General Debate 12 October 2020

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mikenmildagain

Today is the anniversary of the First Battle of Passchendaele. I was going to write a short piece, but the summary below from the NZ History website does it better than i could:
Ever since 1917, Passchendaele has been a byword for the horror of the Great War. In terms of lives lost in a single day, the failed attack on Bellevue Spur on 12 October was probably the greatest disaster in New Zealand’s history.
Eight days earlier, around 500 New Zealanders died during the capture of Gravenstafel Spur, one of two spurs on the ridge above the village of Passchendaele in Flanders, Belgium. Although this attack was successful, it had a tragic aftermath. The British High Command mistakenly concluded that the number of German casualties meant enemy resistance was faltering and resolved to make another push immediately.
An attack on 9 October by British and Australian troops was to open the way for II ANZAC Corps to capture Passchendaele on the 12th. The plan failed. Without proper preparation and in the face of strong German resistance, the 9 October attack collapsed with heavy casualties.
The New Zealanders nevertheless began their advance at 5.25 a.m. on the 12th. The preliminary artillery barrage had been largely ineffective because thick mud made it almost impossible to bring heavy guns forward, or to stabilise those that were in position. Exposed to raking German machine-gun fire from both the front and the flank, and unable to get through uncut barbed wire, the New Zealanders were pinned down in shell craters. Another push scheduled for 3 p.m. were postponed and then cancelled.
The troops eventually fell back to positions close to their start line. For badly wounded soldiers lying in the mud, the aftermath of the battle was a private hell; many died before rescuers could reach them. The toll was horrendous: 843 New Zealand soldiers were either dead or lying mortally wounded between the front lines.
On 18 October, Canadian troops relieved II ANZAC Corps. In a series of well-prepared but costly attacks in atrocious conditions, they finally occupied the ruins of Passchendaele village on 6 November. The offensive had long since failed in its strategic purpose and the capture of Passchendaele no longer represented any significant gain.
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October 12, 2020 8:00am
- Tony Stuart
  
  Thanks for that mikenmild. Lest we forget.
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:48am
  - Dave Mann
    
    Hear hear!
    
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    October 12, 2020 8:50am
- plc
  
  My great uncle, Patrick Costello (then aged 37) died from wounds received at Passchendaele. Two cousins from the same Day family (from Northland) also died in the battle….one 47, the other 26.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:02am
- Barry
  
  A gunner perspective on the battle:
  The New Zealand Division was called in at short notice to join the 5th Army, two months into the third battle of Ypres. The NZ Division had just successfully captured Messines on June 7 in a classic, almost impeccable divisional attack. The Division had attacked two Brigades up on a 1500 yard front. The covering barrage was 2000 yards deep in 20 lifts over two hours and 12 minutes. The barrage had 114 18 pounder field guns, 36 4.5 inch howitzers, plus the Corps heavy guns and howitzers. The 18 pounder’s did the creeping barrage, the howitzers were on special tasks or superimposed, and the heavies were on a standing barrage in depth behind the town. With an H-hour at 0310, Messines was captured at 0500, exactly on time.
  
  It is for this exemplary attack, that the New Zealanders were called in to the 5th Army in early October. There were real problems on the battlefield as it started raining in July, repeated itself for the last half of August, and then rained for most of September and October. The positions our gunners occupied were waterlogged and badly cratered, and under counter bombardment and gas attack. The enemy frontline was 800 m away.
  
  For the first 5th Army attack on October 4 gun ammunition was 960 rounds per gun and 760 for the howitzers. This divisional attack was successful despite strong opposition. The barrage was good, all objectives were captured, and 1000 German prisoners taken.
  
  However, roads were impassable and pack animals were the only option for gun resupply. Most of the guns that were moving forward for the next attack on 12 October became stranded in the mud by October 8. Movement and re-supply were a serious problem.
  
  By 1600 on October 11 the Division had managed to get only eight guns and four howitzers to the new positions – all without platforms. And this was on the afternoon before the attack.
  
  The CRA of the New Zealand division reported to Division and Corps that the New Zealand artillery could not be relied upon for the attack due early on the next day.
  
  Nevertheless the 5th Army pressed on with the plans for the attack, which was launched at 0525 on October 12.
  
  It was a disaster – the attack failed on uncut wire and pillboxes before it reached the first objective. New Zealand lost 2730 killed or wounded in the two assaulting Brigades.
  
  The reasons for the failure were:
  • a very weak barrage due to not getting guns into position
  • deep and continuous belts of uncut enemy wire due to the weak barrage
  • massive German concrete block houses which were new to the Flanders battlefield
  • weather and mud.
  
  On the formed tracks infantry were able to make 1 mile per hour; off the tracks it was four hours per mile for the infantry.
  
  In the Passchendaele attack our Division was supported by 144 18 pounder’s and 48 howitzers. But most of them were not in action for the attack. Those that were quickly sank up to the axles in the mud and became inoperable.
  
  By October 20, 10 days after the Divisional artillery started deploying for the 12 October attack, only two thirds of the guns had managed to make it up to the original battle positions. Most of those guns had been man hauled forward.
  
  It was the New Zealand Division’s only major defeat in the war. The greatest impact on the defeat was inadequate artillery support.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:24am
  - 103PapPap
    
    My Grandad was at the Battle of Messines in June 1917. He only arrived in May and this was his first actual battle. He got gassed and was repatriated back to England.
    I only found this out by getting his war records and matching them against various war history accounts – he never talked about it.
    
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    October 12, 2020 3:46pm
- lastmanstanding
  
  My Grandad fought there and at the Somme with the Canterbury Mounted Rifles. WW1 was he second time in action as he also fought in the Boer War in South Africa.
  Grandad got gassed mustard gas and had breathing problems for the rest of his days.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:41am
  - Charmaine Hawke
    
    My Granddad was part of the Artists Rifles and one of the very few survivors of counter attack on Welsh ridge where 68 of 80 men died. He never spoke of what happened in either letters or later in life and in a tragic irony he could see WW2 coming so took his wife to the :”safety” of Shanghai, where in the 30’s he had to flee with his wife, 3 sons and mistress (don’t ask) in to Rhodesia. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Over_the_Top_(painting)
    
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    October 12, 2020 10:01am
  - Swifty
    
    My mother’s father fought on the Somme, lastmanstanding, and he had not insignificant mental health problems for the remainder of his life including stints in Porirua.
    
    I get the Second War, it was more in my view a case of right versus wrong – but the First has always just seemed to me a colossal waste and for the sole shitty reason of squabbling dying empires.
    
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    October 12, 2020 10:22am
    - Mike
      
      I don’t agree with that. Some have tried to argue that a German victory might have led to a version of the European Union. I think it is more instructive to look at the kind of rule the Germans imposed on the occupied parts of Belgium, France and Russia.
      
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      October 12, 2020 12:03pm
      - Swifty
        
        I agree that German expansionism was at fault both times,
        
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        October 12, 2020 12:46pm
- rouppe
  
  I watched Peter Jackson’s film “They Shall Not Grow Old” last night.
  
  Astonished to discover 15 year old boys – my son’s current age – being allowed to sign up.
  
  The conditions more appalling than I originally thought.
  
  An awful, awful period
  
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  October 12, 2020 10:34am
  - Inandout
    
    rouppe, terrible yes, but many more people killed in WW2, especially Europe. And the Dresden incendiary bombs created appalling civilian deaths; a hell on earth.
    
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    October 12, 2020 2:46pm
- Don Beckett
  
  Thank Mike for that. My grandfather was at Passchendaele – was wounded there and sent back to Blighty, then home. He had survived WW I from the first day on Galipoli where he landed with his to be brother in law on the afternoon of that first day 25th.April 1915. Uncle Nick got wounded and evacuated a couple of months later. My G/F Don Piper was wounded but not enough to be evacuated, and stayed till the end of the campaign.
  They both were sent to France at the various theatres, and finally Passchendaele. When he came home in early 2018 and married my Grandmother, he brought the Spanish ‘flu with him. He had only a mild dose, but my G/M had it quite seriously and was pregnant with my mother. When mum was born in October 1918 she was covered with black blotches, and they thought she was going to die, but obviously survived, as did my G/M.
  And we think we’ve got it tough with Covid !!!
  
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  October 12, 2020 11:08am
Happychappy

There is a lot of people in New Zealand that believe Jacinda Ardern our Prime Minister lives and campaigns on tragedy, well when you have someone like Dr Mazher Iqbal helping by telling Jacinda Ardern that his community would vote Labour it is not hard to understand her reasons for doing it.
But you would have to be worried about the future when you also know that it is understood that there is those that want more, and Dr Mazher Iqbal stand in promoting Islam has helped with the Doctor, thanking Ardern for personally supporting the Muslim Community since March 15 2019.
https://www.newsroom.co.nz/jacinda-is-the-message.
Wasn’t this the same sort of electioneering Winston Peters has done for the last decade with Muslims and the Maori population.
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October 12, 2020 8:01am
- cmm
  
  It works because all these “special people” have been told to look after their own interests, while the majority – people of European descent – have been told that it is immoral and sinful to look to their own needs.
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:20am
  - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
    
    Yeah and the European bros vote in drove Labour. Go figure.
    
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    October 12, 2020 10:41am
  - Brian McDonald
    
    NZ might not be the place for you cmm? Nothing is keeping you here.
    
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    October 12, 2020 11:03am
    - raven
      
      Hi Brian, you’re sounding like Donald Trump!
      
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      October 12, 2020 12:42pm
- giltee
  
  And then at the bottom of the newsroom article they have their hand out for money. Isn’t 50 million enough? Adern is as genuine as New Zealand souvenirs made in China
  
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  October 12, 2020 10:41am
- Brian McDonald
  
  So you believe Muslims should not be allowed to vote how they want? Or if they can they shouldn’t be allowed to say it.
  Crikey.
  
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  October 12, 2020 10:53am
  - leftard
    
    I believe imports should be alowed to influence our country.
    Maybe 2nd generation (born in nz) should vote but new arrivals that have just got PR etc nup, and that applies to any arrivals from anywhere in the world.
    
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    October 12, 2020 11:40am
    - Paulus
      
      Only New Zealand Citizens should be allowed to vote in General Elections and named Ratepayers in Local Elections.
      
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      October 12, 2020 1:40pm
  - alloytoo
    
    Are they voting as they want, or are they voting as Dr Mazher Iqbal wants?
    
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    October 12, 2020 11:41am
krazykiwi

So Ardern wants “the state housing waiting list to be zero by 2030 and child poverty to be halved”.

Well I want a gold-plated Rolls Royce with a trailer load of unicorns. And a pony.

Her banality seem to know no limits. It’s all messaging and aspirations and then, only if forced to, throwing someone under the bus when predictably nothing is delivered.

And NZers want this petulant child at the helm? Incredible.
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October 12, 2020 8:01am
- Suze Wainwright
  
  Heh, she calls National’s ‘misinformation’ on a wealth tax, while James Shaw makes it abundantly clear that the Greens plan to use their leverage in the next Govt.
  
  Good on Shaw for being honest, I guess…
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:05am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    The cannabis referendum aims to get the youth vote and Grrrns. A byproduct is a new tax! They tried to copy the California model but that’s not working either with dealers going broke.
    Here the gangs are going to jump for joy as they will carry on as unofficial suppliers of whatever. Mr Plod will be nonplussed as usual and home growers will become their new victims.
    
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    October 12, 2020 8:57am
    - Engelbert Humperdink
      
      Mr Plod is not nonplussed. Mr Plod is sheerly skeered of taking on armed-up ethnic drug cartels and much prefers to send tooled-up squads charging at kids with toy guns and family men at dinnertime.
      
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      October 12, 2020 11:40am
  - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
    
    Shaw will sell all his policies down the river to get a cabinet berth. He is not worried about the unwashed hippies who vote for his party.
    
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    October 12, 2020 10:43am
  - Brian McDonald
    
    Of course the Greens will use their leverage if they are in a coalition, that’s what it is about. But Shaw has said the wealth tax is not a bottom line and JA ruled it out of Mike Hoskings show this morning.
    
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    October 12, 2020 11:12am
  - alloytoo
    
    I was wondering about Greens Tax policy.
    
    The Russel Norman (Green) school of economics holds that the government should just print the dosh it needs.
    
    Why do the Greens need a tax policy then?
    
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    October 12, 2020 11:43am
    - Ehlana
      
      Because, alloytoo, if the government takes your money and prints money it will have more money than if it just prints money.
      Besides, having money is evil and evildoers should have their money taken from them…but…if the government has all the money, that makes the government evil, so it should have the money taken off it too…
      Vote Act to save the Greens from becoming evil?
      
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      October 12, 2020 2:21pm
      - alloytoo
        
        Bizarrely that makes more sense that Green’s tax policy.
        
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        October 12, 2020 4:07pm
  - Surely Knott
    
    Newshub is running more anti – national articles on Judith and Labour’s Wealth Tax.
    
    The logic is essentially – Labour has ruled out the wealth tax so therefore it is misleading for Judith to be campaigning about one potentially happening under a Labour government. Under this logic isn’t it also misleading for Greens to be campaigning on something that Labour has completely ruled out, when the Greens have stated they will only go with Labour. Why haven’t the Greens been taken to task for running a misinformation campaign.
    
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    October 12, 2020 5:08pm
- Bell-47
  
  So, all you need is the gold plated rolla, a trailer and some unicorns because we already have the pony..
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:05am
  - Engelbert Humperdink
    
    Well, I cannot see a pony, but the COL has certainly covered our land with a thick layer of political horse droppings…
    
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    October 12, 2020 11:41am
- cmm
  
  It is very possible to gold plate a Rolls Royce.
  It might even be possible to find a trainer load of unicorns.
  
  But poverdee isn’t ever going to be cured and there is very little incentive to do so because it is a fake problem that people can pretend to be concerned about.
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:08am
  - Mr_Blobby
    
    Interesting the over 6000 doctors etc have signed an anti lockdown petition.
    
    The disgraced WHO have flip flopped again saying no to government lockdowns as the other costs are just to high.
    
    Will our government now admit that our lockdowns were a result of our failures not our successes.
    
    Our preoccupation with the number to the exclusion of everything else was wrong.
    
    Look it just saw a unicorn walk past my window.
    
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    October 12, 2020 8:32am
    - krazykiwi
      
      .
      
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      October 12, 2020 9:01am
    - krazykiwi
      
      “Will our government now admit that our lockdowns were a result of our failures not our successes”
      
      This goes to the heart of the abject failings of our leaders. They are human. We are human. We all make decisions based on the synthesis of the data we have available at the time, and any hidden agendas.
      
      It often happens that with the benefit of new data (or those hidden agendas becoming exposed), these decisions are shown to be poor, wrong and worthy of change.
      
      True leaders have the humility to reflect and change direction, using the new data and the new environment.
      
      But not our leaders. Theirs is a double-down strategy to desperately avoid having to admit they made any ‘mistakes’, and in the current environment the subsequent cost on individuals, societies and humanity itself is incalculable.
      
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      October 12, 2020 9:04am
      - Swifty
        
        Hear hear.
        
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        October 12, 2020 9:08am
      - Brian McDonald
        
        True leaders front up use and their own names krazy, everyone of them has in this election, like them or lump them Winston thrugh to Ross – but you can criticise them all you like from your rabbit hole – it’s free.
        That’s something they share, having the guts (or maybe stupidity in some cases) to have a go.
        I say good on them and may the best person(s) win.
        
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        October 12, 2020 11:21am
      - info@cruzpro.com
        
        I agree 100%. When detailed information about Covid-19 was lacking our leader made a judgement call to lock down (later than sooner). I can’t blame that action since no-one really knew what to do and people seemed to be dieing in large numbers.
        
        Later when more information became available the lockdown should have been lifted and that was not done. In fact, Auckland was put into another death spiral lockdown with all the negative economic results.
        
        New Zealand is not done with this virus. It is my belief that we are still very vulnerable and it will come back in large numbers. Hopefully it is not as deadly as we originally feared.
        
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        October 12, 2020 11:43am
      - Michael Duke
        
        Brian McDonald I too use my real name on this blog and agree with everything KK posted so are you now going to come at me?
        
        It was obvious that the level 4 lockdown was an overreaction to not closing the border soon enough because the Princess wanted her moment in the press on the 15th of March.
        
        So ego and vanity and then over-react to cover.
        
        As always with Jacinda it is style over substance.
        
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        October 12, 2020 2:53pm
      - krazykiwi
        
        “True leaders front up use and their own names krazy”
        
        Once again you are quite confused, Brian. This is a discussion forum, not a leadership beauty contest.
        
        Conflating the two in a ham-fisted attempt to land a blow just makes you look silly.
        
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        October 12, 2020 4:26pm
    - freemark
      
      Is this news why Ardern exhorted everyone to vote early? Why have Souxsie, Hendy & Baker gone so quiet?
      If any of our so called journalists had a shred of integrity they would be asking when Ardern etc knew about this advice.
      
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      October 12, 2020 9:06am
    - Jimmy White
      
      Sure it wasn’t a Pig smoking a cigar.
      
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      October 12, 2020 9:28am
    - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
      
      Lockdown is Cindy’s only weapon and Sheeple enthusiastically support lockdown and clap their hands when lockdown is lifted without realising the economic damage caused by lockdown.
      
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      October 12, 2020 10:46am
  - Loddenthinks
    
    Yes indeed – using the current definition of poverty it is statistically impossible to eliminate poverty.
    
    “… households that make less than 60 per cent of the median disposable income. ” It means no matter how rich the country is and no matter how high the median household we will always have a class of people that are described as living in poverty.
    
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    October 12, 2020 1:37pm
- Justitia
  
  All Hooey, no dooey. If Kiwis believe this garbage they deserve the catastrophe that awaits them. Both Labour and the Greens are focused on dividing up an ever-diminishing pie into ever smaller pieces. With their climate change delusion they are hostile to growth and increasing productivity. Their goal is total control of the minutiae of our lives.
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:11am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  And NZers want this petulant child at the helm?
  
  Indeed, many do.
  
  Just as most kiddie-winkles love hearing a nice story before they go beddie-byes, many folks want to believe they have a leader who will banish their demons and lead them into a more prosperous life.
  
  These folks aren’t interested in hearing tales of austerity and sweat and woe in the years to come.
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:12am
  - Suze Wainwright
    
    Isn’t it the Faraway Tree…?
    
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    October 12, 2020 8:23am
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      That’s a great analogy…
      
      Labour folks are probably thinking that they are being led to the “Land of Take-What-you-want” or ‘The Land of Do-as-you-please”, but we know we are going to end up in “The Land of Dame Slap”.
      
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      October 12, 2020 9:09am
      - sooty
        
        But you are not allowed to slap the kiddies anymore!
        You will just have to give them some dope when you put them to bed!
        
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        October 12, 2020 9:18am
      - leftard
        
        Sooty they will slap the lil kids because rules and laws apply only to us peasants.
        
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        October 12, 2020 9:36am
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        @sooty…
        
        Correct..
        The new editions of the Faraway Tree have Dame Snap.
        https://www.theguardian.com/books/2014/oct/22/childrens-classics-faraway-tree-enid-blyton
        
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        October 12, 2020 11:17am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    I shudder thinking about next year. It will take the most skilled economic management that this COL has no concept about. They may not last more than 12 months as govt.
    Even the USA is on standby for a massive recession. If these thing come to pass elsewhere we will not be able to close our borders to the fallout. Our house prices are propped up with cheap money from international credit creation. We also trade. Milk powder may be OK now but in six months time?
    
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    October 12, 2020 9:05am
    - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
      
      Kev – Robber will borrow like anything and keep Sheeple happy. Nobody will notice anything
      
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      October 12, 2020 10:49am
      - Engelbert Humperdink
        
        I am not convinced that the lenders of last resort will keep lending to a bankrupt collection of small islands at the far side of the world mismanaged by a coterie of failed communist corrupt racists, a country with little intellectual productivity and huge shipping costs when exporting not much more than basic foodstuffs and wood…
        
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        October 12, 2020 11:44am
      - KevO'Brien
        
        What about savage increases to the cost of living to come?
        When the rest of the world stop lending aren’t interest rates in for a hike too? The MOF should be aware of these potential problems, but you don’t meet them as a Uni Cafe Accounting Assistant.
        
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        October 12, 2020 12:48pm
- Simon
  
  “the state housing waiting list to be zero by 2030 and child poverty to be halved”.
  
  Currently half of all New Zealanders earn below the median income. This is damning indictment of the failed neolib market reforms of 1980s. Labour will ensure that by 2030, through a fair tax system, all income will be the same.
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:19am
  - leftard
    
    zero?
    
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    October 12, 2020 8:35am
  - theoldbloke
    
    Of course half of NZs earn below the median income!!!!
    You do understand what median is
    Or
    You are using the political trick of preying on voters ignorance of the word median in stirring them up
    
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    October 12, 2020 8:56am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    A damming indictment that half the population earn below the median? Seeing that’s the definition of median you need to join the try-hards.
    
    The tax system is reasonably fair now. It also has to allow for NZ’s relativities with the rest of the world. Now we have Aus cutting their rates and that may force readjustments downwards here too. Taxpayers are mobile; peasants are not.
    
    An amateur govt has no understanding of these practicalities. They have no executive ability and rely on Marxist ideology for a guide. They are not capable of seeing that their model does not work.
    
    Borrow and spend leads to broke and higher prices. The peasants are also crushed through the cost of living while strangely the controlling political masters enjoy an envious lifestyle.
    
    If you believe all income will be the same your’e beyond education.
    
    ☑️☑️Return to Freedom.☑️☑️
    
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    October 12, 2020 9:19am
  - alloytoo
    
    I hope this post is intended as sarcasm.
    
    but the poster isn’t Sir Cullen’s Sidekick….
    
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    October 12, 2020 11:47am
- Jimmy White
  
  I believe her it will happen right after the first billion trees are planted and child poverty is no more.
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:25am
- G152
  
  Didn’t she claim to have child poverty at the top of the ‘to do’ list ????
  If she wanted to solve it why have the numbers grown ??????
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:29am
  - Swifty
    
    And it depends what she means by ‘solve’.
    
    She could ‘solve’ child poverty tomorrow by throwing taxpayer dollars at the families involved but she won’t have ‘solved’ a thing.
    
    She will only have masked it; put a sticking plaster on it, and in doing so made it more attractive for even more people to put their hands out.
    
    It’s only when you’ve got a few decades under your belt or are a student of history that you realise this is the sort of thing that politicians have been saying forever in NZ – and not one of them has even come close to achieving it.
    
    I am supremely confident that this will be yet another Ardern political promise that will come to nothing. But the suckers always fall for it.
    
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    October 12, 2020 8:46am
  - Flossie
    
    It’s Covid dontchaknow…
    
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    October 12, 2020 10:07am
  - oldfella
    
    G152: and Climate Change was Cindy’s Nuclear moment. What’s the 2030 plan for that?
    Guess she’ll get right on to it once she’s got poverdy heading in the right direction.
    
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    October 12, 2020 12:35pm
- Benedict Yu
  
  “the state housing waiting list to be zero by 2030”
  
  Shows ignorance of basic economics. State Housing is essentially ‘free’ to the recipient. The cost to the user is about 15 percent of the cost of providing the house – so close enough to free. There are only two ways to ration a good or service – price or a waiting list. That is why there will ALWAYS be a waiting list for ‘free’ elective surgery. (The flip side is that if you have health insurance you can get it done essentially straight away.)
  
  The chances of a zero waiting list for public housing are the same as a zero waiting list for elective surgery – zero 🙂
  
  Worse, none of the Government’s policies will make the housing market more functional – the opposite will happen. Just to double down, other government policies will make New Zealand poorer, reducing the capacity of a higher share of New Zealanders to buy housing at (distorted) market prices.
  
  So, on current policy settings, the outlook for the public housing waiting list in 2030 will be a dystopian nightmare.
  
  How any rational person can believe such nonsense is beyond me, and deeply troubling.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:13am
  - Ian Boag
    
    (The flip side is that if you have health insurance you can get it done essentially straight away.)
    
    Urban myth.
    
    I wrecked my shoulder at Christmas time. Had an instant ultrasound (ACC) that confirmed it was wrecked. Confirmed to GP that I was going private and got a referral. Got to see an orthopod early in April. Had the surgery in June ..
    
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    October 12, 2020 9:22am
    - Tall Man
      
      Saw my surgeon on the Tuesday, new knee in place the following Thursday. Me not Insurance.
      
      Saw the surgeon Monday morning second knee in place 3 weeks later. My money again but I’m pretty sure Insurance would have been the same result.
      
      Both done this year with 100% success.
      
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      October 12, 2020 9:49am
      - Ian Boag
        
        To clarify some more. The $15k-odd was my money – I paid it and sent the bill to SC after the event. That was the first they heard of it – they paid, although they seemed a bit surprised.
        
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        October 12, 2020 10:37am
      - MCos
        
        I had a hip replacement in Bangkok that I paid for about 20 years ago because it was a preexisting condition since birth.
        Bad luck for me, but what a difference; once it settled down six months later.
        Sometimes I’ve read about how much some poor sods without cover have had to pay in the US.
        I also paid for treatment for a dvt. That cost a lot. I should have gone to a more economical hospital. I knew it was going to be expensive when I noticed chilled fruit juice gratis in the waiting area! One syringe of clexane was $50 at the hospital. At the chemist it was $18. I needed 2/day for a week. Here they are $5/ prescription.
        
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        October 12, 2020 11:54am
    - Bob
      
      Without access to Private surgery, you would still be waiting for the public system, unless your shoulder had actually parted company with your body.
      
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      October 12, 2020 9:59am
      - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
        
        Then it would be nine years of neglect.
        
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        October 12, 2020 10:50am
    - Paulus Gnome
      
      Saw an orthopod during lockdown Ian!
      
      Didn’t you do well!
      
      Saw an orthopod last September, called Southern Cross and had a double knee replacement a month later.
      
      Get better health insurance perhaps Ian or avoid the covid busy season . . .
      
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      October 12, 2020 10:12am
      - Ian Boag
        
        Sorry – to clarify. This was about 5 years ago. I am a long time SC member.
        
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        October 12, 2020 10:23am
    - leftard
      
      Depends on the number of surgeons that specialise in it.
      
      Anytime Ive gone private Ive got in for surgery in 10-14days vs 9month plus public wait time. You just had bad luck.
      
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      October 12, 2020 10:36am
    - RoboRob
      
      Had a hernia. GP said two years on the waiting list and that I was lucky as if I was older it would almost certainly not happen at all. Had health insurance, contacted s surgeon two days later had operation a week later. The week before Christmas!
      
      Mostly the waiting list for public is to do with demand vs supply of money. I guess for certain things (like yours), supply of professionals comes into it as well. I guess if you had gone public your wait would have been even longer as most specialists do something like 2 days public and 3 days private.
      
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      October 12, 2020 11:52am
- RJ
  
  I believe she can accomplish it the same way she has accomplished the housing shortage, stop taking any offical records of it and it will be gone
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:17am
fernglas

Despising Trump as I do, on a purely personal level because he is a boorish, shallow oaf and on a political level because he lacks vision and principle, I thought the TDS so fondly referred to by readers of this blog was a myth. Until he caught Covid. Suddenly I realised that many journalists have abandoned any pretence of impartiality where he is concerned. When he breezed through Covid, he was accused of downplaying the virus. He is, in fact, living proof that it is no worse than seasonal flu, albeit without a vaccine. When he says, as he just has, that he is now immune, it is pointed out that there have been numerous cases of reinfection (by the Independent). That is wrong. The most recent study I found reported a total of six. Out of nearly forty milion, and even then, the scientists can’t be sure. If he is not now immune (as he says, he doesn’t know how long for) then why are we ruining our economy and society by waiting for a vaccine? A vaccine can do no more than the virus itself. I am not going down the path of whether his quack treatments are efficacious or not, but there has to be room now to doubt scientists who say they are not. The opposite side of the coin applies in this country, in that Ardern seems protected from any objective assessment of whether her Government’s Covid policies are right and appropriate. When this pandemic turns out to be history’s most expensive and socially disruptive moral panic, I hope that politicians and the media will have the grace to accept that they were wrong. But I doubt it.
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October 12, 2020 8:02am
- Jimmy White
  
  what world do you live on. it’s certainly not Earth
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:26am
- Simon
  
  Even the China WHO have now said lockdowns are worse than the flu. Same position as Trump.
  
  Trump was right again. The bigger picture was always more important that the more narrow concerns around the Wuhan flu.
  
  National could have got ahead of this issue but decided not too. National probably would have as bad running NZ as the UK conservatives.
  
  Now NZ is this loser hermit country scared shitless about a fake flu.
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:27am
  - Mr_Blobby
    
    Lockdowns are a sign of failure not success.
    
    The media focus on who got it more wrong than us not those who did it better than us.
    
    Taiwan, South Korea, Hong Kong and yes Sweden.
    
    Will people wake up that she did not save us only made the whole situation worse, will they accept that they have been conned, I doubt it.
    
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    October 12, 2020 8:38am
    - Bob
      
      The media are going to be the biggest losers this year. Their blind ideological adherence to the Marxist line of this COL has destroyed what credibility the MSM actually still retained with the public as at beginning of 2020; well the cognitively alive element of the public.
      
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      October 12, 2020 10:03am
  - DeepBlue
    
    Simon Bridges had his timing wrong. Unfortunately for him and the country a 5% liking (or whatever it was called) meant he didn’t have the gravitas to push the unpopular message back then.
    
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    October 12, 2020 8:39am
    - KevO'Brien
      
      Are you Labour basement people still cleaning out the intern’s rooms. What a mess.
      
      An accounting is coming.
      
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      October 12, 2020 9:23am
      - DeepBlue
        
        You missed ‘unfortunately for him and the country’ in my comment above. No Labour intern here.
        
        To reiterate … It is often not the message that disrupts a valid approach, but how, who and when the message is delivered. Jacinda, aided by MSM, has this in spades.
        
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        October 12, 2020 9:53am
      - IC5000
        
        > An accounting is coming
        
        Yeah in 2023
        
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        October 12, 2020 3:35pm
  - Wayne Mapp
    
    Simon,
    There was/is zero chance that National could have won by opposing the elimination strategy. That would have appealed to the 10% who follow the views on many commenters here, but would have appalled the other 90%. National would have dropped to low 20’s in the polls.
    
    And as for it being a fake flu, tell that to the families of the 220,000 dead in the US for the 45,000 dead in the UK
    
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    October 12, 2020 8:48am
    - Sigmund Freud
      
      At least the lockdown sceptics were 100% correct and your ideas 100% wrong Wayne.
      
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      October 12, 2020 8:51am
      - Wayne Mapp
        
        Sigmund
        Only in your world has New Zealand’s elimination strategy been 100% wrong. For the 90% of the rest of us, it has been 100% right.
        Mind you I guess you would happy for National to be in the low twenties if that meant ACT was in the high twenties. But I reckon, based on your posts , that Billy Te Kaha might be closer to your view on Covid.
        
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        October 12, 2020 11:59am
      - Critical Thinker
        
        @Wayne Mapp
        
        “Billy Te Kaha might be closer to your view on Covid”
        
        This just shows how insane our main political parties have become. Especially in regards to the idiocracy lockdowns.
        
        The top COVID experts from the World Health Organisation and numerous other world renown epidemiologists (including in NZ) agree more with Billy Te Kaha, than our inept government, that has dug itself into this economy destroying lockdowns. Which they ludicrously keep trying to dig themselves out off ?
        
        “We in the World Health Organisation do not advocate lockdowns as the primary means of control of this virus.”
        https://www.covidplanb.co.nz/manifesto/
        https://gbdeclaration.org/
        
        – Abandon Labour’s strategy of lockdowns at any cost, and the predicted years of continued rolling lockdowns.
        
        – Implement a risk-based approach where vulnerable citizens are protected and supported, but all others are free to continue daily life.
        
        – Repeal the COVID-19 Public Health Response Act to remove powers that override the Bill of Rights.
        
        – Require all documents relied on for ministerial decisions during a crisis or emergency to be released within 48 hours.
        
        – Allow the option to use alternative treatments that have been trialed successfully, and found to be safe in France and the USA.
        
        – Establish an advisory group of epidemiologists independent of the Ministry of Health and World Health Organisation, because MOH and WHO have too many obvious conflicts of interest.
        
        – Conduct an urgent study into the long-term economic, social, and health impacts of lockdowns on NZ.
        
        – Allow for prophylactic/preventative regimens to prevent infection, so our approach is not solely focused on reactive medical treatments.
        https://www.advancenz.org.nz/covid_19_response_policy
        
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        October 12, 2020 12:21pm
    - RJ
      
      And what do we know about the uk Wayne? If you test positive for covid and die within 28 days, it used to be longer, no matter you cause of death it is listed as a covid death. Even if you did not die of covid. And what do we know of the USA figures, basically the same except hospitals are paid far more from the federal govt for covid cases. The figures are not realistic when done like this. Hell when a family have to go to the media to demand their loved one have covid removed from his death certificate because he died in a motor bike accident, you know the figures are shit.
      
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      October 12, 2020 9:22am
    - krazykiwi
      
      Ah yes, your favourite tortured logic: Labour did the right thing because National wouldn’t have done anything different.
      
      A tired, illogical defense delivered by a tired, flip-floppy mandarin.
      
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      October 12, 2020 9:48am
      - Wayne Mapp
        
        National would have had the same strategy anyway. Look at Australia if you want proof. Both ANZAC countries have essentially the same approach.
        
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        October 12, 2020 12:01pm
      - krazykiwi
        
        Wooosh! Straight through to the wicketkeeper
        
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        October 12, 2020 12:40pm
      - Wayne Mapp
        
        Krazykiwi,
        Given that nothing is ever going to change your mind about Covid, that is not much of an insult.
        I will continue to go with Dr Boomfield, Professors Baker, Gluckman, Hendy and Skegg.
        You can stick with Billy Te Kahika.
        
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        October 12, 2020 1:36pm
      - krazykiwi
        
        “Given that nothing is ever going to change your mind”
        
        Quite wrong, Wayne. I use data, evidence and lots of research to form my views, where it appears use the 6 o’clock news… and clowns like Hendy. Hendy? Really? With his 80,000 unfalsifiable death prediction. Give me strength.
        
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        October 12, 2020 4:20pm
    - Random T Person
      
      7500 Americans died every day in 2017 (CDC). How many have died every day since the pandemic started, and how many of those who died of/with COVID, would have died anyway? If we’ve been pandemicing for 200 days, well, a quick calc will tell you that the nominally big number of 200k isn’t that big after all.
      People die. Happens all day every day.
      
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      October 12, 2020 10:06am
      - Critical Thinker
        
        USA is on track for negative excess deaths this year ?
        
        TOTAL U.S. DEATHS – ALL CAUSES:
        
        2018 Total Deaths US: 2,839,205 (237,000/month)
        https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/products/databriefs/db355.htm
        
        2019 Total Deaths US: 2,855,000 (238,000/month)
        https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/provisional-tables.htm
        
        2020 Total Deaths US: 2,130,000 (236,000/month)
        https://data.cdc.gov/NCHS/Weekly-Counts-of-Deaths-by-State-and-Select-Causes/muzy-jte6
        
        2,130,000 + 236,000/month x 3 = 2,838,000
        
        2018: 2,839,000
        2019: 2,855,000
        2020: 2,838,000 ?
        
        Don’t be afraid of Covid. Don’t let it dominate your life. ??
        
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        October 12, 2020 11:48am
    - alloytoo
      
      There is some interesting stats emerging out of Europe apparently in some countries the average age of corona fatalities is higher than the average lifespan of those countries.
      
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      October 12, 2020 11:53am
- flash2846
  
  President Trump actually said ” I might even be immune now….. I don’t know, but I am felling fine”
  Ignore the CNN and MSNBC ‘ hateful editing.
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:27am
- Flossie
  
  I’m not sure it’s correct to say he breezed through it. The resources he had access to, and the new drugs etc certainly not available to your average citizen.
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:29am
  - DeepBlue
    
    I hope Milania is okay.
    
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    October 12, 2020 8:40am
  - AlphaWhiskey
    
    Actually the Right to Try legislation allows anyone to have a go at yet to be released drugs, but I accept your point about actual access
    
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    October 12, 2020 1:33pm
- G152
  
  No doubt you missed the ‘FAKE NEWS label we attach to most news nowadays
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:31am
- Critical Thinker
  
  Good on you Fernglas for waking up ??
  
  I know that it takes a lot of courage and critical intelligence to look at the facts and decipher what is most likely true, while trying to ignore your own biases.
  
  I agree with everything you just said about Trump. He really is a very easy target for the media to inflict derangement syndromes on their consumers, which of course then benefits the media immensely with all the clickbait articles they’re able to create from him.
  
  Fake news is most certainly the enemy of the people.
  
  My awakening moment started during the 2016 election. Up until that point I was a proud Neo-Conservative, and would have voted for Hillary if I was American. Until we all found out through the Wikileak documents that Hillary was corrupt. Of course we now know that the Obama-Biden admin and many other people with power were/are insanely corrupt as well.
  
  TDS is a real thing. Many of my friends and family members, including my own parents believe that he is literally another Hitler and that Jacinda Ardern is the greatest NZ leader ever. Though they can’t point to any of the policies of Trump’s that they truly disagree with or that turned out to be abysmal failures, or point to any actually successful policies of Ardern’s. It’s all about feels over facts.
  
  The moment I fully awakened to how destructive TDS truly is, was during the Turkish incursion into Syria. In which many people called for Trump to use the US military against its NATO ally, in order to defend a Marxist terrorist militia. Which would have been absolutely catastrophic for the region and the world if he had done so.
  https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2019/10/trumps_biggest_disaster.html#comment-2574805
  
  And now this 2020 insanity over WW3 breaking out because Trump killed Iran’s top terrorist general, Democrats incredulous impeachment coup attempt, hysteria over the ridiculously over-hyped virus, insanely off-the-charts toxic identity politics, and the months of fascist BurnLootMurder rioting, just to name a few, solidified the fact the Trump absolutely NEEDS to win this election. Hopefully in a landslide ??
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2qIXXafxCQ
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:58am
Critical Thinker

Coronavirus: WHO backflips on virus stance by condemning lockdowns ?

The World Health Organisation famously created a global panic by announcing the coronavirus had a mortality rate of 3.4%.

But now the WHO have backflipped on this horrific miscalculation and now admit the mortality rate of the Coronavirus is slightly greater than the seasonal flu.

And this past week, after the global economy was decimated, the World Health Organization backflipped again and admitted the lockdowns are a horrible idea.

“We in the World Health Organisation do not advocate lockdowns as the primary means of control of this virus.

Lockdowns just have one consequence that you must never ever belittle, and that is making poor people an awful lot poorer.”
https://amp.news.com.au/world/coronavirus/global/coronavirus-who-backflips-on-virus-stance-by-condemning-lockdowns/news-story/f2188f2aebff1b7b291b297731c3da74
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October 12, 2020 8:02am
- cmm
  
  The manic panic was enabled by those bastard modellers in UK (and all the people that copied their model throughout the work – I am pretty sure our NZ Centre Of Excellence people did that too).
  
  If we had not been fed all the 80,000 will die bullshit then would be have gone headless chook?
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:24am
  - backster
    
    That manic panic will pale as a precursor to that intended in the name of Climate Change. Terror sourced from the same quarter engendered to enable Government by Politburo over a humanity of dependent Serfs
    
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    October 12, 2020 8:53am
  - fernglas
    
    The Government proactive disclosure shows no updated modelling since February. There has been no flexibility or creativity, nor any consideration of proportionality since then. We are stuck with an outdated plan and no sign of anyone having the courage (with the odd exception) to say anything about it.
    
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    October 12, 2020 8:59am
  - Bobba Fret
    
    I’d love to know how Shaun Hendy’s 80,000 will die model worked / what assumptions it made as surely if we did nothing like Sweden, our death toll per capita would be something like theirs. Obviously keeping / advising older people to stay at home etc. would have reduced it further.
    I think it was absolute scare mongering.
    
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    October 12, 2020 9:25am
    - cmm
      
      You can look up the reports explaining how their models work on their website.
      
      Unfortunately they are reluctant to let others actually look at the code.
      
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      October 12, 2020 1:25pm
  - KevO'Brien
    
    They need to update their 1957 Fortran.
    
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    October 12, 2020 9:25am
- Mr_Blobby
  
  Jacinda saved us by going hard and early.
  
  No she fcuked us long and hard and wrecked our economy, impacted our mental health, made health outcomes worse.
  
  Socialism has failed the children.
  
  This happens when your ideology is out of touch with the real world.
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:46am
  - Bob
    
    Adern’s ideology has no relationship to real world economics. Doubtful if she has ever read and understood a managerial business economic report, her Min of Fin. certainly hasn’t.
    
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    October 12, 2020 10:07am
    - Flossie
      
      Maybe they let her cash up in the F&C shop?
      
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      October 12, 2020 11:22am
  - Random T Person
    
    Also handed us a once in a lifetime opportunity to pick a few undervalued stocks and see what happens.
    
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    October 12, 2020 10:08am
  - Ian Boag
    
    Obviously (KBers say so) closing the borders earlier would have been a great idea. An earlier chance to to redeploy all the unemployed tourism/hospo people into fruit picking ….
    
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    October 12, 2020 10:27am
    - UrbanNeocolonialist
      
      Or viewed more rationally: the chance to avoid the 10-20 Billion cost of 9 week lockdown. Closing border was right thing to do then as we didn’t know covid IFR. But labour fucked about lax, late and lazy (Cindy prioritising her profile ahead of NZ’s safety and economy) – and then only because they were threatened by health officials and a group of rich kiwis who threatened to start an advertising campaign against them.
      
      Layabout have done an absolutely shit job of managing Covid – with the added Billions of the second lockdown a direct consequence of their uselessness.
      
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      October 12, 2020 10:58am
- JackRabbit
  
  Exactly as many on here have been saying since the outset.
  
  But this announcement is probably why I’ve been seeing massive Labour adverts on the internet everywhere in the last 2 days urging people to Vote Early and Vote Labour. (Did she want people to vote hard and fast as well?) Probably been 8-10 Labour ads to 1 National ad. Signalling an air of desperation or final push.
  
  Probably knew this was going to come out and wanted to entrap voters while they still thought she was Cinderella, before being revealed as one of the sisters. Anatomy of a scam: scoop up as much traction and loot as you can before the truth comes out.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:19am
  - Bob
    
    May I suggest that this surge of early voting is a response to the voters fear that Adern may impose another lockdown before Polling Day on Saturday; and people don’t want to be saddled with another three years of incompetence, corruption and manipulation.
    
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    October 12, 2020 10:11am
    - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
      
      All early voting is going to Labour according to my spies.
      
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      October 12, 2020 10:53am
      - Observer of Life
        
        And you know that how SCS? Spies in each polling booth???
        
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        October 12, 2020 12:00pm
- ex-golfer
  
  The WHO have had more positions on COVID than the Karma Sutra.
  
  Masks good -> Masks pointless -> masks good.
  It wasn’t China -> it was China -> who knows (excuse the pun).
  Lockdown -> don’t lockdown -> lockdown again.
  
  I wouldn’t trust the WHO to run a cake stall at my kids primary school.
  
  And Queen Jacinda is putting all her faith in a WHO endorsed vaccine – we are all screwed.
  
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  October 12, 2020 10:24am
Natfan08

Which party benefits the most from the high turnout of early voting?
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October 12, 2020 8:06am
- Cinematic
  
  It’s a good question. Which group holds the highest motivation level? Jacinda lovers or those who can see Labour/Greens would be an absolute cluster?
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:34am
- leftard
  
  I was just about to post the same question.
  
  Mr Farrar is it likely that any polls this week will ask that question?
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:38am
- bruceavon
  
  Usually benefits the left.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:11am
  - sooty
    
    How do you know, it’s meant to be secret!
    
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    October 12, 2020 9:23am
    - UrbanNeocolonialist
      
      Because voters are gradually swing right as more time passes. Left anxious to lock in support that is fleeing.
      
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      October 12, 2020 11:01am
      - Isobar
        
        In that sense it is probably good for the Nats to lock in the support early that is otherwise ‘Fleeing’ to Act
        
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        October 12, 2020 12:00pm
  - bruceavon
    
    Sorry I didn’t read your post properly. I thought you said ‘high turnout’. I missed the early voting bit. I would say it wouldn’t benefit anyone. But making it as easy as it is now could mean higher overall voter turnout, which does advantage the left.
    
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    October 12, 2020 11:02am
    - Steve Todd
      
      Given that 100% turnouts are the ideal – aren’t they? – it would be more accurate to say that lower turnouts advantage the Right.
      
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      October 12, 2020 11:20am
- RJ
  
  Neither, unlike normal election people have been told to go our and vote early. I expect come Saturday most who were going to vote would of already
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:30am
- kowtow
  
  I think so many people are doing it now it probably makes no real difference.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:37am
- Steve Todd
  
  Why would any party benefit, or not, for that matter, “from high turnout of early voting?”
  
  What each party is currently receiving, they won’t receive on Saturday; what each party is currently not receiving, they will receive on Saturday.
  
  The support for each party during early voting is very close to their final support. For example, see the 2017 Advance voting figures, here: https://www.electionresults.govt.nz/electionresults_2017/advance-votes.html, and compare the percentages for each party with the overall official result, here: https://www.electionresults.govt.nz/electionresults_2017/index.html.
  
  So, the short answer to your question is, “None”.
  
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  October 12, 2020 10:00am
  - Happychappy
    
    Steve a question on neutrality can you please tell me who controls the Electoral Commission as it seems funny that they have given the Advance NZ Party a warning for towing a trailor past a polling booth and have done absolutely zilch to the Labour Party and their Prime Minister for continually abusing the system with political news on the COVID -19 daily information site telling the public how many cases and the information about the clusters. Whilst I have no interest in the Advance NZ Party or what they stand for when is everyone in NZ Politics going to be playing on a even playing field as at the moment there is one rule for the opposition parties in NZ and no rules for the Prime Minister and Labour.
    https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/electoral-commission-warns-advance-nz-driving-branded-trailer-past-polling-booth?auto=6199558709001
    For two elections now the Electoral Commission have been total failures and Labour has benefited from their poor adherence to the rules, remember slavegate in 2017 well it has got worse this Election and has benefited Labour once more. “Disgraceful”
    
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    October 12, 2020 10:53am
    - Steve Todd
      
      Hi, Happychappy—
      
      The Electoral Commission is an independent Crown entity set up by Parliament. The people who work there are public servants.
      
      The Commission is governed by a board of three members: see https://elections.nz/about/about-the-electoral-commission/electoral-commission-board/.
      
      It sounds to me like it is time you lodged a complaint with the Commission. To do so, see https://elections.nz/contact/.
      
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      October 12, 2020 11:37am
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  Labour and Greens for sure.
  
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  October 12, 2020 10:53am
- RoboRob
  
  Unlike almost everyone else here, I would say Labour and the Greens.
  
  My logic is simple. The left usually polls better than actual turn out. One reason is that left voters might be ‘lazy’ and not get around to voting on the day. If you make it easier to vote, than a Labour / Green voter out doing the shopping at the mall might pop in and vote whereas they might have ‘forgotten’ to do so on election day.
  
  To me, early voting has always felt a bit like then left trying to get their voters out to vote. Where Nat voters would vote rain or shine on the day.
  
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  October 12, 2020 1:20pm
artemisia

The other day there was a brief comment here about shooting poison pellets into wilding pines. There was a social media post from an interest group a few months ago to see if there were suitable private properties for trials. Maybe that idea has progressed.

Reckon if it works there’s a business opportunity there as would have to be cheaper than manual intervention. And fun too for those so inclined.
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October 12, 2020 8:08am
- leftard
  
  Nice idea in theory, it may work for the odd isolated tree but imagine having a box of magic bullets you empty the mag into the trees and once reloaded youve lost where you were shooting.
  At least cutting them down you know whats been done and what hasnt, if you leave just one behind and it seeds it was all for nothing.
  Also many you cant even see from distance, with wilding pines its vital to get them while theyse small prior to first seed set.
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:43am
  - Ian Boag
    
    Not to mention if killed them this way you would be left with a whole pile of dried out kindling ….
    
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    December 12, 2019 9:24am
    - artemisia
      
      From vids I’ve seen they chop, poison the stump and leave the cut tree where it lies.
      
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      October 12, 2020 9:36am
    - oob
      
      That is exactly the case.
      
      Unfortunately the terrain is too steep to make harvesting the dead wildings worthwhile, so we make do with more accessible manuka stands and barter with the neighbours when they drop a macrocarpa.
      
      And the dead wildings do stick out like a sore thumb amongst the rest of the thriving bush.
      
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      October 12, 2020 12:15pm
  - UrbanNeocolonialist
    
    Long term there will be a drone solution. Drop or shoot a pellet of roundup at the tree base.
    
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    October 12, 2020 11:03am
    - leftard
      
      Fail, youve got to cover EVERY needle and growth tip to kill them. You can cut them off an inch above ground and paint round up on the wound and they still grow, theyre in same league as gorse to erradicate.
      
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      October 12, 2020 11:45am
  - oob
    
    It’s not theory it’s actually current practice, and you’re exactly right, leftard. The wilding pines DoC shoots around our place are isolated, and there are few of them.
    
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    October 12, 2020 11:50am
- oob
  
  That post was by me.
  
  Our bach is an extremely remote location (an island) with very steep terrain. DoC has for years controlled the wilding pines by shooting them on the hillside from the foreshore with a rifle, with some sort of poison bullet. I thought it might be cyanide but I’m not sure.
  
  The other interesting thing DoC has done is utilise gorse. Like most Kiwis I was brought up to believe gorse was just a pest.
  
  Not so! Around us the steep terrain was turned over to farming in the 50s for returning soldiers, back when the price of wool made running sheep on terrain that steep economically viable. To turn it back into native bush over the decades gorse was allowed to run wild because:
  
  (a) Apparently it’s really good for improving soil quality and adding nitrates.
  
  (b) Apparently it’s really good at providing shelter for small native trees.
  
  (c) Eventually the natives take over.
  
  I can attest to the efficacy of DoC’s strategy here. Ten years ago the hills around us were covered in gorse, now it’s 99% native bush, some gorse, and a few wilding pines.
  
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  October 12, 2020 11:48am
RRM

Daily reminder that Labour thinks recidivist rapists and murderers spend too long in jail, and need to be let out sooner.
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October 12, 2020 8:09am
- JackRabbit
  
  All targeted with the “promise” of scrapping of the 3 strikes policy to give those inside, who now have a vote, an incentive to vote for Cindy.
  
  Rule #27 of the Marxists rule book. Let criminals out of jail; They will also help form the SA.
  
  Rule #26: Allow criminal gangs to keep their weapons – the ones that law abiding citizens have surrendered. They will help form the SA.
  
  Rule #25: Remove weapons off law abiding citizens. That way they cannot defend themselves against criminals.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:26am
- Bobba Fret
  
  All the prisoners that are able to vote will be voting for their friend Andrew Little
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:31am
Akitio

Very interesting phone call last evening, young woman “representing” Ron Mark, (I’m in the Wairarapa electorate).
Essentially “would you give Ron Mark your candidate vote, he wants to align with National?” Ron “is pissed off he has been dropped from #2 to #5 on the list.”
All rather strange and misguided, I couldn’t be bothered asking if this meant he would immediately resign from Winston first after election and declare as independent.
Seems like a major case of “trough tether syndrome” from the crew of the Titanic.
Bloody good riddance to them all.
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October 12, 2020 8:10am
- sooty
  
  Or will Whinestone dump him at the first opportunity?
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:25am
- Libertarians are right
  
  Just another dishonest attempt to steal votes from the Right and give them to the Left.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:42am
Maggie Pie

The chair of ‘The Press Club’ opened the session with:
“In short, I know absolutely f–king nothing about Jacinda Adhern. Neither would anyone else reading the sort of pleasant garbage, and I think it’s one of the reasons why she’s widely rejected on the right as an MP of little or no substance. What has she achieved?”

Jacinda Adhern took the stage…….

https://twitter.com/GoodWeekendMag/status/1314707464319832072
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October 12, 2020 8:16am
Clyde

After listening half-heartedly to the Moaning Report kind interview with James Shaw this morning, if there was ever a reason NOT to vote Greens it was displayed for all to hear. Insistence on a “wealth tax” as a priority if they are in Government with Labour. And of course their insistence on “settling” that East Polynesian invasion of private land in Auckland. Hard to assess whether the Greens, Maori Party or Jamie Lee Ross are the most divisive and loopy.
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October 12, 2020 8:16am
- DeepBlue
  
  So it it accurate for Judith to keep pushing Wealth Tax a possibility this week, as long as Greens are in the picture. The more Jacinda keeps denying it, the more a tax message sticks in voters minds.
  
  Cheers to all the rats leaving the Green Ship. Some will jump left, others right and some to the under 5%ers.
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:47am
Mobile Michael

I see Ginny Andersen is moaning about her hoardings being vandalised on Stuff. Every hoarding gets vandalised.

We’ve got one on my fence in Hutt South (for the Euthanasia referendum) that has been torn down several times, attacked with paint and had a knife attack.

Should I go to the media, too? Or just accept that there are neanderthal minded people when it comes to freedom of expression and get over it.
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October 12, 2020 8:16am
- Rich Prick
  
  She must be really hated. Labour/Green supporters generally never vandalise their own hoardings.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:12am
  - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
    
    I guess proudly declaring you are a “socialist witch” isn’t going to convert too many undecideds off the fence either?
    
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    October 12, 2020 11:18am
    - artemisia
      
      What was she thinking? ‘Socialist’ or ‘witch’ would be bad enough, but both? Though the headline disappeared pretty fast from the Stuff site front page.
      
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      October 12, 2020 11:32am
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  Ginny Anderson is beautiful. So Hutt sheeple are voting her in droves.
  
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  October 12, 2020 10:56am
  - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
    
    I see Sir C has voted early for the cannabis referendum too!
    
    🙂
    
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    October 12, 2020 11:18am
BeeJay

So, this morning on AM Show Garner uses DFs tweet about the Nobel Peace Prize outcome to state that David Farrar says that Labour will win the election! True colours are coming through this morning on TV 3, rubbishing Judith Collins and National, using Luxon comments to indicate he’s going for National leadership, letting Mike Williams spew his usual anti National poison, and so much more comment out of context! Looks like it’s full on “knock National” this week!
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October 12, 2020 8:19am
- DeepBlue
  
  It is possible they have overdone it and a rebellion may arise from voters thinking the MSM is a third political party.
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:50am
  - leftard
    
    Sheeple dont think like that.
    
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    October 12, 2020 9:44am
- Bobba Fret
  
  Yes TV3 has Duncan Gardner, Patrick Gower and Tova O’Brien who in my opinion are all far left.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:36am
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    Who is Duncan Gardner?
    
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    October 12, 2020 10:35am
    - Bobba Fret
      
      My apologies. I’m not a good typist.
      Garner.
      
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      October 12, 2020 11:04am
  - UrbanNeocolonialist
    
    Tova is a muck raker, targeting politicians of left and right, though with a preference for right, and never bestie Ardern. She’s pretty normal by standards of left biased media
    
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    October 12, 2020 11:10am
- RJ
  
  Sometimes a joke sounds funny to yourself but when you put it out to the world it can be viewed differently. I could easily see how the media have taken what David said as that, but they should of contacted him first for a comment.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:36am
- kowtow
  
  Has Garner been re educated for his Labour , “Couldn’t deliver a letter” quip .
  
  Mustn’t bite the hand that feeds you.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:48am
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  I told you Duncan Garner is a card carrying Labour poodle. DPF’s idiotic late night tweet has done enormous damage to National than the backstabbing Denise Lee.
  
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  October 12, 2020 10:57am
Ruahine

cmm.
“But poverdee isn’t ever going to be cured and there is very little incentive to do so because it is a fake problem that people can pretend to be concerned about”
Just love that statement.
I once heard a statement on a TV program about Cambodia by a local Mekong River fisherman discussing his family’s situation. He said living on the river looked like poverty but it is not misery.
In New Zealand we have so-called poverty pretending to be misery.
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October 12, 2020 8:24am
theoldbloke

Wouldnt it be nice if parliament could only pass laws with a 70%(or think of a number) vote.

This might do away with hastely constructed and uslesslaws.

Polititians in general seem to think they are our Nannies and can fix things by passing laws in a kneejerk to some perceived problem.

I still have to get my head around laws to measure pugging on farms!
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October 12, 2020 8:26am
- leftard
  
  IMO any referendum should also be a 60-70% pass rate too so theres a CLEAR opinion. Brexit style with only a couple of % in it just leads to problems and if held again a week later would likely get a diferent result.
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:48am
- RJ
  
  No, that would be a complete waste of time and money as nothing would ever pass.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:37am
Captain Mainwaring

Election prediction (percentages):

Labour 42
National 34
ACT 10
Green 4
NZF 3
New Conservative 3
TOP 2
Maori 1
Advance NZ 1

14% of votes would be wasted and it would be a National/Act Government.
Unlikely result, but not impossible.
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October 12, 2020 8:27am
- greybeard
  
  I like it. Make it happen.
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:31am
  - Natfan08
    
    unlikely Labour will drop that low, labour dropping to 44% is more likely.
    
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    October 12, 2020 8:50am
    - JackRabbit
      
      The WHO revelationa that lockdown was wrong and that Covid-19 is no worse than the flu, may confirm what many have been silently thinking. All we need is a few percent shift. Even Labour voters are hating her bossy boots posture, especially when it turns out she was wrong according to WHO.
      
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      October 12, 2020 9:34am
      - Flossie
        
        Yeah nah but but…
        
        Yeah! The Christchurch shootings. What about that?!
        
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        October 12, 2020 10:49am
    - 70andstilllearning
      
      Just plugged your 44% , Grn’s at 4.9999* and total waste vote @ 11% into EC calculator. NACT 61 seats, Labour 59 so not impossible if some of National bleeds to NC TOP etc instead of ACT. Key to it is GRn’s just failing to meet hurdle.
      
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      October 12, 2020 11:47am
    - Gazza the Giant
      
      Internal polls already have Labour below 45% in both major parties polls
      
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      October 12, 2020 5:15pm
- DeepBlue
  
  I think the rugby yesterday was the best poll ever. A lot of supporters didn’t turn up on the day and it was a draw.
  
  Low vote turnout for the left and a hung Parliament.
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:53am
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    Shitty weather forecast over the whole country from now until election day. Hopefully the lazy leftards who haven’t voted yet will rather stay inside.
    
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    October 12, 2020 10:08am
    - leftard
      
      HEY im not lazy… Aw crap yea I am, no job no drive sleep in till 9am every day. im not on the dole so im not quite as bad as the average leftard.
      
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      October 12, 2020 10:42am
- MCos
  
  That would give ACT 14 seats with realistically one potential worthwhile minister.
  National 47 minus one for speaker and a single seat majority.
  But wait.
  The Maori Party could win two seats, which would mean 61 all. Even one seat seat could upset the applecart.
  The Nats should have got rid of them when they had a chance.
  
  The big unknown in all this is the million Kiwis living off shore. Usually they give the Greens a boost, but I think it’ll be different this year. Somehow I don’t think the Nats will benefit from that quarter.
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:55am
  - KevO'Brien
    
    The Maori Party are dead. Too much tribal infighting has done them in. The tribes are not cohesive. Their rights to land were decided by battle and matters have still to be evened up.
    
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    October 12, 2020 9:32am
    - MCos
      
      John Tamahiri isn’t a million miles off the pace in Tamaki Makaurau.
      https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/election-2020-new-poll-shows-maori-partys-john-tamihere-in-the-race-for-tamaki-makaurau/WZ7W77XYQIO7WDGFQV6XMV4BYQ/
      
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      October 12, 2020 9:59am
      - Unity
        
        Where is Tamaki Makaurau?!! Surely it isn’t Auckland??!! I’m hearing it every night from Renee when the weather is shown. It is totally irritating and makes me think it is somewhere other than Auckland. Does she not know Maori Language Week has finished? The same goes for Aotearoa. It just doesn’t feel as though she is talking about New Zealand.
        
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        October 12, 2020 4:53pm
- Libertarians are right
  
  You could start by getting the 3% voting for NC to move their vote to National. It’s a stupid risk voting for them. I know they disagree with some policies from National, but they are very much the lesser of two evils (if you had the choice of a punch in the face or a slap on the wrist, why would you abstain from the decision?).
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:04am
  - Tony Stuart
    
    I concur. NC supporters need to be aware of the consequences of their vote, should the NC’s fail to reach 5%. It plays right into Labour’s hands, and could be the difference between the Greens missing out or surviving. DO NC voters REALLY want a hardcore socialist like Ricardo March-Menendez becoming a Green MP?
    
    Please consider party-voting National or Act, even if you have to stick a clothespeg over your nose. If ever there was an election where tactical voting was needed, it’s this one.
    
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    October 12, 2020 9:37am
    - Critical Thinker
      
      I will consider it.
      
      Definitely won’t be voting ACT ever again while Seymour is leading it though.
      
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      October 12, 2020 12:58pm
      - Libertarians are right
        
        Fair enough. ACT isn’t for you as a party to be fair. It’s a libertarian party which is socially liberal.
        
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        October 12, 2020 2:43pm
  - Bobba Fret
    
    The only option IMO to change government is a party vote for either National or Act. Anything else is wasted.
    
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    October 12, 2020 11:06am
    - Tony Stuart
      
      I absolutely agree
      
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      October 12, 2020 11:10am
- Martin Williams
  
  But…but…but, the largest party!
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:09am
  - Libertarians are right
    
    The obvious difference is that the party that makes the Government in this scenario (ACT) only has one partner (National), whereas NZ First not only had the ability to go either way, but the majority of their voters wanted them to go with National and he gave their support to Labour instead.
    That’s a very big difference.
    
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    October 12, 2020 9:58am
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    Made no difference who the largest party was last time.
    
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    October 12, 2020 10:10am
- RJ
  
  I believe national are higher, nearer the 40s
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:37am
- Bob
  
  Quite possible Captain, in the present climate.
  
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  October 12, 2020 10:15am
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  If this happens, I will become a Maori.
  
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  October 12, 2020 10:58am
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  Election might shift another 1-2 points left=>right, but not more. 45-46 Labour 5-6 Green, 34National 8 Act. It’s definitely going to be a Labour govt, with only realistic hope being Greens miss 5%.
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2020_New_Zealand_general_election
  
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  October 12, 2020 11:15am
- Isobar
  
  So you’re predicting (hoping for) a COL 2.0
  
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  October 12, 2020 12:05pm
- AlphaWhiskey
  
  My favourite fantasy (one of them anyway) is that Labour gains the most seats but gets beaten out by a coalition of Nat/ACT – ie the reverse of last election’s bs result.
  
  Watch Labour cry that they should have got first right to retain the Treasury benches..
  
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  October 12, 2020 1:56pm
Yvette

TVNZ website news shows Maramara Davidson with headline “New poll shows race for Tāmaki Makaurau electorate is close” and just below: there’s another photo of Davidson, headlined “Green co-leader at Ihumatao” but this time she features a chin moko.
Why? While I understand the mana attached to an actual moko, is this one painted on and what is its significance in the context of Ihumatao.
Is it the equivalent to a hijab?

Just wondering while I eat my breakfast Something Pops

https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news under heading “Politics”
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October 12, 2020 8:28am
- Flossie
  
  I don’t know what it is about that woman but I find her Likeability factor to be around minus 40.
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:47am
  - alloytoo
    
    I think you’re too easy to please 🙂
    
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    October 12, 2020 12:20pm
- backster
  
  Makes me wonder if Nanaia’s one is also a paint on?.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:02am
  - sooty
    
    What is it with woman pollies,
    A decal on the chin,
    Half pound engraved dangly thing around neck,
    
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    October 12, 2020 9:32am
    - Observer of Life
      
      Sooty: Lol
      
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      October 12, 2020 2:03pm
    - Unity
      
      Sadly it makes them look very aggressive!! Certainly very unattractive.
      
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      October 12, 2020 4:56pm
  - KevO'Brien
    
    I believe Nanaia’s moko is proper signifying her status as a possible successor to the Maori King.
    
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    October 12, 2020 9:37am
    - kowtow
      
      Weird , the party of “equality” but such devotion to age old feudal values…….
      
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      October 12, 2020 9:57am
      - KevO'Brien
        
        This chiefly respect is throughout Polynesia. It doesn’t embody equality at all. Power is ceded to the chiefs along with rights over lands and resources which are kept for the benefit of those under the chiefly control. This in Samoa, is known as the Samoan Way (faaSamoa) and works well in that society. Everyone has a place and an assurance of support. Court fines for example may be paid by the Chief levying his group for a contribution.
        
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        October 12, 2020 11:09am
      - Unity
        
        I believe that you had to be the equivalent of royalty to have a chin tattoo back in the day, but I might be wrong. I understand the general hoi polloi weren’t entitled to one. It’s amazing that they actually want to regress back to the Stone Age.
        
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        October 12, 2020 4:58pm
- Swifty
  
  WTF? She painted it on? A temporary one?
  
  Who does that?
  
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  October 12, 2020 10:11am
  - leftard
    
    And when we paint our face the same its outrage
    
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    October 12, 2020 10:44am
- Gazza the Giant
  
  Internal polls already have Labour below 45% in both major parties polls
  
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  October 12, 2020 5:20pm
- Gazza the Giant
  
  The fact that only certain Maori woman are allowed to wear moko, i would say a painted one is a no no
  
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  October 12, 2020 5:22pm
I remember when

Let’s Keep Moving – and stop complaining about having to -accommodation is short.
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October 12, 2020 8:32am
Simon

Grant Batty vs 1977 Lions.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SGLn5UF3SxU

Note well how to cross the line. Batty didnt perform a triple chart wheel before dotting down.

Basically at this point marketing are calling the shots for the All Black selection.
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October 12, 2020 8:33am
- fernglas
  
  Were the fields bigger then, or the players much smaller?
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:18am
greybeard

I see that the All Blacks have developed a new move they have called “the Rieko”.

It involves a Hollywood dive to please the cameras but does not actually involve the ball being grounded to score.

Quite spectacular, and the opposition LOVES it.
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October 12, 2020 8:35am
Maggie Pie

Unfortunately, haven’t been able to find any Vomiting GIF’s 😀

https://twitter.com/sm_helliwell/status/1315153270755618820
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October 12, 2020 8:36am
- leftard
  
  The cow in the picture will hate her and Jacinda will destroy the dairy industry.
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:50am
- Spam
  
  Digging through, naturally the “international journalist” is actually a New Zealander, but hey, shows that clearly international media LOVE Jacinda!
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:16am
  - sooty
    
    Singapore Karen.
    
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    October 12, 2020 9:35am
  - Unity
    
    It makes you wonder about their cognitive faculties.
    
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    October 12, 2020 5:00pm
Tom Barker

Trump’s personal physician gives a new depth of meaning to the term ‘spin doctor.’
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October 12, 2020 8:37am
Paulus

Isn’t it a little too late to prognosticate the result of the Election as over 60% have already voted so done deed – God Help New Zealand now !
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October 12, 2020 8:38am
- Bobba Fret
  
  I actually know a lot of people who are definitely going to vote against this government that have voted early, myself included. Normally I would have thought that Labour trying to get people to vote ASAP before more bad news comes, also only delaying the election by the minimum time (election IMO should be mid November). So I originally thought early voting favours Labour but now I’m not so sure.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:45am
  - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
    
    Early voting favours Labour. An informal chat by my spies with people coming after early voting indicates that eight out of ten people have voted Labour. I wouldn’t be surprised if the whole country is pained red on election night. I understand next TV3 poll will show Labour at 55% and National at 25%
    
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    October 12, 2020 11:01am
    - Captain Mainwaring
      
      I understand SCS is seriously deluded or is taking the piss.
      
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      October 12, 2020 1:26pm
      - Sir Cullen's Sidekick
        
        As long as you are confused Captain, that helps the Greens.
        
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        October 12, 2020 8:03pm
    - Engelbert Humperdink
      
      I haven’t voted yet because I have a paying job with long hours. I will be voting, on the weekend.
      
      I believe Greens and Labour voters are much less likely to be working to earn, during the weekdays.
      
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      October 12, 2020 3:51pm
  - Libertarians are right
    
    I think early voting just locks in the people that have a clear choice – AKA the people that were never going to change their minds anyway.
    
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    October 12, 2020 2:45pm
Tony Stuart

Who was the female journalist who loudly called out “I love you!” as Jacinda Ardern closed off her presser in Wellington yesterday afternoon.

The answer is important, because it means that everything this woman has written or broadcast must now be viewed through a fangirl lens.
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October 12, 2020 8:39am
- Maggie Pie
  
  Sounds like the sort of thing Ali Mau might call out?
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:44am
- Prince
  
  That narrows it down to a dozen or so.
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:49am
- Libertarians are right
  
  Jessica Mutch McKay was just calling out to her husband next to Jacinda?
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:05am
- RJ
  
  John Campbell ???
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:40am
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  Could be Toxic Tova or Jessica Not So Much McKay.
  
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  October 12, 2020 11:01am
JJ56

Hardly dare draw attention to it, but lovely puff piece on CNN this morning https://edition.cnn.com/2020/10/10/asia/jacinda-ardern-new-zealand-election-intl-hnk-dst/index.html, I await the Collins’ one in the interests of balance.
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October 12, 2020 8:43am
lifesgood

I couldn’t believe my ears. Newstalk ZB news this morning bulletin stated that National is fighting for survival and in danger of having a humiliating loss. Wtf?
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October 12, 2020 8:44am
- Inandout
  
  life, how else do you think Jacinda consented to be chatted to by Mike? Back scratching.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:12am
  - lifesgood
    
    Yeah, In-and-out. He treated her with kid gloves, I noticed. Hope he’s as kind to Judith. It was a pretty disappointing effort this morning, I thought. I get it, he was trying to be balanced, but he really didn’t call her to account.
    
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    October 12, 2020 9:45am
    - Martin Williams
      
      Judith had her turn. Phoned it in and was late.
      
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      October 12, 2020 10:50am
    - Scooter
      
      Maybe he was a little star struck by her being there in person. Should Kate Hawesby be worried?
      
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      October 13, 2020 12:28am
- Swifty
  
  “Fighting for survival?” – what they are in danger of being voted out of parliament altogether? You mean like Peters and his bunch?
  
  FFS.
  
  National’s polling is little different to Labour’s during the Key/English years. Was Labour ‘fighting for survival’ then too?
  
  What rubbish.
  
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  October 12, 2020 10:04am
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  Yup, internal polls suggest that National is looking far worse than 2002.
  
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  October 12, 2020 11:02am
  - lifesgood
    
    You mean the internal Labour caucus polls, don’t you?
    
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    October 12, 2020 2:11pm
  - Engelbert Humperdink
    
    That’s a long way up with the colonoscope…
    
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    October 12, 2020 3:52pm
Tony Stuart

Just a thought on yesterday’s rugby; two times when the All Blacks should have taken a dropkick to win a match but didn’t (Cardiff 2007 and Wellington 2020) both took place under a Labour government. And in the first instance, Labour lost the next election!
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October 12, 2020 8:46am
- Maggie Pie
  
  I know nuffing about rugby, but i see where my partnerTweeted last night….”would never have happened under Shag”
  
  Just saying.
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:53am
  - MCos
    
    Was that the bloke who was coach in Japan?
    
    One thing the ABs have in common with the Nats.
    Lose, or in this case draw, is unacceptable.
    If either lose next weekend Judith Collins will be gone and there will be a lot of muttering about Ian Foster. At least the latter has some more chances, but the Razor will be sharpening.
    
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    October 12, 2020 9:30am
  - Bobba Fret
    
    Unfortunately things didn’t go too well v England in the world cup in Japan under Shag.
    
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    October 12, 2020 10:43am
- Hard Cheese
  
  There are a lot of dropkicks in the Labour party
  
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  October 12, 2020 10:15am
- mikenmildagain
  
  Sure, Tony. This would make a great DPF blog post correlating RWC performances with the government:
  1987: Labour – win
  1991: National – lose
  1995: National – lose
  1999: National – lose
  2003: Labour – lose
  2007: Labour – lose
  2011: National – win
  2015: National – win
  Conclusion – the All Blacks are twice as likely to with the world cup if there is a National government.
  
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  October 12, 2020 11:28am
leftard

Ouch I just seen a clip of Judiths response when shown Davids tweet.
She not happy, a big please explain is on the way. I wonder how many voters that tweet demoralised and put off voting National or even put off voting altogether, I know it was a mistake and taken out of context but dang this is the most damage inflicted on National since Todd Muller, National/ACT 100% confirmed their loss now 🙁
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October 12, 2020 8:57am
- rangitoto
  
  “I wonder how many voters that tweet demoralised and put off voting National or even put off voting altogether.”
  
  None.
  
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  October 12, 2020 10:57am
  - leftard
    
    I think youd be suprised, and with 6pm news and breakfast news informing the sheeple that Nationals polling guy says labour has it in the bag its a lost cause.
    
    Mr Farrar is now an assest to Labour, same league as Twyford is for National. Lets keep moving
    
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    October 12, 2020 11:52am
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  That f**king tweet was so unnecessary.
  
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  October 12, 2020 11:03am
  - the deity formerly known as nigel6888
    
    Only idiots hang out on twitter.
    
    One smart-arsed tweet, and you become the news story.
    
    Just walk away from twitter, its a nasty medium.
    
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    October 12, 2020 11:27am
- Libertarians are right
  
  There are a large number of centrist voters who may be looking at the fact that Labour will only be able to govern with the Greens, balk, and move back to National. This may actually help National.
  It also lines up with National attacking the Greens’ policies.
  
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  October 12, 2020 1:02pm
I remember when

So what do we now know about covid-19.
It has largely closed down travel between countries worldwide.
This is the first time any disease has had this result.
There is still considerable debate about whether masks are helpful or not.
There is not yet, after eight months, a vaccine.
Apart from lockdown nobody seems (well maybe Sweden) to have a set of rules for ongoing behaviour.
It has decimated the tourist trade worldwide and scenic cruises.
There do not seem to be many facts about preventive measures to help those wishing to take appropriate precautions.
Any plans, regarding trade and retail actions in the event of another wave, seem to be unformed or secret.
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October 12, 2020 8:58am
- Engelbert Humperdink
  
  We do know is it the perfect cover for a myriad of socialist wet dreams
  just a few…
  – exert control over individual as well as group meeting and movements
  – cherrypick industries and professions and trades and corporations to boost or kill
  – have a Two Minute Hate on the Victim of the Day (anti-masker, anti-vaxxer, anti-Arderner, whoever)
  – give more money to favored races because you just can
  – take away money from disfavored races again because you can
  – reward the Rich ‘n’ Shameless wealthy types with easy entry while everyone else can FIFO
  – cripple a city’s, region’s or country’s economy for no provable / justified reason – and then do it all again because you can; even when real life shows areas locked down fared no better and sometimes worse than areas not locked down
  – please your ChiCom masters and keep those lovely renminbi flowing into your own and your Party’s accounts
  – have the deplorable tax suckers fund your re-election campaign by taking even more of their money and paying the Tovoid TongueBath Brigades their presstitute’s price
  … there are oh, so many more…
  
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  October 12, 2020 11:56am
I remember when

Yes the CNN article made me think about Eva Peron.
How did that work out for the Argentinians?
Still it was great for them to have someone to take the worry out of the spiralling economy.
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October 12, 2020 9:07am
leftard

Having second thoughts about the way I voted yesterday.
I was always on the fence about euthanasia and probably really a No voter yet when it came time to tick the box I just couldnt do it, literaly got the shakes and a twisted up gut about it and couldnt tick yes or no so I left the box blank.

Wish I had of ticked one now, aw well too late we will know in a week what the out result is.

Also had I known the great damage inflicted to National yesterday instead of voting ACT I would have voted Labour to keep the Greens out or NZPP as a f**k the govt vote.

1st and only time ill ever vote early as too much can change before election day, Yup I have voters regrett.
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October 12, 2020 9:11am
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  If you don’t have the courage of your convictions you shouldn’t have voted at all.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:21am
  - leftard
    
    Point taken, from here on out all my votes will be a f**k the govt one at least my concience will be at ease no matter the result.
    
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    October 12, 2020 9:50am
  - Martin Williams
    
    Put your glasses on, Cap’n. He didn’t vote, he left the box blank.
    
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    October 12, 2020 10:48am
- RJ
  
  Oh for goodness sake, voting labour does not keep the greens out, get it into your thick skulls if you are really national or act voters. Voting labour not only gives the Labour Party a bigger government but if greens get i. It gives them a huge majority. If you people think voting labour somehow keeps the greens out you are stupid
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:43am
  - Bobba Fret
    
    Well said RJ.
    
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    October 12, 2020 10:45am
  - leftard
    
    Im a leftard we live a life of perpetual stupidity 🙂
    
    Are you implying I should have just voted Greens because theyll get in anyway? Remember leftards are stupid and Jacinda is magnificent.
    
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    October 12, 2020 10:48am
- Bob
  
  Voting early is not a problem ‘leftard’ if you actually have read and understood the party policies, and vote for the policy, NOT THE PERSONALITY.
  
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  October 12, 2020 10:20am
  - leftard
    
    Leaving voting until the day gives a chance to be exposed to any “unfortunate events” in the final days.
    
    Imagine the horror for early Cindy voters if she was killed in a crash today and they elected Kelvin Davis with a Twyford deputy.
    
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    October 12, 2020 11:59am
    - AlphaWhiskey
      
      I guess that that is a reason to not vote for Labour at all…
      
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      October 12, 2020 3:54pm
- Bobba Fret
  
  So you actually voted Act? Good on you. But it is scary that an informed voter like yourself would even think of voting Labour to keep the Greens out! That ain’t going to work.
  
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  October 12, 2020 10:49am
- The Boss
  
  Voting Labour to keep Greens out is both crazy and stupid. Let Labour/Greens govern jointly, it will ensure a landslide for NAT/ACT in 2023.
  
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  October 12, 2020 11:24am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  You have disrupted the euthanasia vote by 0.00003%.
  
  I’m sure you can rest easy by leaving the decision in the hands of your fellow NZers.
  
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  October 12, 2020 2:27pm
Sacha

Listening to the Hosking gabble with the PM this morning I suddenly realised that they make a great pair.
He likes short snappy questions, and she has mastered the art of KISS (never, ever, pad with detail in your answers).
Between the pair of them we learn nothing.
Was it my imagination or were there fewer ads in the ad breaks?
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October 12, 2020 9:17am
- lifesgood
  
  Big disappointment from Hosking.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:48am
- leftard
  
  Hosking just made himself look like a keyboard warrior, all tough and troll like when he can hide behind a screen/ microphone but face to face hes kindy teachers pet.
  
  Weak and spineless
  
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  October 12, 2020 10:50am
  - mikenmildagain
    
    Really? Did he ever strike anyone as the guy to ask tough questions?
    
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    October 12, 2020 11:23am
  - Scooter
    
    He was star struck
    
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    October 13, 2020 1:07am
Captain Mainwaring

So Luxon is not ruling out a leadership bid for National.
Message to Luxon: You will need to grow your hair back because at the moment you look far too much like the hapless Todd Muller.
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October 12, 2020 9:18am
- KevO'Brien
  
  Standby for more Labour rubbish this week. The operate at the snake in the grass level and believe everyone else does the same as them.
  Truth is irrelevant, it’s the apparent result that count. Presenting matters as coming from an opponent is normal. I doubt Luxton would have said a word. He probably does have aspirations for the future, and should have. That is likely to make him a firm helper for Judith.
  Don’t expect the truth from media this week. The have bile and bilge to deliver while the show pony goes to the knackers.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:49am
  - Bobba Fret
    
    The left including the media are already gunning for Judith. only last week I read somewhere that Shane Reti according to them would like to be leader! They are just doing their dirty politics.
    
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    October 12, 2020 10:51am
    - Isobar
      
      Shane would make a fine leader tbh, he has really impressed so far. Its a shame they kept him on the bench for so long.
      
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      October 12, 2020 12:12pm
    - Paulus
      
      I do wish Judith would get rid of that stupid cap though so we can see her, and not the cap !
      
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      October 12, 2020 2:01pm
- leftard
  
  Hes more repulsive then Muller, If Luxon became leader its safe to say that National would become a minor party and ACT/NC would rise.
  
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  October 12, 2020 10:53am
  - Isobar
    
    I think if Luxon was the leader the Nats / ACT would just end up fighting for a ever smaller piece of the pie.
    
    As much as Act voters dont like this, the centre is ever elections are won and lost and if the Nats move the right, they will simply lose the key swing voters – some possibly forever.
    
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    October 12, 2020 12:14pm
- Observer of Life
  
  Why do people think Luxon is the saviour?? So, he was the CEO of Air NZ. He wasn’t that bloody flash tbh. He acted like a lone Brierly – slash and burn. Will he cope with the media hounds .. IMHO NO!
  
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  October 12, 2020 2:15pm
Maggie Pie

I’d forgotten Jacinda was on ZB this morning.
My partner obviously listened in his hotel room.
He txt…..”what a soft-cock that Hosking is when its face to face”
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October 12, 2020 9:23am
- Martin Williams
  
  Good move being in studio. Hoskings would have appreciated this. The same interview with Collins last week, she phoned it in (despite being in Auckland) and was late!
  
  Sums up Judith’s campaign really.
  
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  October 12, 2020 10:46am
- Fletch
  
  I thought he was unusually restrained. Perhaps it was a condition of her appearing that he tone it down.
  
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  October 12, 2020 11:16am
Tauhei Notts

It has been said that patriotism is the refuge of the scoundrel; and to that could be added that psephology is the refuge of the train spotter.
All this early voting will destroy one of my hobbies. A hobby where I analyse the booth by booth figures in an election for several electorates. With the huge early voting such analysis will be meaningless.
A plus is that with the counting of the early votes we should know by 7.20 p.m. on election night what the result is.
Another worry for me is that all this early voting removes one safeguard in our voting system; that of the scrutineer. Yeah, been there, done that, bought the tee shirt; I have been a scrutineer on several occasions and it is soul destroying boredom. I recall one year when the school teacher polling booth chief insisted that the results not be released from that booth until the referenda had been counted and the tables put away and the school hall swept and everybody had finished their cup of tea. It had to be a school teacher. Keep Joe Public waiting while we indulge ourselves. With all this early voting, staff numbers for election day can be reduced. I have a lazy Lord Rutherford that I will wager that the bureaucracy will do no such thing.
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October 12, 2020 9:23am
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  Cheer Up..
  
  Oct 17th is Caulfield Cup day….
  Have fun analysing the field.
  
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  October 12, 2020 2:35pm
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    And the big event for the weekend is Bathurst.
    
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    October 12, 2020 3:53pm
    - Tauhei Notts
      
      But I will be out of town, damn it. My rugby club is showing Bathurst; then on to Eden Park for The Test; then back for the closing laps at Mount Panorama. All with draught beer chilled to my liking.
      
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      October 12, 2020 10:01pm
  - andydownhere
    
    Just having an English Derby winner in the field is sensational. You would have been thrown in the loony bin for even suggesting it would be possible a few years ago.
    
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    October 12, 2020 10:46pm
Lance

So Cindy said on Hosking this morning stated that the rise in gang numbers will all be fixed when there is no poverty, nothing else needs to be done.

This is like a bad parody of the Monty Python sketch where the instructions on how to become a world class Flutist is to blow in one end and move your fingers up and down the outside.
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October 12, 2020 9:25am
- Swifty
  
  Ardern is lying to herself and us if she genuinely thinks that.
  
  It demonstrates that she has no clue as to the modern drivers of gang membership.
  
  Her thinking is outdated and I bet she had purely young Maori in mind when she said that – and where again she’d be wrong as it’s a poverty of culture that drives much ethnic gang membership.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:59am
  - Harriet
    
    LOL –she is defiantly lying – as her father was a police commissioner — and there is no way in hell that he would ever say that gang membership is due to poverty.
    Most of the Hell’s Angels would be employed.
    And the Rebels actually prefer you to be employed. Most other gangs probably prefer you to work also.
    
    She thinks everyone is a member of the MMM! 😎
    
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    October 12, 2020 11:21am
    - Swifty
      
      Yep.
      
      Ever noticed a correlation between the rise in gang membership in NZ and the rise of the welfare state?
      
      Ever wondered if there’s a connection between the state paying couples to separate and the rise in gang membership?
      
      Ever wondered if there’s a connection between rising numbers of boys growing up without fathers and the rise in gang membership?
      
      Me too.
      
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      October 12, 2020 11:45am
- leftard
  
  To get rid of gangs we need to stop the decline of 2 parent households.
  
  A solo mother upbringing is the biggest driver for young males joining gangs. Infact its the main driver of many issues facing maori and even blacks worldwide.
  
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  October 12, 2020 10:57am
- mandk
  
  The gang problem would be easier to fix if so many Maori boys didn’t have to grow up in households without a Dad (or at least a stable male presence).
  
  But Ardern’s welfare reforms have made it more likely that Maori boys will have to suffer that fate.
  
  Celia Lashlie remarked that boys without a Dad are drawn to gangs, as if by a magnet. As a former prison officer, she knew.
  
  Celia died too soon.
  
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  October 12, 2020 11:39am
beadgame

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
Ridiculous how so many on this site denigrate Ardern for her aspirations for NZ with respect to social issues. These views do a great disservice to the National Party. At least John Key could acknowledge the importance of these aspirations:
“When Sir John Key knelt to receive his knighthood in mid-August, he reflected on what he had achieved as prime minister, while also regretting that he hadn’t solved child poverty and other social issues.
“Sir John says “No one wants to see children that are hungry or families without homes.”
“He believes that his government did make improvements but he says the issues are long-term: “You can’t click your fingers and achieve a solution to every problem.”
“Sir john says future governments will continue to work on pressing social problems.
https://cathnews.co.nz/2017/08/24/sir-john-key-child-poverty-regrets/
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October 12, 2020 9:28am
- Tall Man
  
  He tried, ardern hasn’t. There is a difference if you aren’t too tribal to look.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:52am
- Swifty
  
  “Ridiculous how so many on this site denigrate Ardern for her aspirations for NZ with respect to social issues. ”
  
  Not in the slightest bit ridiculous, for the simple fact that I/we judge politicians on their RESULTS, not on their lofty words.
  
  You beadgame may well vote according to which politician’s words make you feel all warm inside – but I think you’re making a mistake if you do so. It means you are a mere plaything of the next snake-oil merchant that comes along.
  
  Voting for who promises the most is one of the biggest mistakes we make as citizens.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:53am
- KevO'Brien
  
  Aspirations can only belong to those who could actually deliver. A PM selected by Winston should retire along with him. She’s a constitutional disaster and her continuance will beggar NZ.
  We cannot afford Amateur Govt. (That include Poohbah.)
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:53am
- RJ
  
  Aspirations, you mean like increasing those in child poverty increasing, those one emergency housing lists. This is our first prime minister to fail on all her campaign promises form last election and who is leaving the country even before covid in one hell of a mess. Worse than the mess Clark left it in, and worse than the mess Lange left it in. Aspirations don’t help those suffering in pain because the Points for surgery have gone up under her. Aspirations, You mean lies, bullshit, incompetence and corruption.
  
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  October 12, 2020 9:58am
- Libertarians are right
  
  We denigrate her because she only has aspirations. She has neither reasonable policy to achieve her aspirations or reasonable measurements to ensure her aspirations are met.
  It’s all talk to ensure votes while the reality is that she’s making those lives worse.
  That’s why we denigrate her.
  
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  October 12, 2020 10:01am
  - Swifty
    
    Very well put.
    
    11 1
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    October 12, 2020 10:59am
- Lance
  
  That is like a beauty queen wanting “world peace”.
  
  You see to PAY for improved hospitals, school resources et al WE have to earn money.
  So when we see economy killing policies being implemented we are deeply skeptical of Labour ‘asperations’.
  And don’t get us started on the utter incompetence of the Labour ministers.
  
  19 1
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  October 12, 2020 10:14am
- Critical Thinker
  
  There is no such thing as “Child poverty”.
  
  https://www.pressreader.com/new-zealand/the-dominion-post/20190615/282333976420393
  
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  October 12, 2020 1:12pm
MCos

We have some pretty senseless road accidents in NZ, but nothing on this scale for loss of life from sheer incompetence.
There is a video of this accident in the comments.
https://forum.thaivisa.com/topic/1186938-20-killed-after-train-collides-with-bus-in-thailand/?utm_source=newsletter-20201011-1241&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=news
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October 12, 2020 9:50am
I remember when

Seafood NZ October 2020: Dr Jeremy Helson CEO
“The latest sustainability review by MPI is a ringing endorsement for the Quota Management System (QMS). Leaving aside frostfish (changed for administrative reasons), Fisheries Minister uart Nash announced catch increases for 24 of 25 stocks assessed, with only Southland Blue Cod catch decreased.
The Industry is constantly accused of recklessly depleting fish stock hat science demonstrates we are not. New Zealand’s fish stocks are managed in a way that is the envy of the world.
Even when not told to decrease catch, the Industry, as with ECNI rock lobster and West Coast hoki , voluntarily reduces the catch.
5 2
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October 12, 2020 9:52am
RJ

Ummm, whose breast is Biden trying?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tC9UwAoOPLs&feature=emb_logo
4 1
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October 12, 2020 9:54am
- RJ
  
  So what is the min wage going to be
  
  https://twitter.com/RightlyNews/status/1314697697711063044
  
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  October 12, 2020 10:35am
I remember when

Rich Prick 9.12 am
Perhaps she is behind with the rent!
2 0
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October 12, 2020 9:59am
big bruv

A compliant referee, a home crowd, touch judges who are clearly blind yet even then the NZ rugby team failed to beat Australia. I laughed a lot.
8 10
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October 12, 2020 10:15am
- mikenmildagain
  
  What a miserable so and so.
  
  9 9
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  October 12, 2020 11:21am
- leftard
  
  Ive never seen the point of grown men running around grabbing each other, Pink boots etc just reinforce my thoughts of the “game”
  
  5 8
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  October 12, 2020 12:13pm
Bobba Fret

I genuinely believe Jacinda will not be PM in 3 years time. I reckon she has already talked with Robertson and has said she will stay until after the election but will be moving on sometime in the next term and handing it over to him. (Well she could hardly hand it over to Kelvin could she).
19 2
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October 12, 2020 11:12am
- Bob
  
  Hopefully not PM in 10 days time
  
  14 1
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  October 12, 2020 1:49pm
Maggie Pie

PAUL: “Guys – any idea how to end Hey Jude?”

GEORGE: “Nah”

JOHN: “Nah”

RINGO: “Nah”
38 4
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October 12, 2020 11:16am
- Engelbert Humperdink
  
  What humorless soul downticked this classic from Maggie? Shame on you, sirrah!
  
  18 2
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  October 12, 2020 11:48am
  - Biscuit
    
    Agreed, Engelbert.
    
    But let’s give the sad sap something ELSE to downtick, heh heh.
    
    Call it Community Service on my behalf!
    
    This first appeared after the Dakota shooting way, way back in December 1980:
    
    John Lennon is at the Pearly Gates…
    St. Peter looks at him and says ‘I know you, don’t I?’
    Lennon shrugs and says ‘It’s possible, yes.’
    St. Peter nods and asks where he would know him from.
    Lennon drawls ‘Well, I used to be in a band, you know?’
    St. Peter asks the name of the band and Lennon replies ‘It was a little beat combo called ‘The Beatles.”
    ‘Of course!’ exclaims St. Peter. ‘You’re John Lennon, aren’t you? You’re brilliant, you are. Can I have your autograph?’
    ‘F*ck off,’ says Lennon. ‘I’m not falling for THAT one again…’
    
    15 2
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    October 12, 2020 1:18pm
- Fletch
  
  Notwithstanding the joke, the end did drag on long enough (it was a fade out wasn’t it?)
  
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  October 12, 2020 3:05pm
mandk

This is interesting: https://www.stats.govt.nz/news/monthly-migration-remains-low

Key points:
1. Net migration since March has been about 300 per month
2. 98% of the last 12 months’ migration was before lockdown.
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October 12, 2020 11:24am
Maggie Pie

Youse guys should have a cigar to celebrate 😛

https://twitter.com/BillClinton/status/1315286055696969731
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October 12, 2020 11:50am
rouppe

A piece in Stuff about Trump that uses the word pathology or pathological 12 times.

Nicely balanced, huh?
2 2
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October 12, 2020 11:55am
Maggie Pie

My partner reckons the Greens have a death wish. LOL

https://twitter.com/nzherald/status/1315425213627146241
5 1
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October 12, 2020 12:50pm
- mandk
  
  The Greens really are complete numpties, who deserve to be consigned to the rubbish heap.
  
  They are so dumb, they even surrendered any political leverage they might have by broadcasting the fact that they would not consider working with any party other than Labour.
  
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  October 12, 2020 1:34pm
I remember when

If the words pathology or pathological were used 12 times – I guess you would have to say it as evenly balanced.
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October 12, 2020 12:54pm
I remember when

How many people who have voted early will be dead on Polling Day?
6 1
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October 12, 2020 2:18pm
- Spring Bank Westie
  
  80,000
  
  You’re welcome, Shaun Hendy
  
  10 1
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  October 12, 2020 3:25pm
- Sir Cullen's Sidekick
  
  None of the Labour/Green voters.
  
  5 2
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  October 12, 2020 3:36pm
- kowtow
  
  ‘suppose it’s better than Dem voters who are dead but do vote early …..
  
  3 0
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  October 12, 2020 4:33pm
- mikenmildagain
  
  People who die before polling day have their votes removed from the count.
  
  4 1
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  October 12, 2020 4:44pm
RJ

Hmmm, so in August funding was given for shovel-ready climate resilience and flood protection projects. Now I’ve are in a campaign, funding has been given for. Covid-recovery funding for the Rangitata.

Flood recovery funds for Rangitata River

Covid-recovery funding for Rangitata River restoration

Wonder if it is just the same funding rebranded.
9 2
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October 12, 2020 2:18pm
Maggie Pie

A girl in the know at tennis (she drives a Bentley convertible) was telling us that Nestle have made the decision to get rid of the ‘culturally offensive and derogatory name’……. Eskimo Pie.

From early next year, they will be known as ‘Edy’s Pies’

(I shit you not)
4 2
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October 12, 2020 3:55pm
- RJ
  
  Yeah everyone who read the news story about it is in the know
  
  2 2
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  October 12, 2020 4:27pm
  - Maggie Pie
    
    So what are you driving these days RJ?
    
    2 1
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    October 12, 2020 6:44pm
mikenmildagain

I think we can readily agree that the girl with the Bentley knows more than the other tennis ladies.
6 1
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October 12, 2020 4:43pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Signs that Trump will not win on Nov 3rd.
https://townhall.com/columnists/kevinmccullough/2020/10/11/signs-that-trump-isnt-going-to-win-on-nov-3-n2577841?
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October 12, 2020 5:59pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Oh look,

A senior World Health Organization (WHO) official has condemned the use of lockdowns to restrict the spread of COVID-19.

but one of the country’s foremost COVID-19 experts,
knows more than a WHO Covid-19 expert…

and of course, detail doesn’t matter…
she hasn’t read Dr Nabarro’s comments in full, she doesn’t believe they necessarily apply to New Zealand.

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2020/10/covid-19-who-official-s-lockdown-criticism-probably-doesn-t-apply-to-new-zealand-dr-siouxsie-wiles.html
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October 12, 2020 6:13pm
- Steve Otto(North Shore)
  
  Picking on her coz she has ‘look at me’ pink hair. That does not mean she is a Jacinda sycophant does it? ………
  
  5 2
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  October 12, 2020 6:49pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    I couldn’t give a toss about the colour of folks’ hair…
    it’s Siouxsie Wiles’ failure to address the substance of Dr Nabarro’s contention that Lockdowns have major consequences for poor people.
    
    Wiles contends that Nabarro’s view probably doesn’t apply to NZ, but yesterday Prof Michael Baker revealed that the incidence of Rheumatic Fever had increased during Lockdown.
    
    He said that during the lockdown, a rise in rheumatic fever cases was observed – and this was likely due to people stay home, often in overcrowded homes which increased their risk. This may have also been affected by less access to routine healthcare for throat swabbing and treatment.
    
    Rheumatic fever isn’t an illness of the well-off.
    
    https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/sunday/audio/2018767843/near-extinction-of-influenza-in-nz-as-numbers-drop-due-to-lockdown
    
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    October 12, 2020 6:59pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Trump is about to test positive for a second time., on Nov 3rd
8 2
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October 12, 2020 6:13pm
Steve Otto(North Shore)

Clint Eastwood – 2012?. Good speech but 4 years early. “you can’t do that to yourself” If only NZ had a film star that was not leftist.
‘Make my day’ Well we sure as fuck have many empty chairs with Govt failures. Jaspinda, ‘make my day’
Watch blood pressure lefties.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=933hKyKNPFQ&ab_channel=ABCNews&fbclid=IwAR3eqonWwbSSCTiRRgXhufQE_AhjXerEpH3-cHrb3n6UGdSuWRaHijEXcs8
6 2
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October 12, 2020 6:37pm
Don Beckett

This is incredible. Check out this HUGE black dude & his partner – all in for Trump.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1juezBEqbs
5 2
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October 12, 2020 7:48pm
Fletch

The Guardian (presumably the NZ version) has “12 experts” grade Jacinda on her govt of the last 3 years. I don’t know what country they are supposed to be in, but I certainly think the A’s B’s and C’s are totally incorrect. Not a D or F in sight.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/oct/12/report-card-jacinda-arderns-government-graded-on-the-past-three-years
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October 12, 2020 8:28pm
- marcw
  
  OMG from their “expert”: Housing – Shamubeel Eaqub.
  
  – Housing affordability worsened
  – some long-term things, like building more state houses and delivering reforms on rental rules
  – some ineffective things like a ban on foreign buyers
  – an F for their failure to implement their flagship KiwiBuild policy
  An overall grade of B (“but it’s pulled up to a B by really great stuff in the long-term policy”)
  
  This is their same long-term policy of Kiwibuild for which he just gave a F mark.
  
  One eyed?
  
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  October 12, 2020 8:41pm
  - sooty
    
    Hey, Twitford, that worked well!
    Watch you gunna do next!
    
    3 0
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    October 12, 2020 9:02pm

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