see a need for it. Drop the political bribes, like the 3 billion jones fund, go after students not paying their loans. Remove the ability for companies to pay no tax or bugger all, and that also means make Sanitarium pat tax. And above all sensible govt spending. Admit we cannot afford working for families.
  
  National started the hard work of going after google, etc, labour have done stuff all with it
  
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  September 9, 2020 12:11pm
- KevO'Brien
  
  Does Robbo propose to actually repay any borrowings from the Reserve Bank?
  Venezula here we come (reluctantly.)
  
  ☑️☑️ Proven☑️☑️
  
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  September 9, 2020 12:35pm
  - alwyn
    
    Of course he is going to repay all the borrowing. He says that the $550 million will go to more money for Health, Education and repaying the Covid 19 borrowing.
    
    I think he needs a new calculator though, or perhaps someone can explain to him the difference between a million and a billion.
    Even if he was to put the whole lot into repaying debt it will take him about 100 years to repay the borrowing from this year alone.
    The man is a total economic illiterate.
    
    On the other hand you should read this line from his statement very, very carefully.
    ‘ “Labour will not implement any new taxes or make any further increases to income tax next term,” Robertson promised this morning.’.
    Anyone want to wager on him increasing the rate of GST to 20% or perhaps 25%? After all it isn’t and Income Tax and it is already an existing tax.
    There is nothing in his statement that says he will leave the existing rate of GST in place.
    
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    September 9, 2020 2:18pm
adaman

Maori party want to raise minimum wage immediately to $25 and DOUBLE benefit levels.

Labour have announced a new personal tax rate of 39% for income over $180,000.

Funny that lefties talk about “austerity” as this big bad boogeyman, yet raising taxes and costs on business is the sort of austerity during economic downturns that fuck people over.

If the MP are actually running on their platform of $25 minimum wage immediately and doubling of benefits – then it is in this nation’s best interests to ensure that they do not enter Parliament again whilst they run this sort of loony policy.
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September 9, 2020 11:23am
- ex-golfer
  
  Pretty easy to make election promises knowing you will never be expected to implement them.
  Remember that promise called Kiwibuild?
  
  7 1
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  September 9, 2020 1:19pm
- JackRabbit
  
  Yes, and they would also like to return to the Maori way of life. Which is ironic, because it shows that they don’t understand their own history.
  
  Maori chiefs of the Tahitian branch of Maori, had a short fuse for entitled or lazy tribe members. Pakeha or Maori, fleecing the tribe was considered fleecing the chief. For a Maori, that meant dishonour and a painful death, and/or head on a stick. For a Pakeha, it may have meant death, or death and tomorrow’s roast.
  
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  September 9, 2020 1:33pm
  - Jack5
    
    The Tahitians also had an interesting form of kapa haka:
    
    https://youtu.be/ab_tYof60I4
    
    2 1
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    September 9, 2020 2:45pm
softail 1450

Cindy gives Michael one last boot at the rich pricks,OMG isn’t she wonderful, so thoughtful towards Michael ,her feeeelz are amazing,he can shuffle off as a happy little fellow now.
12 1
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September 9, 2020 11:26am
Maggie Pie

Looks like my partner may need to create yet another position for one of his nephews.
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September 9, 2020 11:38am
- Joely Doe
  
  Signed the kids up to the payroll earlier this year. Stupid employment laws say that even if they do no work, I still have to pay them. Ces’t la vie!
  
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  September 9, 2020 12:21pm
  - alex Masterley
    
    Might have to re-employ the wife. And the lads are starting to want to get some office experience. It is what it is.
    
    8 2
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    September 9, 2020 1:49pm
Tauhei Notts

I have been following the betting market in the Biden versus Trump contest. I had noticed Biden’s chances slipping day by day from 5th August through to 6th September. But over the past three days Biden has firmed in the market. Turnover on that event now exceeds $140mil so a decent sum has been wagered.
To bring it into a New Zealand context, Trump has seven times more chance than Judith Collins.
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September 9, 2020 11:43am
oldfella

Talking of the well off… did Stockholm Cindy ever take that 20% wage cut for herself?
Just asking for the little people in this country doing it so hard.
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September 9, 2020 11:55am
- alwyn
  
  Don’t you dare ask such a question.
  Cindy only does what is best for all her serfs.
  She wanted to but is was just too hard.
  So there!
  
  4 1
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  September 9, 2020 2:21pm
TWEEDSE

So two policies from labour this week, a holiday and reintroducing the Cullen rich prick tax.

Gosh, labour is just briming over with ideas to save New Zealand.
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September 9, 2020 12:20pm
- Cinematic
  
  Hard to think of a more vacuous ‘policy’ than a new holiday.
  
  Particularly a holiday that only resonates with a few hippy academics and professional treaty troughers.
  
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  September 9, 2020 2:05pm
ex-golfer

So, Hopkins is frustrated at members of the Mt Roskill church not co-operating with health authorities while trying to contact trace the now largest cluster in the country.
Well, time to walk the walk Hipkins.
Get tough and get the authorities involved.
If they don’t want to be part of the team of Cindy’s 5 million, then kick them all into solitary confinement and if overstayers, immediately deport them.
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September 9, 2020 12:24pm
- RW Capitalist
  
  Dawn raids????
  Remember how much trouble Muldoon got into and is remembered for…
  New Zealand. Dawn raids were a common event in Auckland, New Zealand, during a crackdown on illegal overstayers from the Pacific Islands from the mid-1970s to the early 1980s. The raids were first introduced in 1973 by Norman Kirk’s Labour government and were continued by Rob Muldoon’s National government.
  Shall I repeat:
  ……. introduced in 1973 by Norman Kirk’s Labour government and were continued by Rob Muldoon’s National government.
  NOTE: 1973 was Kirk’s first full year in office.
  and Labour have been BLAMING Muldoon for this ever since (BTW: I was also suckered by them, I didn’t know until just now)
  
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  September 9, 2020 12:54pm
- kowtow
  
  I won’t hold my breath waiting for the Media Party who slam “anti lockdown” types real hard for endangering us to slam these folk for same.
  
  Because;
  diversity
  intersectionality
  minorities
  equality/equity
  people of colour
  safe space
  white privelige
  capitalism
  racism
  all whites is racist
  
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  September 9, 2020 1:05pm
I remember when

Did Labour really announce a new tax rate or are they just taxing the electorates imagination?
8 3
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September 9, 2020 12:29pm
- Cinematic
  
  They’re taxing a lot of voters patience. Hopefully many more by the day…
  
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  September 9, 2020 2:03pm
chukar

Taxation is theft .(Bob Jones )

This is another Labour envy tax.
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September 9, 2020 12:32pm
- MCos
  
  Taken at face value Bob Jones pronouncement is extraordinarily dangerous.
  If nobody paid taxes society would be in the control of the rich.
  
  “Taxes are the price we pay for a civilized society” Oliver Wendell Holmes Jr.
  
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  September 9, 2020 4:33pm
I remember when

Eric Crampton; TV one at Noon.
“One uninformed vote may not mean much but, a lot of uninformed voters can make a difference.”
Didn’t really say that but it may be one interpretation.
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September 9, 2020 12:34pm
RW Capitalist

I see Labour are promising to raise the top rate of tax.
Historical references.
https://www.thelocal.fr/20150807/are-taxes-behind-rise-in-exodus-of-rich-french
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o9QczCdt2WY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o9QczCdt2WY
In the 60’s there was an exodus of the rich, when they raised the top tax rate.
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September 9, 2020 12:34pm
- MCos
  
  Back in the 80s or thereabouts the top marginal tax rate was 60% or more, which was paid by the likes of me, not a big income income earner.
  Ace Minister of Finance Muldoon in the National Govt. was responsible for that jaw dropping rate. The money was needed to pay for his super generous election bribe, the National Superannuation, which has since been much watered down.
  
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  September 9, 2020 4:16pm
  - Tall Man
    
    No gst, no petrol tax, full education costs covered, no unreasonable waiting lists at hospitals, tax deductible super costs and so on.
    
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    September 9, 2020 8:53pm
Grey Skills

Another petty envy tax from Labour strikes again. Shades of Helen Clarke 1999. “Let’s hit those who are paying the most tax now. Our followers will be impressed.”
11 2
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September 9, 2020 12:42pm
I remember when

Perhaps Winston was hoping for something more along the lines of:
Winston lights up the NZ First Election Campaign.
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September 9, 2020 12:42pm
RW Capitalist

and more of those predictors, that couldn’t predict they’d get wet if they were standing in the rain.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G87UXIH8Lzo
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September 9, 2020 12:49pm
Tall Man

“But the students argued it “has impacted our ability to focus adequately on our studies”, National Review reports.”

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/world/2020/09/us-professor-suspended-for-saying-chinese-phrase-n-i-ge-after-students-complain-it-sounded-like-the-n-word.html

Spare me.
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September 9, 2020 1:03pm
- graham
  
  If these students are serious when they claim that “our mental health has been affected” and that it “has impacted our ability to focus adequately on our studies” – when they HEAR A WORD – then they should be bounced out of the university.
  
  If that’s all it takes to make them lose focus, I would seriously doubt their ability to complete a degree course.
  
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  September 9, 2020 3:13pm
- graham
  
  (Ran out of edit time …)
  
  According to the University website:
  
  Incoming first-year students demonstrate superior academic performance — and the potential to do more. Most admitted students are ranked in the top 10 percent of their graduating class, and their median standardized test score is in the top 5 percent.
  
  To me, suddenly losing your ability to focus adequately on your studies because a lecturer SAID A WORD that you don’t like, does not showcase your “Superior academic performance”.
  
  My daughter completed her degree in Auckland last year, and I know that there were some occasions when she was on placement where she felt one of her supervisors gave her a hard time – nitpicking and implying she wasn’t capable of doing a good job. Whether the criticism was justified or not is irrelevant; the point is my daughter struggled with it for several weeks while working with the supervisor. But far from using it as an excuse, she just gritted her teeth and persevered. And she continued on to pass all her final exams.
  
  I know some people these days object to being called a snowflake, but gee – if the cap fits …
  
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  September 9, 2020 3:31pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Grief…
  he was lecturing in “Business Communication”, explaining the use of “filler words” in different languages.
  
  https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2020/09/08/professor-suspended-saying-chinese-word-sounds-english-slur
  
  Must be many better jobs around than lecturing to a bunch of dolts.
  
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  September 9, 2020 4:46pm
  - fernglas
    
    Jacinda quite likes it
    
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    September 9, 2020 7:00pm
Libertarians are right

So, back when Cunliffe announced that they would make the top tax rate and the trust rate the same, John Key basically slow clapped him.

A few years on and Labour have forgotten that lesson. Sure there are some high personal contribution businesses (doctors etc) where most of the income will still have to go through to the owners but farms and many other businesses will be able to keep their income over $160k in their Trust if they have one.
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September 9, 2020 1:19pm
greenfinger

Even a person with brain the size of a pea knows higher income taxes will shrink the economy. Many, like me, will definitely consider spending 183 days in Bermuda and remote access from there when the tax rate goes to 39%. Catch us if you can, Princess! The only ones that are left to pay your taxes will be your champagne socialists fans. Good luck with that! It didn’t end so well for auntie Helen the last time she tried to do that. Your winter of discontent moment is approaching….sooner than you think.
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September 9, 2020 1:23pm
- alloytoo
  
  I suspect the people who will be most effected by this will be all the government’s cronies in local government.
  
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  September 9, 2020 2:03pm
- oob
  
  Some notes for you greenfinger:
  
  1. You can be non-tax resident if you reside outside of NZ for 183 days of any 12 month period.
  
  2. Note (1) does not apply to a calendar year or a financial year, it applies to any contiguous 12 month period.
  
  3. For appearances sake you need to be seen to have disassociated yourself from NZ, such as closing bank accounts and cancelling credit cards. If you run a lot of your business through NZ banking institutions, IRD will snag you.
  
  4. It doesn’t need to be Bermuda or any other tax haven. A better approach is to spend 180 days in NZ, 180 days in Oz, with a few days on the beach in Bali between crossings.
  
  5. “Nomad Capitalism” is the search term to use if you want to research this topic in more detail.
  
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  September 9, 2020 2:08pm
- Ian Boag
  
  Assuming you have a taxable income in NZ of (say) $300k this tax change will cost you about $7k a year. Makes moving to Bermuda worth every penny. If your taxable income is higher than that I am perplexed to understand why you piss around on a right wing blog and hide behind a pseud.
  
  Either way good on you. Enjoy Bermuda – the family will love keeping up with you on Zoom ….
  
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  September 9, 2020 4:43pm
  - greenfinger
    
    You are right, i wouldn’t bother IF I am on $300k…
    
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    September 9, 2020 5:16pm
greenfinger

Higher taxes is the beginning of the end. The start of the economic rot for NZ. This will drive out higher earners in NZ and collapse foreign investment in this country. Robertson who has never done an honest day of work has zero idea how the economy works.
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September 9, 2020 1:42pm
Jack5

You think New Zealand’s PC? Consider a phrase the Woke mob in Canada think needs to be put to sleep…

This is from a Canadian web site article headlined “A Guide to Bullshit, Power-Serving Journalism Phrases.”

The Journalists for Human Rights’ Style Guide For Reporting On Indigenous People states, “Do not use ‘Canada’s Indigenous people’ to describe the Indigenous people that are in the country. It is paternalistic and implies Canada owns Indigenous people.”

It also instructs journalists to, “Avoid using ‘Indigenous Canadians,’ ‘Native Canadians’ and the like. Many Indigenous people, specifically First Nations and Métis, identify as being nations within a nation. Many First Nations have signed treaties, which by definition are agreements between sovereign nations.”

Instead, journalists should use the phrase “Indigenous people in Canada” where it’s applicable, and be more specific wherever possible.

The writer also has advice on stating “protesters clashed with” when, the writer says, it might be police attacking protesters.

https://readpassage.com/a-guide-to-bullshit-power-serving-journalism-phrases/
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September 9, 2020 2:39pm
surfing

Did one know that it is now necessary to hire cultural advisors on certain civil engineering projects.

Going rate appears to be close to $50/ hour, on jobs that run 24/7.

Said cultural advisors tend to sit in smoko room doing not much at all.

Oh yes, and a cultural advisor is not allowed to be white.
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September 9, 2020 3:34pm
- Tauhei Notts
  
  Can a mother of two Maori children be a cultural adviser? Particularly if that woman is the daughter of a refugee.
  Just asking.
  
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  September 9, 2020 8:54pm
Inandout

Plunkett is having a lively debate around Christians but he skirted around Islam by mentioning the 72 virgins, which I understand is a lure used by Isis for recruits; not believed so much by Muslims. Despite his bravado he obviously finds Christians are a softer target, and he gets to keep his head intact.
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September 9, 2020 4:01pm
- cmm
  
  Actually it is far more sinister than 72 virgins.
  
  What it really says is you get 2 virgins and 70 concubines who were the wives and concubines of the defeated enemy.
  
  For these purposes, the “enemy” are anyone they choose to see as standing in the way of Islam- eg the West. and the females of the West are thus to be taken as sex slaves.
  
  So, ladies, they aren’t talking about abstract things like virgins. They’re talking about YOU!
  
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  September 9, 2020 5:22pm
greybeard

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/all-blacks/122697457/from-16-pies-in-one-sitting-to-diet-overhaul-asafo-aumua-on-his-return-to-the-all-blacks
So: this 16-year-old eats 16 pies in one sitting.
Who paid for these 16 pies ? Not him I presume. Afetr all, he was only 16.
From whence did he get these 16 pies for this one meal ?
Who was it decided that this 16-year old needed lots of pies for breakfast ?
And as it was a 16-pie BREAKFAST , who was it who went out and bought at least 16 pies for this one child ?
How many more of the Aumua children had pies for breakfast on this day ? And how many did they eat ?
Are pies the normal breakfast food for the Aumua family ?
How many pies were consumed on that day by the whole Aumua family ?
How many pies have been bought by the Aumua family in the last week / month / year ?
These are important questions, because the answers may have a direct influence on the selection of All Black hookers.
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September 9, 2020 4:36pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  Concern noted.
  
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  September 9, 2020 6:31pm
Maggie Pie

Yes, heard a bit of that. He had no probs with ‘The Virgin Mary in a Condom’, but ask for his views on a Moozie pedo and he runs a mile!
Fat wuss 😀
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September 9, 2020 5:14pm
cmm

Poor JLR just can’t get a break.

First National turn out to be dodgy people that gave him a bad name, now Advance NZ.

Terrible luck for such a nice fellow…
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September 9, 2020 5:15pm
- RJ
  
  Imagine in the private sector you have to ban a male from going in certain areas of the business to protect female employees. They’d be fired so fast. Strange that an MP can face that and we don’t have the ability to tell the creep to F off and not come back without an election to keep him out. Sorry ladies, but your safety is not important in parliament.
  
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  September 9, 2020 6:41pm
MCos

Tweet of the day, boys and girls
https://twitter.com/hjr_bae/status/1300294082233761794?s=21
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September 9, 2020 7:06pm

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